Three graces coin

[sovtsf]

1 hour ago, westminstrel said:

Does PCGS have special labels or are there just those 90s style blue gradient ones? 

Edit: I found this: https://www.pcgs.com/labels

I would go standard myself unless you are sure you won’t need to sell and prefer a special. When people buy they want to match other coins. Personally I find special labels detract from the coin, and most of these new labels can look a bit tacky. 

[Fitness2all]

56 minutes ago, sovtsf said:

I would go standard myself unless you are sure you won’t need to sell and prefer a special. When people buy they want to match other coins. Personally I find special labels detract from the coin, and most of these new labels can look a bit tacky. 

Fair point. 

[westminstrel]

Very true. But I wasn’t really talking about all the jazzy labels. For example, NGC has a nice UK themed label for UK coins. It’s simple and classy.

[sovtsf]

28 minutes ago, westminstrel said:

Very true. But I wasn’t really talking about all the jazzy labels. For example, NGC has a nice UK themed label for UK coins. It’s simple and classy.

I guess it’s a subjective area and we all like different things but personally there isn’t any ngc U.K. labels that I prefer over the standard brown label, the less pictures the better is my preference. A key thing to consider is when buying other coins already graded they will be harder find to the same special label to match and when selling your market is smaller unless people price in the cost and hassle to change them, which is something I do. 

[Pete]

I spent about 45 minutes reading many of the posts on a topic that runs in to 75 pages !

My summary as follows ( please correct any errors )

1. The 3 Graces 2 oz silver proof went on sale February 21 or thereabouts at a Royal Mint price of £250- £255
Now that's £125 per ounce for £20 worth of silver so grossly overpriced but people historically will pay silly money for such issues, and the resale market will see value halved perhaps a year later when the novelty has worn off or small spots appear on the coin.

2. The mintage was circa 3,500 which is small compared to bullion but not so limited compared to other proof coins - silver and gold in the past.

3. Inventory was sold out in about 10 minutes

4. People are paying £2,500 or even more for this coin only 10-14 days after issue.

Can anyone explain the following please -

(a) why was the demand so high and what triggered the panic buying ?
(b) what was so special about this particular coin compared to any other nice designed coin ?
(c) why has the market value shot up 10 fold overnight ?
(d) if you have 1 will you try and sell it now to make £2,000 or more instant profit ?
(e) do you honestly believe, rather than hope, the coin will retain it's inflated value ?
(f) if you see milk spots appear in a year from now what do you reckon the percentage drop in price will be ?

I know when the first Britannia / Year of the Horse mule appeared, early sellers were able to capture almost £2,000 per coin for a coin that cost £20-25 or thereabouts.
Then the price fairly quickly dropped to £1,000 then steadily to £100 and today maybe as low as £50 or less.
The super inflated price vanished and those that paid over a grand must be royally piss*d.
Those that held on to their mules ( and I am one ) now regret not selling for £100 each but that seemed low at the time compared to only a few months earlier.
Will a similar pattern evolve with the Graces ?

[goldhunter]

8 minutes ago, Pete said:

I spent about 45 minutes reading many of the posts on a topic that runs in to 75 pages !

My summary as follows ( please correct any errors )

1. The 3 Graces 2 oz silver proof went on sale February 21 or thereabouts at a Royal Mint price of £250- £255
Now that's £125 per ounce for £20 worth of silver so grossly overpriced but people historically will pay silly money for such issues, and the resale market will see value halved perhaps a year later when the novelty has worn off or small spots appear on the coin.

2. The mintage was circa 3,500 which is small compared to bullion but not so limited compared to other proof coins - silver and gold in the past.

3. Inventory was sold out in about 10 minutes

4. People are paying £2,500 or even more for this coin only 10-14 days after issue.

Can anyone explain the following please -

(a) why was the demand so high and what triggered the panic buying ?
(b) what was so special about this particular coin compared to any other nice designed coin ?
(c) why has the market value shot up 10 fold overnight ?
(d) if you have 1 will you try and sell it now to make £2,000 or more instant profit ?
(e) do you honestly believe, rather than hope, the coin will retain it's inflated value ?
(f) if you see milk spots appear in a year from now what do you reckon the percentage drop in price will be ?

I know when the first Britannia / Year of the Horse mule appeared, early sellers were able to capture almost £2,000 per coin for a coin that cost £20-25 or thereabouts.
Then the price fairly quickly dropped to £1,000 then steadily to £100 and today maybe as low as £50 or less.
The super inflated price vanished and those that paid over a grand must be royally piss*d.
Those that held on to their mules ( and I am one ) now regret not selling for £100 each but that seemed low at the time compared to only a few months earlier.
Will a similar pattern evolve with the Graces ?

Maybe

[NewCoins]

27 minutes ago, Pete said:

I spent about 45 minutes reading many of the posts on a topic that runs in to 75 pages !

My summary as follows ( please correct any errors )

1. The 3 Graces 2 oz silver proof went on sale February 21 or thereabouts at a Royal Mint price of £250- £255
Now that's £125 per ounce for £20 worth of silver so grossly overpriced but people historically will pay silly money for such issues, and the resale market will see value halved perhaps a year later when the novelty has worn off or small spots appear on the coin.

2. The mintage was circa 3,500 which is small compared to bullion but not so limited compared to other proof coins - silver and gold in the past.

3. Inventory was sold out in about 10 minutes

4. People are paying £2,500 or even more for this coin only 10-14 days after issue.

Can anyone explain the following please -

(a) why was the demand so high and what triggered the panic buying ?
(b) what was so special about this particular coin compared to any other nice designed coin ?
(c) why has the market value shot up 10 fold overnight ?
(d) if you have 1 will you try and sell it now to make £2,000 or more instant profit ?
(e) do you honestly believe, rather than hope, the coin will retain it's inflated value ?
(f) if you see milk spots appear in a year from now what do you reckon the percentage drop in price will be ?

I know when the first Britannia / Year of the Horse mule appeared, early sellers were able to capture almost £2,000 per coin for a coin that cost £20-25 or thereabouts.
Then the price fairly quickly dropped to £1,000 then steadily to £100 and today maybe as low as £50 or less.
The super inflated price vanished and those that paid over a grand must be royally piss*d.
Those that held on to their mules ( and I am one ) now regret not selling for £100 each but that seemed low at the time compared to only a few months earlier.
Will a similar pattern evolve with the Graces ?

Una and the lion was released November 2019. That seems to be commanding 2k for the 2oz nearly 18 months later, from a retail of £180 IIRC. So, if that's anything to go by...

[sovtsf]

Thats what has pushed the prices up, the fact its the same series as Una which has a price history to go by and also a stunning design. Plus this time round dealers couldn't buy in bulk so are also competing with private buyers to buy on the secondary market. Over a year on and Una prices have not fallen plus the 3rd in the series will drive more collectors

[SilverJacks]

1 hour ago, Pete said:

I spent about 45 minutes reading many of the posts on a topic that runs in to 75 pages !

My summary as follows ( please correct any errors )

1. The 3 Graces 2 oz silver proof went on sale February 21 or thereabouts at a Royal Mint price of £250- £255
Now that's £125 per ounce for £20 worth of silver so grossly overpriced but people historically will pay silly money for such issues, and the resale market will see value halved perhaps a year later when the novelty has worn off or small spots appear on the coin.

2. The mintage was circa 3,500 which is small compared to bullion but not so limited compared to other proof coins - silver and gold in the past.

3. Inventory was sold out in about 10 minutes

4. People are paying £2,500 or even more for this coin only 10-14 days after issue.

Can anyone explain the following please -

(a) why was the demand so high and what triggered the panic buying ?
(b) what was so special about this particular coin compared to any other nice designed coin ?
(c) why has the market value shot up 10 fold overnight ?
(d) if you have 1 will you try and sell it now to make £2,000 or more instant profit ?
(e) do you honestly believe, rather than hope, the coin will retain it's inflated value ?
(f) if you see milk spots appear in a year from now what do you reckon the percentage drop in price will be ?

I know when the first Britannia / Year of the Horse mule appeared, early sellers were able to capture almost £2,000 per coin for a coin that cost £20-25 or thereabouts.
Then the price fairly quickly dropped to £1,000 then steadily to £100 and today maybe as low as £50 or less.
The super inflated price vanished and those that paid over a grand must be royally piss*d.
Those that held on to their mules ( and I am one ) now regret not selling for £100 each but that seemed low at the time compared to only a few months earlier.
Will a similar pattern evolve with the Graces ?

I have an opinionated claim that this series is particularly attractive as it’s based on the history of the Royal Mint itself. For me, it’s just such a great theme.

if you like Bond , you’d buy Bond items. if you like coins, you’re gonna love “the great engravers”. Just my thoughts.

I’m hoping, as this is only the 2nd coin in the series, there’s plenty of retention in its price, perhaps even appreciate as later releases come out (just hope, I have no idea how it will pan out).

as for milking/toning, that’s my main concern. I’m In no rush to sell, would like to keep hold in the face of temptation. But I’m not experienced enough to know the percentage chances of a proof coin milking.. surely it’s less likely than bullion grade? Any advice on this would be appreciated. 

also, I can’t wait for the next release. The intrigue, the buzz, the wonder of whether you’ll be lucky enough to get one...

[sovereignsteve]

@Pete

It's the second coin in the Great Engravers series. If you don't know what happened to the first coin, Una and the Lion, you have been napping😉

The Mint has only increased the mintage for the second coin by a small amount and IMO this one is a better design than the Una, although not as iconic.

[FlorinCollector]

@Pete

a) due to the success of the first in the series momentum continued into this coin. Same series another great design.

b) This coin compared to others.Due to instant sell out there was 0 chance of losing investment. Supply and demand. Low supply high demand.

c) market has shot up again due to the success of the first coin. It took months to realise market price. This one didn’t need months as there was an example on the market. Only a very high mintage could have changed that.

D) No

e) Depends what value you mean. £2,500. Most likely not. More than £1000 certainly. Thats only 4x not bad. 
 F) The good old milk spot question. Imagine it will effect it somewhat but will still not sell for anywhere near retail price.

just to add to the other point about value dropping in the next year. If you look at the Una and the lion 2oz you will see this hasn’t happened?

I see you are saying you do not understand the hype. Can I ask why you paid 53% over spot before vat for a silver bar? Maybe it will go mad in price.

[Simmoleon]

39 minutes ago, sovereignsteve said:

@Pete

It's the second coin in the Great Engravers series. If you don't know what happened to the first coin, Una and the Lion, you have been napping😉

The Mint has only increased the mintage for the second coin by a small amount and IMO this one is a better design than the Una, although not as iconic.

Personally I still think Una edges it for me but I think we all felt the second coin may not live up to the hype generated by the Una but the second is stunning as well - this series can’t be compared to other bullion or proof releases it’s just in a different league to most of them

[GoldenGriffin]

I remember the day when I had missed a call from the Royal Mint and wondered why they were calling me on my phone?  Then I saw the Una and the Lion on their website and realised, that's why they were calling.

I didn't manage to get one and a thought ran through my mind... it was a copy and it wasn't the original coin, so I didn't think too much about missing out.

But since then, my way of thinking changed... why wouldn't I want something so special, a part of history, significant history, albeit a copy, the originals are so scarce and so sought after in the coin world.

If you want the original, you'd have to pay 100's of thousands for it, if and when one came up for sale.

I think I'm really lucky to have the next release, the Three Grace's - it's a true piece of art and I understand why the great engraver coins are so special.

Edited March 8, 2021 by GoldenGriffin
.

[ExpatBrian]

37 minutes ago, GoldenGriffin said:

If you want the original, you'd have to pay 100's of thousands for it and that's if one ever came up for sale.

You can purchase the original in 3 weeks and not for 100’s of thousands, you’re in luck!!

[GoldenGriffin]

5 minutes ago, SovCollector said:

You can purchase the original in 3 weeks and not for 100’s of thousands, you’re in luck!!

Sorry, I meant the Una and the lion 😅.

The original Three Grace's sounds like a bargain. 😉

It'll be interesting to see what that actually goes for.

Edited March 6, 2021 by GoldenGriffin
.

[AndrewSL76]

@SovCollector 

Which auction is that in, please? 

[NewCoins]

1 minute ago, AndrewSL76 said:

@SovCollector 

Which auction is that in, please? 

https://www.numisbids.com/n.php?p=lot&sid=4551&lot=30318

[ExpatBrian]

4 minutes ago, AndrewSL76 said:

@SovCollector 

Which auction is that in, please? 

It’s over at Heritage Auctions on March 25-27. The Paramount Collection. Quite a few stunning coins up for sale, albeit all with a hefty price tag. You can also pick up an original Una... might have to sell the house though.

 

[AndrewSL76]

6 minutes ago, NewCoins said:

https://www.numisbids.com/n.php?p=lot&sid=4551&lot=30318

Thanks!

Aaaaaaaaanndddd WOW: https://www.numisbids.com/n.php?p=lot&sid=4551&lot=30325

[Theodoros]

This is my first post even though I have been following the silver forum daily for some months now. It is full of knowledge and useful information for someone new in the precious metals world like me.

I was lucky enough to buy a gold three graces coin but I am not sure about the condition and if I should return it to royal mint for an exchange. I have attached some photos and any advice would be much appreciated.

Thank you

Theodoros

[ExpatBrian]

52 minutes ago, Theodoros said:

This is my first post even though I have been following the silver forum daily for some months now. It is full of knowledge and useful information for someone new in the precious metals world like me.

I was lucky enough to buy a gold three graces coin but I am not sure about the condition and if I should return it to royal mint for an exchange. I have attached some photos and any advice would be much appreciated.

Thank you

Theodoros

Hey mate,

Welcome to the forum! I’m relatively new also and completely agree with you, loads of great info on this forum.

In your second photo, is that a piece of dust or a scratch? What magnification are you using, do you use a loop?

[sovtsf]

8 hours ago, Theodoros said:

This is my first post even though I have been following the silver forum daily for some months now. It is full of knowledge and useful information for someone new in the precious metals world like me.

I was lucky enough to buy a gold three graces coin but I am not sure about the condition and if I should return it to royal mint for an exchange. I have attached some photos and any advice would be much appreciated.

Thank you

Theodoros

From my experience I would keep it even if one of them marks was damage. I’ve had other 2oz golds that were a lot worst and after returning I got a worst one and ultimately a refund. I have spent ages on the phone and emails and had the money out of my account for 4 months. Unless damage is so bad it’s worth less than you spent the. I would keep it. 
 

well done on getting a gold! 
 

 

[Frenchie]

9 hours ago, Theodoros said:

This is my first post even though I have been following the silver forum daily for some months now. It is full of knowledge and useful information for someone new in the precious metals world like me.

I was lucky enough to buy a gold three graces coin but I am not sure about the condition and if I should return it to royal mint for an exchange. I have attached some photos and any advice would be much appreciated.

Thank you

Theodoros

Congratulations for your gold 3G, looking at it, I don't see scratches, I think you have to relax because I really think this is only dust on the capsule and/or the coin. I have received my silver 3G and I have been surprised to see a lot of dust. and what seemed to be a bad scratch : I have opened the capsule and confirm you there was a lot of dust and the marks were on the capsule. If you have never opened a capsule before, I strongly advise you not to do it and moreover, NEVER touch a coin trying to remove anything, it would be worse and damage it. However, you can check if there is dust in the capsule by slightly turn it open without opening it. If you plan to grade such valuable coin, don't hesitate to conserve it with NCS  

Edited March 7, 2021 by Frenchie

[Theodoros]

@SovCollector, @sovtsf, and @Frenchie thank you for your replies. The mark in the red circle is definitely on the coin and looks like a scratch when I look at it with a loop but I'm not 100% sure. All others must be dust. I was thinking to send it back for a replacement. They told me that they will check it and if they agree that there is damage on the coin it will be replaced with a new struck coin. There is a risk as I cannot insure the coin for the value it has and I can't be sure that I will not just get someone else's return...     

[ExpatBrian]

14 minutes ago, Theodoros said:

@SovCollector, @sovtsf, and @Frenchie thank you for your replies. The mark in the red circle is definitely on the coin and looks like a scratch when I look at it with a loop but I'm not 100% sure. All others must be dust. I was thinking to send it back for a replacement. They told me that they will check it and if they agree that there is damage on the coin it will be replaced with a new struck coin. There is a risk as I cannot insure the coin for the value it has and I can't be sure that I will not just get someone else's return...     

If it was me and there was a scratch on it that was visible to the naked eye, 100% I would send it back. That coin costs nearly £5000... I would expect it to come in much better condition. That small scratch has the potential to wipe off 10s of thousands of pounds in value off the coin. I'd be ringing the RM on Monday and asking for it to be returned. 
By the way, the cost for the return is covered by RM so you won't be out of pocket for shipping and insurance.

But do make sure the scratch is on the coin and not the capsule before sending it back. The last thing you'd want is sending a coin that beautiful back and forth through the post.