2022 Sovereign design revealed?

[Paul]

Just now, BullionBuyerUK said:

As of yesterday when my RM account manager emailed me, the 4 coin sets are not in stock at the moment 

Much appreciated BBUK

[BiigT]

11 hours ago, GoldDiggerDave said:

Yes I have experience with these sorts of issues when it comes to grading.  

1, First thing I would say to anyone if you are paying a honking premium for a proof sovereign over a bullion then you have  the right to be hyper critical and should not accept anything you are not happy with.

2,  If you are hyper critical you are untimely are going to be disappointed with proof coins and theres almost always small flaws, tiny bits of flake, pick-up, frosting missing, grease, rub marks, hen-pecks, scratches.   (I'm not defending RM quality its just a fact)

3, if you are buying to grade then theres allowances for pre-production imperfections ,  less is better and there is no definition anywhere of what these are and where pre-production ends and post-production issues start .  If you think about this they could throw the blank around and damage the surface of the blank prior to minting and by that definition it should get a 70 providing theres no post-production imperfections .      But I don't blame anyone for not wanting to take a best part of a £700 gamble on their proof sovereign if they think it has flaws.

The 2022 jubilee proof sovereign graded very well and I only got one 69 in the full (25+) all got a 70   however almost every single 2022 proof sovereign I saw 100's all had in my opinion greasy pick up ( flaky bits)  on the coins so with what I have seen this is not and issue or at least not an issue for the jubilee sovereign.  Same for hen-pecks ( small dented spots on the surface of the coin (these do annoy the pants off me)  and again coins with these in my experience are not down graded on these coins.    I've also see coins with micro bits of frosting missing that grade 70 without issue some have loads missing and still grade 70 some I'm gobsmacked by so frosting missing in may cases IMO don't effect grading what I can see. 

4, rub marks, contact marks, scratches all effect grading.  however 1oz and 2oz silvers have been shredded by the NGC recently and it's proving hard to get 70 in these I've seen boxes full of them all come back 69's and lower and with my eyes I can't see where and why these have all been graded lower than the gold counter parts. 

5, ultimately grading can feel like a bit of a lottery I'm only being honest so picking the best example you can will help but even when you do that you still can get less than top marks which can be very frustrating.  

 

Smashing advice as always Dave. I'm actually quite happy with it and even though I'm hyper critical, I think I'm being over picky on this occasion. If I was reading post after post that missing frosting was definitely an issue I'd be less inclined to accept it, but I'm more reassured it's not a big issue. I'm also waiting on a 5 coin set, which I'll be scrutinising much more closely. 

Even though I buy with a view to grading, it might be odd to hear that I haven't actually graded any of the coins I've purchased recently. I kind of like them better in their original packaging, but I think most if not all are very capable of being 70's if I did take the plunge. No rush as they are a 20yr investment for me. 

[GoodAsGold]

12 hours ago, GoldDiggerDave said:

Yes I have experience with these sorts of issues when it comes to grading.  

1, First thing I would say to anyone if you are paying a honking premium for a proof sovereign over a bullion then you have  the right to be hyper critical and should not accept anything you are not happy with.

2,  If you are hyper critical you are untimely are going to be disappointed with proof coins and theres almost always small flaws, tiny bits of flake, pick-up, frosting missing, grease, rub marks, hen-pecks, scratches.   (I'm not defending RM quality its just a fact)

3, if you are buying to grade then theres allowances for pre-production imperfections ,  less is better and there is no definition anywhere of what these are and where pre-production ends and post-production issues start .  If you think about this they could throw the blank around and damage the surface of the blank prior to minting and by that definition it should get a 70 providing theres no post-production imperfections .      But I don't blame anyone for not wanting to take a best part of a £700 gamble on their proof sovereign if they think it has flaws.

The 2022 jubilee proof sovereign graded very well and I only got one 69 in the full (25+) all got a 70   however almost every single 2022 proof sovereign I saw 100's all had in my opinion greasy pick up ( flaky bits)  on the coins so with what I have seen this is not and issue or at least not an issue for the jubilee sovereign.  Same for hen-pecks ( small dented spots on the surface of the coin (these do annoy the pants off me)  and again coins with these in my experience are not down graded on these coins.    I've also see coins with micro bits of frosting missing that grade 70 without issue some have loads missing and still grade 70 some I'm gobsmacked by so frosting missing in may cases IMO don't effect grading what I can see. 

4, rub marks, contact marks, scratches all effect grading.  however 1oz and 2oz silvers have been shredded by the NGC recently and it's proving hard to get 70 in these I've seen boxes full of them all come back 69's and lower and with my eyes I can't see where and why these have all been graded lower than the gold counter parts. 

5, ultimately grading can feel like a bit of a lottery I'm only being honest so picking the best example you can will help but even when you do that you still can get less than top marks which can be very frustrating.  

 

This is all top class info for me Dave. Thanks very much for the benefit of your experience. 

[GoodAsGold]

On 18/01/2023 at 07:10, GoldDiggerDave said:

I had a £5 matte BU 2022 memorial sovereign in hand yesterday............Hum not blown away don't get me wrong they are nice but they are too much in terms of design and frosting, and some of the design is lost IMO.     I do think the £5 proof sovereign will look good.  I'll do some side by side pictures once they are delivered.    

I’m pleased with my matte BU quintuple which arrived today courtesy of Mark Osborne at uk gold coins, however I also agree with your verdict above. Some of the design does appear lost on the matte (took me ages to find Where’s Wally) and the contrast between the design and the fields can only be an improvement on the proofs. I’m going to attempt to put some pics on my next post for Stuntman who’s waiting on his own matte coin.

[SiCole]

Just now, GoodAsGold said:

I’m pleased with my matte BU quintuple which arrived today courtesy of Mark Osborne at uk gold coins, however I also agree with your verdict above. Some of the design does appear lost on the matte (took me ages to find Where’s Wally) and the contrast between the design and the fields can only be an improvement on the proofs. I’m going to attempt to put some pics on my next post for Stuntman who’s waiting on his own matte coin.

Any pics?

Edit - should have read the whole post first instead of watch the football

Edited January 19, 2023 by SiCole

[GoldDiggerDave]

3 minutes ago, GoodAsGold said:

I’m pleased with my matte BU quintuple which arrived today courtesy of Mark Osborne at uk gold coins, however I also agree with your verdict above. Some of the design does appear lost on the matte (took me ages to find Where’s Wally) and the contrast between the design and the fields can only be an improvement on the proofs. I’m going to attempt to put some pics on my next post for Stuntman who’s waiting on his own matte coin.

The patina of the new matte sovereigns are sublime especially on the £5 sov's they are a semi pearlescent finish and look great.  I only got a quick glimpse of the memorial £5 BU  so would like to have a second look. I'm so excited to eventually get my hands on the 5 coins sets when they turn up.   Would love to see some pictures 

[GoodAsGold]

Just now, SiCole said:

Any pics?

Give us a chance 😊 I’ve just been editing them. Feeling stressful now as my tech savvy daughter is nowhere to be seen at crunch time 😩

 

[GoodAsGold]

@Stuntman @SiCole @GoldDiggerDave

 

[SiCole]

She’s an absolute stunner but I do agree with some of the design being lost in BU.

[Paul]

8 minutes ago, GoodAsGold said:

@Stuntman @SiCole @GoldDiggerDave

 

Looks 10/10  thanks for posting 

[GoodAsGold]

Just now, GoodAsGold said:

@Stuntman @SiCole @GoldDiggerDave

 

The coin appears fine to the naked eye so I’m happy to keep it raw (must be @westminstrel’s influence). Noticeable flaws on magnification are white specks at the top of the upper leg of the unicorn. Same issue halfway down between KCIII’s lip and the bottom of his chin. Also small hairs (?) near the lion’s groin. They’re in quite a few places within the capsule so I don’t think they’re all pubic ones. All comments welcome please to confirm what these different flaws are. I’m delighted there’s no unpleasant black specks visible to the naked eye, so all is good. Thanks for looking folks.

[ShineyMagpie]

On 18/01/2023 at 00:19, James32 said:

I will.. if I can use your payment method

Sure the number on the card is 3147 86.... hang on a minute 

Is this safe to do 😝

[sovereignsteve]

On 18/01/2023 at 07:06, GoldDiggerDave said:

You would think the guy would have a decent kitchen

I would have liked to have seen his postman's face on delivery day.

[westminstrel]

6 hours ago, GoodAsGold said:

Also small hairs (?) near the lion’s groin. They’re in quite a few places within the capsule so I don’t think they’re all pubic ones.

You are hilarious. 😆

[apachebleu]

9 hours ago, GoodAsGold said:

The coin appears fine to the naked eye so I’m happy to keep it raw (must be @westminstrel’s influence). Noticeable flaws on magnification are white specks at the top of the upper leg of the unicorn. Same issue halfway down between KCIII’s lip and the bottom of his chin. Also small hairs (?) near the lion’s groin. They’re in quite a few places within the capsule so I don’t think they’re all pubic ones. All comments welcome please to confirm what these different flaws are. I’m delighted there’s no unpleasant black specks visible to the naked eye, so all is good. Thanks for looking folks.

What's the magnification of the coin there? To me that looks rough, the marks on the unicorn especially are unmissable but maybe it's the angle/light/magnification? The main thing is you are happy with it 👍

[apachebleu]

9 hours ago, GoodAsGold said:

The coin appears fine to the naked eye so I’m happy to keep it raw (must be @westminstrel’s influence). Noticeable flaws on magnification are white specks at the top of the upper leg of the unicorn. Same issue halfway down between KCIII’s lip and the bottom of his chin. Also small hairs (?) near the lion’s groin. They’re in quite a few places within the capsule so I don’t think they’re all pubic ones. All comments welcome please to confirm what these different flaws are. I’m delighted there’s no unpleasant black specks visible to the naked eye, so all is good. Thanks for looking folks.

 I can't unsee the lions pubes now 😂 

[GoodAsGold]

3 hours ago, apachebleu said:

What's the magnification of the coin there? To me that looks rough, the marks on the unicorn especially are unmissable but maybe it's the angle/light/magnification? The main thing is you are happy with it 👍

I used both 1x and 3x magnification on my iPhone 13 Pro and they were over coin snaps on the window cill to use the natural daylight. I’d upgraded my phone specifically for the zoom capability to take decent snaps of my coins. I’m wondering if/how many of my other raw coins will reveal flaws under closer scrutiny but that’s for another time as they’re stored elsewhere in a safe deposit facility. Thanks for asking.

[apachebleu]

1 hour ago, GoodAsGold said:

I used both 1x and 3x magnification on my iPhone 13 Pro and they were over coin snaps on the window cill to use the natural daylight. I’d upgraded my phone specifically for the zoom capability to take decent snaps of my coins. I’m wondering if/how many of my other raw coins will reveal flaws under closer scrutiny but that’s for another time as they’re stored elsewhere in a safe deposit facility. Thanks for asking.

 You bought a new phone specifically to photograph your coins? I can very much respect that 👏. They are some excellent pictures for a phone, my s21 ultra can't come close to that.

[paulmerton]

You can also get some fairly capable Android camera phones in the £50-£100 bracket. I know someone who bought one as a dedicated vlogging device instead of using their normal phone. 

Most of them these days also have a dedicated macro lens. Here's a handheld shot I took just now of a double florin with a sunken letter on my £52 Xiaomi phone with no special setup. Bargain!

[Slam]

Hi All, 

Hope you are all well.

Just had my sovereigns delivered, can't decide if this is worthy of a replacement? (See attached pics)

From looking at this with the naked eye, seems like missing frosting on the cheeks and some around the hair on King Charles (At different angles). I believe can just make them out in the pictures. 

Design looks really busy as others has said, first thoughts are that the platinum jubilee ones are nicer, what you think?

Thanks for your advice in advance.

Slam

 

[paulmerton]

4 minutes ago, Slam said:

Hi All, 

Hope you are all well.

Just had my sovereigns delivered, can't decide if this is worthy of a replacement? (See attached pics)

From looking at this with the naked eye, seems like missing frosting on the cheeks and some around the hair on King Charles (At different angles). I believe can just make them out in the pictures. 

Design looks really busy as others has said, first thoughts are that the platinum jubilee ones are nicer, what you think?

Thanks for your advice in advance.

Slam

 

If it stands out like a sore thumb to the naked eye when wibbled about in the light, then yes I'd ask for a replacement.

 

[BullionBuyerUK]

Just had my half turn up, have to say it's a spot on job by the mint. Coin look impeccable! Can't find fault with it at all. Just waiting on all the others to turn up now ☹️

[GoldDiggerDave]

I've had the Matte £5 BU in hand today.........🤗

[GoldDiggerDave]

Chards at Blackpool kindly let me have a look at one......Managed to get a bit of footage so will link it soon.  

https://www.chards.co.uk/2022-matt-gold-bu-elizabeth-ii-memorial-quintuple-sovereign/17839

[Slam]

2 hours ago, paulmerton said:

If it stands out like a sore thumb to the naked eye when wibbled about in the light, then yes I'd ask for a replacement.

 

Thanks for the reply, I will no doubt sleep on it and decide in the coming days 👍.