2022 Sovereign design revealed?

[sovereignsteve]

3 hours ago, LawrenceChard said:

Is that Ruby Chard (there is one), Swiss Chard, or what?

I must confess I thought it was rhubarb🙄!

[Arganto]

1 minute ago, sovereignsteve said:

I must confess I thought it was rhubarb🙄!

It be rainbow chard, grew a sexton of it last year.

 

[LawrenceChard]

33 minutes ago, sovereignsteve said:

I must confess I thought it was rhubarb🙄!

No, that comes from Yorkshire!

[LawrenceChard]

31 minutes ago, Liam84 said:

It be rainbow chard, grew a sexton of it last year.

 

I didn't know any of my family were gay! 😎

[sovereignsteve]

9 minutes ago, LawrenceChard said:

No, that comes from Yorkshire!

So do I, I think that was the problem😄

[LawrenceChard]

57 minutes ago, sovereignsteve said:

I must confess I thought it was rhubarb🙄!

Now we're back to the Royal Mint mailshot!😎

[AgAuEire]

How would one reserve in advance from Chards?

[LawrenceChard]

36 minutes ago, AgAuEire said:

How would one reserve in advance from Chards?

That's another good question!

One way would be to subscribe to our mailing list. The link is on the lower RHS of our front page.

Another is to visit our relevant page(s), for example https://www.chards.co.uk/2022-gold-sovereign-elizabeth-ii-proof/15068 and click the "Add Stock Alert" button.

We don't take reservations until after we receive formal product information, and confirm supply contracts, and any RM embargo date has passed, but we should be able to accept "expressions of interest".

I will tag @ChardsCoinandBullionDealerin, and we should be able to create or enable a specific page or facility to do this.

If you prefer, you can always e-mail info@chards.co.uk, use our instant chat, or phone and speak to a real, live, helpful human being (although we are often busy, and may have to call you back).

I hope this helps. 🙂

[Heirlooms]

21 hours ago, LawrenceChard said:

More Misinformation from the Royal Mint.

In today's marketing e-mail from the RM, about the 2022 gold sovereigns, the RM say:

"Today, it is extremely rare for The Sovereign to feature a design other than Benedetto Pistrucci’s iconic depiction of St George and the dragon..."

I disagree, and I guess most other TSF member will also.

The special one-off designs in 1989, 2002, 2005, and 2012 did not feature Pistrucci's depiction, although 2005 and 2012 did have alternative versions of St George and the Dragon.

We went from 1887 to 1988 with Pistrucci's design, just over a century without change. Next year's coin will be the 5th different design in "only" 33 years.

The interval, or gaps, were therefore 101, 13, 3, 7, and 10 years between different designs. This makes these "new, different" designs anything but rare, and to call them extremely rare is gross exaggeration, propaganda, hype, and misinformation. I don't understand why the Royal Mint and its marketing team feel they need to make deceptive claims, which surely put the Royal Mint reputation for trust and integrity in jeopardy. 

I guess the same misinformation will go out to the world's media, and because most journalists don't know anything about gold sovereigns, they will simply re-publish and repeat the claims without question, the public will believe it, and a new urban myth will have come into existence.

In 1989, the statement quoted would have been true. Perhaps someone at the Mint is still using the same template, and will keep doing so as long as it keeps working. I should try and check whether they said the same thing in 2002, 2005, and 2012. It is almost certain there will be another major sovereign design change by 2026 at the latest. Dare I forecast that it will also be extremely rare? How about extremely unique?

I am sure most of us will like the new design, and want to own at least one, but it would be nice to hear the truth from the Royal Mint, instead of them sounding like snake oil salesmen.

Thoughts?

🙂

Yeah I thought the same thing when I read the copy. Most definitely disinformation however you can look at it from a different perspective. The 1989 and 2017 special reverses were significant sovereign design milestones. The 2002, 2012, 2016 and now the 2022 were/are significant QE2 milestones, the 1st being her golden jubilee. On this logic, I don’t see any of us living long enough to see a monarch reach their golden jubilee no matter how old you are and I don’t think there are any significant sovereign milestones anytime soon. We could see a baron spell in special reverse designs post 2022 and it could be the last any of us see (this of course excludes privys, strikes of the day, strikes of the month, strikes of the week etc 😅). I think the significance of QE2 sovereigns won’t be truly realised until many years into the future. Not many monarchs reign for 50th years let alone 70. Of course, this is of the assumption that our friends at the RM don’t decide some hocus pocus tomfoolery “1st year of King Charles reign special reverse sovereign” rubbish 🙄

Edited September 24, 2021 by Heirlooms

[SidS]

I'm looking forward to years of commemorative drought. The whole point (or at least the impact) is totally lost when there are commemoratives most years. The 50p and £2 coins have become ridiculous... Two, three or four every year.

Anyone else looking forward to the £2 coin commemorating the sky being blue?

Or the sovereign that commemorates the 8 minute anniversary since the previous sovereign was struck?

I'm waiting for a coin to celebrate the longevity of the mint's coffee machine.

Edited September 24, 2021 by SidS

[LawrenceChard]

On 24/09/2021 at 06:11, Heirlooms said:

Yeah I thought the same thing when I read the copy. Most definitely disinformation however you can look at it from a different perspective. The 1989 and 2017 special reverses were significant sovereign design milestones. The 2002, 2012, 2016 and now the 2022 were/are significant QE2 milestones, the 1st being her golden jubilee. On this logic, I don’t see any of us living long enough to see a monarch reach their golden jubilee no matter how old you are and I don’t think there are any significant sovereign milestones anytime soon. We could see a baron spell in special reverse designs post 2022 and it could be the last any of us see (this of course excludes privys, strikes of the day, strikes of the month, strikes of the week etc 😅). I think the significance of QE2 sovereigns won’t be truly realised until many years into the future. Not many monarchs reign for 50th years let alone 70. Of course, this is of the assumption that our friends at the RM don’t decide some hocus pocus tomfoolery “1st year of King Charles reign special reverse sovereign” rubbish 🙄

I think there will be more special reverses. They are popular, and they sell. Why not?

I think the first Charles III special reveere is likely to be for his second or third year of issue, rather than his first, depending on the exact year dates, and whether their is any historical excuse.

Of course, he may not be named Charles III, partly because Charles I didn't end well, so he might be George VII, Philip II, Arthur, or some euro style combination, or even Louis.

His full name is Charles Philip Arthur George.

Edited November 10, 2022 by LawrenceChard

[GoldStatue]

I have to agree with everything being said here, so when does the label "special reverse" lose the special tag?

They started fiddling about with it with the 2005, I like the design, but there was no reason for the release in the first place.

Instead of it just being about jubilee's and coin anniversary design milestones it's now also about the monarchs birthday, couldn't they just keep that to the £5/crown type of coins like they did before.

 

[Bruce06]

3 hours ago, LawrenceChard said:

I think there will be more special reverses. They are popular, and they sell. Why not?

I think the first Charles III special reveese is likely to be for his second or third year of issue, rather than his first, depending on the exact year dates, and whether their is any historical excuse.

Of course, he may not be name Charles III, partly because Charles I didn't end well, so he might be George VII, Philip II, Arthur, or some euro style combination, or even Louis.

His full name is Charles Philip Arthur George.

Yea, as long as an item is making money, RM will definitely go for it.  For example the QB series, you think it's over after 10, then there is a completer.  Maybe there will be a completer of completer later.

By the way, i still think the 2022 sovereign will surely be very very popular, and I will also try to get one if possible.

[LawrenceChard]

2 minutes ago, Bruce06 said:

Yea, as long as an item is making money, RM will definitely go for it.  For example the QB series, you think it's over after 10, then there is a completer.  Maybe there will be a completer of completer later.

By the way, i still think the 2022 sovereign will surely be very very popular, and I will also try to get one if possible.

I / we are trying for 5,500 to start with!

 

[Bruce06]

2 minutes ago, LawrenceChard said:

I / we are trying for 5,500 to start with!

 

5.5k😭

[Stuntman]

5,500 coins!  Hope you do manage to get that many, Lawrence.  I'll add my expression of interest for one from you.

Does the Forum reckon that this 'special reverse' will also apply to the bullion version of the 2022 sovereign, like it has done for all of them since 2000 apart from 2017 (when it had the '200' privy mark, rather than the garter reverse)?

I, for one, hope so.

[LawrenceChard]

19 hours ago, Bruce06 said:

5.5k😭

 

16 hours ago, Stuntman said:

5,500 coins!  Hope you do manage to get that many, Lawrence.  I'll add my expression of interest for one from you.

Does the Forum reckon that this 'special reverse' will also apply to the bullion version of the 2022 sovereign, like it has done for all of them since 2000 apart from 2017 (when it had the '200' privy mark, rather than the garter reverse)?

I, for one, hope so.

5,500 Sure. 

I can't remember the exact year, but the second time we bought bullion direct from the Royal Mint, our trade manager (or whatever title they used), seemingly tried to dismiss our enquiry by stating that if we wanted to enter a contract for 5,000 bullion sovereigns (their best price break at that time), we would have to take the whole lot in one single tranche, despite the fact that they do and did allow extended time for established or favourite distributors. I think I surprised her by saying yes, OK then, with little or no hesitation. We did the deal, paid, took delivery, and told them we would probably want another 5,000 in about a week's time. When we went back to take more, they had sold all their remaining stock to one or more big American bullion dealers, without checking with us if we were about to take more. The relationship continued in a similar manner for quite some time. It seemed clear to me that they did not have much commitment to supporting, or growing, the UK bullion market, yet our company and I almost certainly did more to expand it from 2000 onwards than they or any other coin and bullion dealer.

In one later year, we bought at least 650 proof sovereigns out of an issue limit of 5,000; from that I should be able to work out which year, but it was one of the special designs.

So, yes, the total figure I quoted is easily the minimum I expect we would handle. We have exceeded that quantity so far this year. I would be disappointed if we failed to do double that quantity in 2022, mainly bullion ones of course!

Design: From the privy council notice, which we publicised, and which is at the start of this entire topic, it seems clear that proof and bullion versions will use a shield or coat of arms design, although we can't rule out privy marks, special features, finishes, etc.

I had a thought earlier today:

6th February 2022 and 6nd June 2022 will both be special dates, accession and coronation. We might get two lots of SoDs (Struck in the Day), or other special issues.

@westminstrel kindly corrected me:

"Actually accession anniversary is 2022 but coronation anniversary is 2023."

So that means at least two special reverses in two years! 😎

Edited September 25, 2021 by LawrenceChard
correction

[CaptCaveMan]

On 23/09/2021 at 22:57, LawrenceChard said:

Another is to visit our relevant page(s), for example https://www.chards.co.uk/2022-gold-sovereign-elizabeth-ii-proof/15068 and click the "Add Stock Alert" button.

I hope this helps. 🙂

Thank-you @LawrenceChard, account created and stock alert added🙂

I'll have to scan my documents to upgrade my account tier over the weekend...

Edited September 24, 2021 by CaptCaveMan

[Bruce06]

10 hours ago, LawrenceChard said:

I / we are trying for 5,500 to start with!

 

I misunderstand and think you are joking about the pricing😅....stupid me

Edited September 25, 2021 by Bruce06

[westminstrel]

5 hours ago, LawrenceChard said:

6th February 2022 and 6nd June 2022 will both be special dates, accession and coronation. We might get two lots of SoDs (Struck in the Day), or other special issues.

Actually accession anniversary is 2022 but coronation anniversary is 2023.

 

[SidS]

Don't forget the Queen's 100th birthday in 2026, assuming she makes it.

Then there's the 75th anniversary of accession in 2027 and ditto coronation in 2028. They'll cover them all no doubt, if the Queen is still reigning at that point, and to be fair there is every chance.

Edited September 25, 2021 by SidS
Punctuation.

[LawrenceChard]

7 hours ago, westminstrel said:

Actually accession anniversary is 2022 but coronation anniversary is 2023.

 

Quite right!

Am I losing track of time?

So that's definitely two special reverses (at least) in two years!

[LawrenceChard]

9 hours ago, Bruce06 said:

I misunderstand and think you are joking about the pricing😅....stupid me

What, you thought I meant £5,000? 😎

[LawrenceChard]

5 hours ago, SidS said:

Don't forget the Queen's 100th birthday in 2026, assuming she makes it.

Then there's the 75th anniversary of accession in 2027 and ditto coronation in 2028. They'll cover them all no doubt, if the Queen is still reigning at that point, and to be fair there is every chance.

In which case, the RM ought to put in a "banker", and do a 99th birthday issue (they missed out for Prince Philip). My design suggestion would be 99 Red Balloons. they could do a premium edition, complete with a C.D. of Nena. This would also be a nod to the royal family's German heritage.

No colour printing would be necessary because of the stupid red gold. 😎

Edited September 25, 2021 by LawrenceChard
apostrophe

[CaptCaveMan]

So does the 2022 Platinum Jubilee Medal, designed by Timothy Noad give us an indication?