Lots of people are selling!

[LawrenceChard]

19 hours ago, Paul said:

Average Joe lists a coin here, he would like to part with and it's on page 5 unsold and invisible before 24 hours is out and on page 20 once the bump brigade are out  sorry to moan, but trading here is not a bit what it used to be 

Neither is nostalgia!

😎

[dicker]

This risks being a very controversial topic and I’m not here for silly arguments but to collaborate, share and occasionally buy.

I don’t think people who are buying and selling in “bulk” know that they are sometimes (rarely) selling coins that I will generously call “dubious”. 

I reported one coin that I thought was highly dubious but it remained for sale subsequently sold according to the listing.  I won’t quote the listing but am happy to do so privately.  

Equally I have PM’d someone selling a Sov in a small batch that was to my eye not correct and he/she removed it for sale before having someone have a proper look at it. 

Personally, I know what I am buying so it’s not a problem but folk new to the forum may not.  How to manage this out is the conundrum.

Best

Dicker

[scotwasp]

As one of the “new folk” this is certainly my big fear. I probably just wouldn’t buy from anyone that doesn’t have good positive feedback regardless of what they were selling and for how much.
I think that in this way the forum is probably pretty self policing for many of us. The chaps with experience will probably take less account of this as the know what to look out for, therefore weeding out any rascals. Then the newbies benefit by buying from the sellers with track record.  
Not foolproof but for me, so far, I have a fair bit of confidence that I have bought safely and have already recommended the forum to a friend. 
 

[James32]

1 minute ago, scotwasp said:

As one of the “new folk” this is certainly my big fear. I probably just wouldn’t buy from anyone that doesn’t have good positive feedback regardless of what they were selling and for how much.
I think that in this way the forum is probably pretty self policing for many of us. The chaps with experience will probably take less account of this as the know what to look out for, therefore weeding out any rascals. Then the newbies benefit by buying from the sellers with track record.  
Not foolproof but for me, so far, I have a fair bit of confidence that I have bought safely and have already recommended the forum to a friend. 
 

Yeah I'm certain you have bought safely 🤣

Doesn't hurt to be extra vigilant though,especially when starting out and ask as many questions as possible. 

 

[Abyss]

Regardless of the reason why there are many more sales thread I think I would be beneficial @ChrisSilver if the sales section was further split into

Gold - Graded

Gold - Ungraded

Silver - Graded

Silver - Ungraded

Potentially other splits (bars/coins). easier to buy/sell/find.

 

[James32]

23 minutes ago, Abyss said:

Regardless of the reason why there are many more sales thread I think I would be beneficial @ChrisSilver if the sales section was further split into

Gold - Graded

Gold - Ungraded

Silver - Graded

Silver - Ungraded

Potentially other splits (bars/coins). easier to buy/sell/find.

 

Like that idea a lot 👍

[Shep]

I think the sales thread generally works well due to its self policing nature, without overly restrictive rules or control from mods.

All it requires is a bit of common courtesy and recognition that it’s not a space solely for “dealers” to capitalise and use as their private source of daily income. 

No issue with people wanting to make money but if you have multiple similar items to list in a single day I.e. an amount of various gold coins, perhaps put them in a single listing and don’t stick the middle finger up by blasting other people’s items into the stratosphere and filling the front page with your items alone.

 

Edited February 4, 2022 by Shep
Whinge complete

[Spanishsilver]

1 hour ago, Abyss said:

Regardless of the reason why there are many more sales thread I think I would be beneficial @ChrisSilver if the sales section was further split into

Gold - Graded

Gold - Ungraded

Silver - Graded

Silver - Ungraded

Potentially other splits (bars/coins). easier to buy/sell/find.

 

I would also add poured silver as well in it’s own category 

[sovereignsteve]

12 hours ago, Darr3nG said:

Do you have examples of these obvious fakes? Happy to discuss in PM, as I understand we may not want to name and shame.

There was one fairly recently and if I'm not prepared to call it out in public, it's not fair to do so in private.

When it comes to sovereigns, it is usually quite difficult to spot good fakes. In fact I've bought a couple of fakes over the years that weren't obvious; it's a difficult area. I didn't have any problems getting refunded as the sellers were top class. Shows you what a minefield it is.

[sovereignsteve]

12 hours ago, ChrisSilver said:

Please can you show actual examples. Because TSF and it’s moderators take action against any such obvious posts as they would be reported by multiple members.

In general the community itself enforces the trade section, and I have seen many times where members post to look out for other members. TSF will also not remove any 'unsolicited posts' in someone's trade topic if the posts are genuine posts discussing the authenticity of an item, this is to protect members. We believe that it is good for members and sellers to discuss any potential issues openly and publicly.  Note that TSF itself can not validate the authenticity of any item for sale.

There is always some risk of trading which is why members must do their own research first as outlined in the risk of trading topic:

Thanks for pointing out the issue with "unsolicited posts" in these situations. I didn't think any posts casting aspersions on the validity of sales items would be allowed.

I am still reluctant to do so as generally it is extremely difficult to spot fakes on the basis of a photo which are usually of insufficient quality for the task.

I generally find that I am correct on my first impression of a coin even if I can't really put my finger on why I suspect it's authenticity. I don't think it fair to draw attention to these.

The very few I have been certain are fake, I considered messaging the seller, but decided against. Perhaps I should have.

I have been reluctant to getting into the realm of "policing" the sales threads as I'm not sure where it would lead. i will reconsider my position though.

I am strongly of the opinion that potential buyers should base their purchase decisions on the quality of the seller and their own knowledge and tests. Sadly this isn't foolproof and many problems will not be discovered until the coin is in hand. I have personally bought a couple of fakes off forum sales threads. The sellers were top quality and reimbursed with out any issues. They weren't aware of the situation.

 

[Roy]

I've reported dubious coins to @ChrisSilver and the moderator team before and the sales posts have been hidden pending the seller's response. The system works well.

Remember, the admin team are enthusiasts, not experts, as are the sellers. I'm sure there is no malice involved, it's easy to make mistakes.

It's how the mistakes are rectified that matters. As Steve said,

39 minutes ago, sovereignsteve said:

I didn't have any problems getting refunded as the sellers were top class.

That's what makes this forum the best.

 

As for the 'other' problem,

2 hours ago, Shep said:

it’s not a space solely for “dealers” to capitalise and use as their private source of daily income.

I completely agree, it's annoying. 

But wait...

Duncan is now a platinum business seller, his listings are comprehensive, well written, with great photos, specifications and reasonably priced. He's an asset to the forum as his many customers will testify.

Perhaps, and it's only a suggestion, he should have a dealer sub-forum or indeed become a forum sponsor? He needs his own space!

😊 👍

[Robda1986]

16 hours ago, Fishface220 said:

Reckon some would be cashing in their PM to jump onto the Crypto dip. 

Yea I tried crypto basically lost 90ish% but meh swings and roundabouts 

[Roy]

30 minutes ago, sovereignsteve said:

I have been reluctant to getting into the realm of "policing" the sales threads as I'm not sure where it would lead. i will reconsider my position though.

I'd support that, but I think you'd be making a rod for your own back.

[sovereignsteve]

11 minutes ago, Roy said:

I'd support that, but I think you'd be making a rod for your own back.

I didn't say I'd be changing my mind😁 I will think about what others have said though.

[MJCOIN]

6 hours ago, Roy said:

I've reported dubious coins to @ChrisSilver and the moderator team before and the sales posts have been hidden pending the seller's response. The system works well.

Remember, the admin team are enthusiasts, not experts, as are the sellers. I'm sure there is no malice involved, it's easy to make mistakes.

It's how the mistakes are rectified that matters. As Steve said,

That's what makes this forum the best.

 

As for the 'other' problem,

I completely agree, it's annoying. 

But wait...

Duncan is now a platinum business seller, his listings are comprehensive, well written, with great photos, specifications and reasonably priced. He's an asset to the forum as his many customers will testify.

Perhaps, and it's only a suggestion, he should have a dealer sub-forum or indeed become a forum sponsor? He needs his own space!

😊 👍

If it was possible to limit the number of items listed for to no more than 3 in (say) 4 hours that would avoid one member hogging the sale section. Same would apply to 'bumping'.

Just a thought.

[lst65]

You mean like when certain members post 15 separate for sale posts in the space of 10 mins? One after the other? Does seem excessive and essentially wipes out the posts of other members trying to sell at the same time….?

[GoldDiggerDave]

Bump, Bump, Bump, Bump, Bump, Bump, Bump, Bump, Bump, Bump, Bump, Bump.  Either I'm listing coins or I got lucky 

[lst65]

2 minutes ago, GoldDiggerDave said:

Bump, Bump, Bump, Bump, Bump, Bump, Bump, Bump, Bump, Bump, Bump, Bump.  Either I'm listing coins or I got lucky 

 Jump and bump.. 😂

[Stacktastic]

On 04/02/2022 at 11:48, ChrisSilver said:

TSF has rules against excessive bumping

As I am not buying at the moment, I had not noticed the increased dealer presence, but that explains why its got busier, despite the low spot prices thank you. 

Just a thought but is there a way to give them 2 or 3 bumps over a set period bit like Facebook marketplace advert renews?
Or to limit the posts depending on reputation & status on the forum??

I don't know if this is useful at all, but would separating private from dealer listings be an idea? 
Personally I prefer to buy from private collectors that have a good forum reputation, but I have bought off dealers too?

Edited February 5, 2022 by Stacktastic

[27carrots]

14 hours ago, Abyss said:

Regardless of the reason why there are many more sales thread I think I would be beneficial @ChrisSilver if the sales section was further split into

Gold - Graded

Gold - Ungraded

Silver - Graded

Silver - Ungraded

Potentially other splits (bars/coins). easier to buy/sell/find.

 

I don't agree with chopping up the sales sections at all.

Most items would never get looked at by casual/new buyers.

But having a keyword feature would work well.

The problem with the search feature is that people use different words to describe things quarter vs 1/4, etc or don't put the word silver or gold in their thread.

Give thread starters boxes they can tick so people can filter their search with one click.

Also if you ignore people's posts, their sales threads should be hidden as well.

[ChrisSilver]

18 hours ago, Abyss said:

Regardless of the reason why there are many more sales thread I think I would be beneficial @ChrisSilver if the sales section was further split into

Gold - Graded

Gold - Ungraded

Silver - Graded

Silver - Ungraded

Potentially other splits (bars/coins). easier to buy/sell/find.

 

This is something that has been discussed before. Without making this topic go off topic too much, and similar to how @27carrots has stated. TSF decided in the past not to split up the trade section further as it will make it harder to browse, twice the clicking to check both sections. I did and do however agree that some sort of tag/filter/attributes system with a filter would work very well, so it is easy to filter between gold/silver etc, or even coins/bars. The problem is that the core base of the system we are using uses the tag system for the prefixes, and there is no way to easily integrate an additional filter system at present. However it is something that I would like to introduce in the future if possible  

[dicker]

Too many sales is a “nice problem to have”.

Quite a few folk collect particular types of coins eg Sovereigns.  I currently flag all sales to be notified to me immediately and then use email rules to remove items that are not Sovs.  It’s not perfect as often people use titles like “Various Gold for Sale” a listing which might include a Sovereign.

An alert system by tag or category of coin would work really well.  It could be applied in each sub topic so that you could, for example get alerts for graded or non graded sovs.

Best

Dicker

[Heirlooms]

A couple of suggestions @ChrisSilver all be it simple ones would be to make the "latest listings" list longer. At the moment it only shows the last 15 so it can quickly disappear off the list if there's an influx of sale posts. My other suggestion would be to bring back the unread feature on this page so people can quickly see which posts they've looked at and which ones they haven't at a glance. It used to be a feature but I think it might have gone when the forum was upgraded

[Paul]

18 hours ago, Shep said:

I think the sales thread generally works well due to its self policing nature, without overly restrictive rules or control from mods.

All it requires is a bit of common courtesy and recognition that it’s not a space solely for “dealers” to capitalise and use as their private source of daily income. 

No issue with people wanting to make money but if you have multiple similar items to list in a single day I.e. an amount of various gold coins, perhaps put them in a single listing and don’t stick the middle finger up by blasting other people’s items into the stratosphere and filling the front page with your items alone.

 

This is my feeling entirely  @ChrisSilver  my promised PM to you was to be more or less what has @Shep has highlighted & explained very well  

How this can be done is the tricky part 

[richatthecroft]

I say get rid of the graded section and split the sales into three- Silver, Gold & Platinum. 

Better still 4 sections- Silver, Gold, Platinum and a Pre- Decimal or a Pre-1950’s of whichever metal.

It won’t happen but at least I tried to make a suggestion that makes sense, is coherent and that enables navigating the sales section simple, quick and easy. 

Edited February 5, 2022 by richatthecroft