GOLD DEALS - (UK & Europe) See a deal, post it here

[LawrenceChard]

6 minutes ago, Stacktastic said:

These are referred to a DFL's where I come from. 
Down From London. 
Its the twats that have country gear on in a town that really make me laugh. 

No offence to Londoners in general but some of them really take life way to seriously.
Reminds me of the victorians at times & I have spent some time with the rich DFL's.  

Its ironic that they scoff at simple country folk that are way more happy intrinsically.
Miles more wealthy in our souls shall we say. 

The tilted people I have met or known have been the best actually, especially higher up ones like lords, Earls, Ladies - normal people really. 

I agree in some senses as I had a lovely sov from them in an air tight at a cheap price. 
I really like this logo and paper too, but its sales tech for duping the elderly & un informed as its designed to look like a top end lawyers stuff. 

I complained & I had a nice voice mail from a guy. 
He said in the voice mail you did not do that  but I definitely clicked the 'dont send me c**p button'.

Whether people get conned in paying over the odds IMO if thier fault,
but thier business model is dodgy thats the fundamentals of it really.

Are the "tilted" people the ones who lean over backwards to be helpful? 🙂...

or who have a little list?

On a slighly more serious note: "Whether people get conned in paying over the odds IMO if their fault" Yes strictly speaking it is, but every week we get offered modern issue coins that people have bought from Coin Marketing Companies, knowing little or nothing about coins. Our staff and I do feel a lot of sympathy for them, along with frustration, and some anger, that they have been ripped-off, usually by people who also know little or nothing about coins. Typically the victims are older, and use print media more than online. We often have to try and break the bad news to them as gently as possible, often they have realised before they get to us, which makes our job a little easier.

Quite often, we end up sourcing some interesting modern issues, including low mintage, but from Jersey, Guernsey, Alderney, Gibraltar, Tristan da Cunha, etc. These require time, effort, and patience to re-market, and do not have the secondary market appeal that most UK or other major countries' coins do.

When I write "Coin Marketing Companies", I half expect predictive text to make an indecent suggestion which I would not entirely disagree with! 🙂

[Mcgrimes]

On 23/05/2021 at 20:47, vacancies said:

Coming up with an error message. Others getting the same?

Missed them, gutted!

[Spark268]

it is a little on the shady side but i don't think they prey on the vulnerable. No one forces you to buy the sovereign at 319, and you would question why you are being offered another at 899.  There's probably room for negotiation.

the TV/newspapers are full of less honest ads from other companies.

According to companies house, the H&B net profit margin is 10%. This is compared to BBP which if memory serves was around 8%.  

The product mix at H&B is of higher value on average, so it does not suggest they are fleecing any more people than BBP are for example.

They don't offer to buy back proof sovs/numismatic coins at below spot which is equally  more shady imho.

 

 

 

 

Edited May 25, 2021 by Spark268

[BackyardBullion]

I always refer people this video when I get asked if products like these are good purchases....

This video specifically references The London Mint Office which operates a basically identical business model.

 

[Stacktastic]

11 hours ago, BackyardBullion said:

I always refer people this video when I get asked if products like these are good purchases....

Its a shame that people fall for this stuff. 
I personally have hung on to all sorts of things since I was a kid.
I sold them during lockdown & broke even! Even on a mint back to the future poster. 
I assumed they would go up in value & did no research - been sat in my loft ever since. 
I dont blame anyone other than myself as I was ripped of on the BTTF book & poster for sure. 

Its nice that this program is educating people Although it makes no reference to the spot price (so far anyway).
You can bet he bought that the real gold in 2011, 2012 at its highs & then sold it in 2014, when the price was lowest. 
Had he bought a load of decent gold bullion between 1998 & 2005 (One a month is manageable = 84 coins)
He could have sold them in 2012 & used the profits to buy more in 2014 and sell this year for another big profit. 
Have his original investment back and double to triple on top in new coins.

Even if he bought in 2014 it would be double more had he bought lower mintage proof coins & sets. 
A trip to a coin shop would have made that clear assuming he is not online. 

Edited May 26, 2021 by Stacktastic

[Bars]

15 hours ago, BackyardBullion said:

I always refer people this video when I get asked if products like these are good purchases....

This video specifically references The London Mint Office which operates a basically identical business model.

 

Why does the guy who's giving him the low coin valuations seem so happy. LOL. The same guy also looks like how I'd picture you Mr backyard bullion lol, no offence of course!

[Stacktastic]

49 minutes ago, Bars said:

The same guy also looks like how I'd picture you Mr backyard bullion lol, no offence of course!

I was thinking that actually as all i have only ever seen is his forearms.
Exactly as i pictured him. 
Hmm now we know why you like that video so much.

Only joking. A thread along the lines of "post a photo of how you think I look" would be comical. 
I think I have used up all my pointless thread credits this decade though. 

but yes he does not seem very compassionate to the guys reaction, must have been a shock. 
I bought 30 proof crowns recently and quickly offloaded them for small profit, when I realised the long term prospects. 

Edited May 26, 2021 by Stacktastic

[LawrenceChard]

17 hours ago, BackyardBullion said:

I always refer people this video when I get asked if products like these are good purchases....

This video specifically references The London Mint Office which operates a basically identical business model.

 

Thanks for posting that BBC YouTube video, it a good link to send people to.

I have seen it before, but forgotten about it.

There are quite a few errors in it, both by Gloria and the auctioneer guy,

Anyone who the "expert" dealer was, and which company?

[Chorlton]

Its a very difficult but easy situation to get into without doing a lot of research and understanding the market. When I first started I made a few mistakes but was in part lucky to avoid anything close to the scale on the youtube clip.

The premiums are eye watering in some cases for something with little value over bullion.

[BackyardBullion]

Getting this post back on brand and true to it's purpose...

Cannot say no to 1.25% over spot price for a whopping big gold coin.

https://www.chards.co.uk/mexico-gold-50-pesos-coin-grade-C/14502

Pulled the trigger, let's see what a C grade bullion coin looks like!

[Rll1288]

48 minutes ago, BackyardBullion said:

Getting this post back on brand and true to it's purpose...

Cannot say no to 1.25% over spot price for a whopping big gold coin.

https://www.chards.co.uk/mexico-gold-50-pesos-coin-grade-C/14502

Pulled the trigger, let's see what a C grade bullion coin looks like!

in the words (almost) of Robert Shaw   "Your gonner need a bigger boat.....!" well table if you put that with all your other gold  🤣🙂

[BackyardBullion]

Just now, Rll1288 said:

in the words (almost) of Robert Shaw   "Your gonner need a bigger boat.....!" well table if you put that with all your other gold  🤣🙂

My goal is 10 of these bad boys, this is number 6 🙂 

[Rll1288]

1 minute ago, BackyardBullion said:

My goal is 10 of these bad boys, this is number 6 🙂 

Nice... 👍.. I am way behind on the gold stacking.... I may have to sell the kidney's

Edited May 26, 2021 by Rll1288

[27carrots]

There is one left. I'm interested in how it compares to the one I paid +5% for so please post close ups when you get it. I consider mine well handled/circulated but undamaged (I'm a novice at this). I was hoping it would retain the premium when I eventually have to sell it. ~sighs~

Edited May 26, 2021 by 27carrots

[Stacktastic]

1 hour ago, BackyardBullion said:

My goal is 10 of these bad boys, this is number 6 🙂 

I bought one of the first 20 pesos recently. Really nice coin indeed. 

[silvernewbie]

I got a 50 peso recently stunning!  Id be concerned with the grade c as mines bu and condition just about ok to appreciate it.  Personally rather pay a few extra % for a better condition

[Darr3nG]

7 minutes ago, silvernewbie said:

I got a 50 peso recently stunning!

Likewise... picked up my first 50 peso recently from HGM for a few points over spot - it really is stunning, both to hold and look at!  

It does have 4 x surface marks, both front and back, as if it were in some kind of holder previously (not fully indented or scratched, but visible); but I'll take that for such a wonderful piece.

Definitely gonna add some more, whenever I can!

[LawrenceChard]

22 hours ago, Spark268 said:

it is a little on the shady side but i don't think they prey on the vulnerable. No one forces you to buy the sovereign at 319, and you would question why you are being offered another at 899.  There's probably room for negotiation.

the TV/newspapers are full of less honest ads from other companies.

According to companies house, the H&B net profit margin is 10%. This is compared to BBP which if memory serves was around 8%.  

The product mix at H&B is of higher value on average, so it does not suggest they are fleecing any more people than BBP are for example.

They don't offer to buy back proof sovs/numismatic coins at below spot which is equally  more shady imho.

 

It is likely that they tried to persuade the customer that the £319 bullion sovereign was not a very good investment, and that the proof sovereign. was a much better investment at £899.

We have evidence that they have done this before, and it is my belief that this is almost certainly their standard practice. While there is nothing much wrong with trying to "upsell", it is dishonest to mislead people and try to pressure them into clearly over-priced alternatives. I also guess their salespeople get commission for pulling a "switch", or at least have targets wich they are expected to meet.

BbP are our second biggest UK competitor, and I do have some reservations about them, but I would not accuse them of fleecing anyone, and I have some no evidence of them using "bait and switch" or lying to customers.

It is not clear what your last sentence means.

Do you mean that because H&B don't offer to buy back, they are more shady?

or do you mean that dealers who do offer to buy back are more shady?

In my opinion, dealers who offer to buy coins are providing a service. Prices and percentages are almost certain to vary between different dealers, and certainly there will be many who only offer very low prices. If you try to sell coins to jewellers, you are likely to be offered between 50% and 75% of the intrinsic value, although some do offer more.

Most coin dealers will offer much more, perhaps between 90% and 100%, but obviously some will be offering less than 90%, some more than 100%. Much depends on what the coins are, how the dealer feels about the coins, and whether he wants to buy them. It would be harsh to criticise any dealer for offering 98% or 99% for gold sovereigns, even for the current year, especially if the owner has been carrying them round in his pocket, or failing to conserve them in some other way.

I think it is much more reaonable to criticise "dealers", or more accurately Coin Marketing Companies, who are reluctant to buy coins (or even buy back coins they have sold). This includes The Royal Mint, H&B, LMO, Westminster, Hattons, Jubilee Mint, and the rest. What they are offering to pay is effectively 0%, and that is much worse by far than 99%, or 90%, or even 50%! I believe the reason that many CMCs refuse to buy or make offers, is because this would expose their margins, and expose them to criticism, dislike, and more from their customers. They choose to stay out of the fight. This is a little cowardly in my opinion.

[Touvex]

5 hours ago, BackyardBullion said:

Getting this post back on brand and true to it's purpose...

Cannot say no to 1.25% over spot price for a whopping big gold coin.

https://www.chards.co.uk/mexico-gold-50-pesos-coin-grade-C/14502

Pulled the trigger, let's see what a C grade bullion coin looks like!

Thanks for bringing this back on topic! And thanks for sharing.

May I ask if anyone knows what it means when it says it should not be resold as “bullion”? 

[LawrenceChard]

3 minutes ago, Touvex said:

Thanks for bringing this back on topic! And thanks for sharing.

May I ask if anyone knows what it means when it says it should not be resold as “bullion”? 

That is slightly strange wording, which I would have queried if I had seen it first, but I think the rest of the page make it reasonably clear:

"We do not recommend these coins as an investment item and they should not be resold as bullion coins. They have defects such as deep scratches, mount marks, polished or red spots." and

"These coins are what some of our competitors sell as 'bullion' with little quality control, which is why some of our competitors sometimes appear to have lower priced bullion 50 pesos coins than us. If you can buy these coins from less than our price, it is probably because they are substandard, possibly even fake. It seems some of our competitors, mainly newer ones, can't tell the difference or don't care."

...and I just spotted another example of strange wording there.

I will tag @ChardsCoinandBullionDealer into this thread, and hopefully someone other than me will proof-read the page, and make it clearer.

 

[Bigmarc]

I thought it was because to be classed as bullion it had to be 99.5 %  and above.

[Spark268]

1 hour ago, LawrenceChard said:

or do you mean that dealers who do offer to buy back are more shady?

 

I agree with your statement that dealers do offer a service. And under normal conditions paying below spot would be reasonable.

However, these are not normal conditions, and you guys could do better  (and perhaps end up with more stock!). Meanwhile, in Germany, you can now get 10% above spot for reselling your silver.

Above is the best prices dealers are prepared to pay for kangaroos. €26.12 =  £22.54 .   The best price to buy is €27.55

On BPB (as an example), there must be hundreds of separate listings for sovereigns, with specific years marked up significantly, not because they are rare, just because they are specific years!  Yet when you go to sell, you only get a miserable 300 for your sovereign regardless of its year/vintage etc.

They are now paying a penny above spot for silver, which is something i guess 😛

 

 

 

 

 

Edited May 26, 2021 by Spark268

[Touvex]

10 minutes ago, LawrenceChard said:

That is slightly strange wording, which I would have queried if I had seen it first, but I think the rest of the page make it reasonably clear:

"We do not recommend these coins as an investment item and they should not be resold as bullion coins. They have defects such as deep scratches, mount marks, polished or red spots." and

"These coins are what some of our competitors sell as 'bullion' with little quality control, which is why some of our competitors sometimes appear to have lower priced bullion 50 pesos coins than us. If you can buy these coins from less than our price, it is probably because they are substandard, possibly even fake. It seems some of our competitors, mainly newer ones, can't tell the difference or don't care."

...and I just spotted another example of strange wording there.

I will tag @ChardsCoinandBullionDealer into this thread, and hopefully someone other than me will proof-read the page, and make it clearer.

 

Thank you! So it can be resold as bullion?

[LawrenceChard]

1 minute ago, Spark268 said:

I agree with your statement that dealers do offer a service. And under normal conditions paying below spot would be reasonable.

However, these are not normal conditions, and you guys could do better  (and perhaps end up with more stock!). Meanwhile, in Germany, you can now get 10% above spot for reselling your silver.

 

You need to set up as a dealer, and show us how it should be done! 🙂

But you didn't explain or clarify which of the two you thought was shadier. 😒

 

[LawrenceChard]

4 minutes ago, Touvex said:

Thank you! So it can be resold as bullion?

Yes, just as a donkey can be sold as a thoroughbred racehorse.

It looks like the opinion of whichever of our team wrote it that it should not be. As I have not seen the particular coin(s), then I don't know if I would agree.

I am sure our writer did not intend to say it must not be sold as bullion, rather that we think it should not be.

If it makes it any clearer, you can drive at 75 m.p.h. in a 30 limit, and some people probably do, but it is not something I would recommend.

I can also claim to be the King of China, but I am not.

🙂