2020 Una and the Lion

[HighlandTiger]

On 13/10/2020 at 16:36, Kman said:

Seems like a classic bubble to me

We're somewhere in the mania phase

Again as said above it's not just coins it's most collectible markets where currency has pooled

I'm hoping some time in 2021 will be a good time for cash buyers to get into things

 

Yeah I intend to sell my gold and silver around the "delusion phase", (which I estimate will be around the time the GSR drops to below 45) and then hold cash until the despair phase to rebuy only gold. No point me buying silver again because I'll be long retired by the time the next silver bull run occurs.

Currently I think we are in the first sell off stage, we havn't had the media attention yet, (probably suppressed naturally due to COVID and Trump getting re-elected grabbing the headlines)

[HighlandTiger]

1 hour ago, Oldun said:

That is a brilliant question at the end. Love the challenge. Are you referring to proof coins or bullion or any ? I also assume you would require a consideration for rates of inflation and real rates if inflation. Also, what should it all be measured against ? 

How about we let the Bank of England decided.

Find a retail price of any coin made in the 1970's. And use the website below to find out its value today.

https://www.bankofengland.co.uk/monetary-policy/inflation/inflation-calculator

It's interesting to note that in the mid 70's silver was around £3 an oz, that would be worth about £19 an oz after inflation. Meaning if you had bought silver at what seems to be an extremely low price, and held it for over 40 odd years you would have made a profit of absolutely hee haw. If we had done this exercise a few months ago before the jump in prices, then you'd have made a loss.

[Oldun]

 

 

Silver is famous for spiking once in a generation to garner profit, if that. Dangerous metal to hold if in the wrong cycle. Gold, less dangerous but freezes purchasing power in the main and is purely a hedge aginst governments in my book. Mind you, it is a bit disingenous to focus solely on the negatives. Some folks knew when to sell and would have done very well indeed. However, for that minority to have done very well, the majority would have had to have not realised any profits, or indeed lost money.
Proof coins ? That is a very different game and to keep this thread on topic, the Una and the Lion has smacked it out of the park....a very nice rarity for any modern coin. 
 

1970 Lincoln Memorial Penny.....go for serious bucks.

2009 20p without date

1980s 2p with 2 pence vs 2 new pence

50p Kew Gardens

the list is quite long if you get involved in looking.

Edited October 18, 2020 by Oldun

[Kman]

The silver proofs price is totally unnatural

When it first came out it went to £300 pretty instantly, understandable, it was up to £500 maybe in August after 10 months out, that's a lot but reasonable - 2 months later £2000 without anything changing? after already being out 10 months ..

Nope doesn't make any sense, no one can justify the price, wont last 

 

 

[HighlandTiger]

2 hours ago, Oldun said:

 

2009 20p without date

1980s 2p with 2 pence vs 2 new pence

50p Kew Gardens

the list is quite long if you get involved in looking.

All those were error coins or unplanned low mintages.

None of them were created deliberately for the collectors market. 

I'm still waiting for a collector's coin from the 70's that has made any profit what so ever.

[AurumArgenti]

 

This is my Una. There are many others like it, but this one is mine. My Una is my best friend. It is my life. 😉😂

[Elements]

Wow just wow
 

lot »

https://www.biddr.com/auctions/mdcmonaco/browse?a=1285&l=1362546

some other fantastic coins in this auction too

[TheShinyStuff]

22 minutes ago, AurumArgenti said:

 

This is my Una. There are many others like it, but this one is mine. My Una is my best friend. It is my life. 😉😂

No major malfunctions either! Beautiful.

[jultorsk]

14 minutes ago, Elements said:

Wow just wow
 

lot »

https://www.biddr.com/auctions/mdcmonaco/browse?a=1285&l=1362546

some other fantastic coins in this auction too

I sometimes ponder if I would've had the wits or the funds to buy these back in the late 60's.. (likely not). Glorious coin - and as you said, many others as well in that auction.

"An early encounter I had was with the great London coin dealer Geoffrey Hearn, who took three Una and the Lion £5 pieces from his pocket and wanted £1,800 for them. Not £1,800 each, but £1,800 for all three, the only problem was, who had £1,800 or the equivalent of $5,200 in those days? I paid my first secretary £15 a week and that was 50% more than she was earning in her previous job."

https://news.coinupdate.com/is-it-time-to-re-think-the-secondary-coin-market/

[westminstrel]

1 hour ago, AurumArgenti said:

 

This is my Una. There are many others like it, but this one is mine. My Una is my best friend. It is my life. 😉😂

Can your Una be my Una? 😂🤣

[sovereignsteve]

9 hours ago, HighlandTiger said:

'm still waiting for a collector's coin from the 70's that has made any profit what so ever.

were there many or any at all? I wasn't collecting then so have no idea of what was being issued, nor have I seen any materialise since.

[goldmember44]

10 hours ago, AurumArgenti said:

 

This is my Una. There are many others like it, but this one is mine. My Una is my best friend. It is my life. 😉😂

You should have it graded, looks like a 70

Also, it gets protected in the slab for long term. 

[Oldun]

On 18/10/2020 at 20:43, HighlandTiger said:

All those were error coins or unplanned low mintages.

None of them were created deliberately for the collectors market. 

I'm still waiting for a collector's coin from the 70's that has made any profit what so ever.

If you change the definition of a collector’s coin to exclude die errors etc., then I don’t follow you. These coins ARE collector’s items, so can’t play your game, sorry.

 

Edited October 19, 2020 by Oldun

[HighlandTiger]

17 minutes ago, Oldun said:

If you change the definition of a collector’s coin to exclude die errors etc., then I don’t follow you. These coins ARE collector’s items, so can’t play your game, sorry.

 

My original point was about coins deliberately (note the word deliberately) created for the modern collectors market. Such as the coin being discussed in this thread. 

It's interesting to note that no-one has been able to come up with a single example of a collector's coin not only holding its value but making a profit.(other than short term flipping).

Which is something to consider if you are hoping for some profit on your collection of modern collectibles  when it comes to your retirement. 

[sovereignsteve]

21 minutes ago, HighlandTiger said:

My original point was about coins deliberately (note the word deliberately) created for the modern collectors market. Such as the coin being discussed in this thread. 

It's interesting to note that no-one has been able to come up with a single example of a collector's coin not only holding its value but making a profit.(other than short term flipping).

Which is something to consider if you are hoping for some profit on your collection of modern collectibles  when it comes to your retirement. 

I note you haven't answered my question about exactly what collector's coins you are referring to from the 70s.

You can't issue a challenge for examples unless you know they actually exist. Personally I can't think of even one that was issued to collectors from that decade. People collected old circulation and bullion coins. As far as I can see, the issuing of special edition coins for collectors didn't really start until the 80s and wasn't widespread until the 90s.

There are numerous examples from the Perth Mint's Kook and Lunar series that have made good profits. The 1989 range of proof sovereigns are another obvious example. However, I don't know how much some of these cost originally so haven't taken inflation into consideration.

However, the gist of what you say has merit and is becoming increasingly true as the mints saturate the market with over-priced rubbish, the vast majority of which will lose their buyers money long term.

[DarkChameleon]

I don't know if my Churchill coin and silver jubilee coins ever went up in value, my mom bought me the Churchill from midland Bank in the mid 70s I think, I was only about ten, still have them, not silver but they were my first coins that I kept, do you consider them collectables?

[AurumArgenti]

15 hours ago, goldmember44 said:

You should have it graded, looks like a 70

Also, it gets protected in the slab for long term. 

I do plan on getting it graded. I was hoping for the next in the series to be released so I could send off a few at once.

🙂👍

 

 

 

[Kman]

Silver proof graded 69 sold on Ebay for £2761 😐

[HighlandTiger]

9 hours ago, sovereignsteve said:

I note you haven't answered my question about exactly what collector's coins you are referring to from the 70s.

You can't issue a challenge for examples unless you know they actually exist. Personally I can't think of even one that was issued to collectors from that decade. People collected old circulation and bullion coins. As far as I can see, the issuing of special edition coins for collectors didn't really start until the 80s and wasn't widespread until the 90s.

There are numerous examples from the Perth Mint's Kook and Lunar series that have made good profits. The 1989 range of proof sovereigns are another obvious example. However, I don't know how much some of these cost originally so haven't taken inflation into consideration.

However, the gist of what you say has merit and is becoming increasingly true as the mints saturate the market with over-priced rubbish, the vast majority of which will lose their buyers money long term.

There were plenty of silver proofs being released in the 70's mostly of the crown size. Usually to commemorate royal events, weddings etc. From countries all around the commonwealth.  I sold a number of them on this very forum a few days ago 

 

Plenty to choose from  😁

Edited October 19, 2020 by HighlandTiger

[HighlandTiger]

9 hours ago, DarkChameleon said:

I don't know if my Churchill coin and silver jubilee coins ever went up in value, my mom bought me the Churchill from midland Bank in the mid 70s I think, I was only about ten, still have them, not silver but they were my first coins that I kept, do you consider them collectables?

They are collectibles in the sense that everyone collected them. They were worth 25p new, and you'd be lucky to sell one today for that price. The Churchill coin is actually from 1965, the year Churchill died. The silver jubilee coin from 77 was another one that everyone had.

[Frenchie]

30 minutes ago, Kman said:

Silver proof graded 69 sold on Ebay for £2761 😐

Yes and surprisingly, a graded 69 was sold less than 1 hour before for half that price  (£1360). The buyer has made a nice deal, but I don't understand how this coin has been under the radar 

[sovereignsteve]

26 minutes ago, HighlandTiger said:

There were plenty of silver proofs being released in the 70's mostly of the crown size. Usually to commemorate royal events, weddings etc. From countries all around the commonwealth.  I sold a number of them on this very forum a few days ago 

 

Plenty to choose from  😁

Ah yes, those sterling comms. I don't think any of them ever made a profit even as a quick flip!

[GoodAsGold]

On 18/10/2020 at 14:00, Elements said:

Wow just wow
 

lot »

https://www.biddr.com/auctions/mdcmonaco/browse?a=1285&l=1362546

some other fantastic coins in this auction too

I wish you hadn’t told everybody. Now we’ll all be bidding against each other.

[DarkChameleon]

20 hours ago, HighlandTiger said:

They are collectibles in the sense that everyone collected them. They were worth 25p new, and you'd be lucky to sell one today for that price. The Churchill coin is actually from 1965, the year Churchill died. The silver jubilee coin from 77 was another one that everyone had.

I found out the commoness about 20 years ago when walking into an antiques shop there was about full of them..lol.

[spazmodic]

On 11/10/2020 at 10:29, BrumChris said:

Ungraded silver Una appears to have sold for £2700 on EBay. 

One ungraded in Original Packaging sold yesterday on Ebay in the US for just under $5,000.    Prices have escalated rapidly in the last few months.