Time to drag the Royal Mint's business model in to this century?

[BarryWoods]

Thoughts

 

 - now that there has been a recent sudden interest in Royal Mint products, products selling out. Feeding Frenzy, etc = should the VIP access be should be abolished-  is it in fact damaging the Royal Mint brand.

[Note my account Manager had said she could possibly get what I wanted, going forward, so not sour grapes, I could get coins, but is it fair to the public?)

 

That  a more standardize luxury Goods Business business model established - ie Authorized Retailers etc would be better for the Royal Mint brand?

Maybe at different levels of brand, price points, or sub brand - Engravers, Monarch (high end) Tudor Beasts Mid range) , etc other gold and silver sub brand ranges. etc

Allocations agreed with  authorized dealer network, international authorized dealer networks, transparency, TRUST,  now, all should have similar access, not how much money you have to get access, and the instant flipping speculating will stop, and the public and collectors will  want the product, not the profits.  (that alone should make the quality of the product improve)

 

What has puzzled me with Coin series like the Great engravers, why aren't high end Jewelers  having say the Great Engravers range, The Monarch range, say in the on higher weights 5oz..(or selected sizes)  in stock and maybe a very few other premium Royal Mint products

 

The Royal Mint would reach a wider luxury goods market.. there surely would be more demand?

 

The more old school coin dealers could focus on their specialties, historic, modern sovereign, maybe select some of the higher brands or not. or evolve as well. It could work for all. Nobody is cut out of the market, it expands and gets healthier.

 

Proofs - Change the capsule so it is vacuum sealed for life - to a (68 Proof and maybe above standard) and be like Rolls Royce in the old days and say - it is good enough for us, we don't need to tell you how much power.(pr grade, 68,69,70).

So if the USA collectors, etc want it graded - they have to break the Royal Mint Seal, and send it off to grading. and the Royal Mint, with theory thousand year history they keep remind us, look slight down on such 'vulgarity'

 

Maybe in time the Royal Mint ungraded product will be the collectible premium desirable coin, in all of it's presentation box, packaging, COA, and history..

 

[sorry, just hate slabbed coins] 

 

Thoughts?

 

ie Brand Management

 

-- Lots of thoughts in my head today - Former Product Marketing Manager and Former Product Manager - Cartier, Tiffany, Rolex are not like this!!! 

[Shinus73]

As a business, the Mint are smashing it.

Sell out after sell out of the high profile stuff, at high premiums, with many others disappointed in the queue - all despite shabby QC.

Why would they change anything?

The Marque system rewards people who spend the most money with them, which again, seems like reasonable business practice to me.

[Gordy]

I'll sell you my portrait if you want if it will help you get over it!! 🤣

[Darr3nG]

17 minutes ago, Gordy said:

my portrait

Self portrait?  

[AppleZippoandMetronome]

I understand your frustration and agree that the latest Engravers launches have been rather botched by the RM. There is certainly a lot the RM could do to ensure coins get into the hands of collectors especially when a series takes off like the Great Engravers but I think the points @Shinus73 makes are very right - the current model is working for them so why alter it. It may not be working for you or other collectors who now have a hole in their collections but it works for the RM very well it would seem so I honestly can't see them changing. I've stated around the forum how I think they could help collectors and will send that advice to them but I don't expect anything will come of it.

They're there to make and sell coins end of the day and they seem to be doing that very well. Most businesses will reward high spenders with access. My understanding is that this is common across the luxury goods market. You want the Rolex or Ferrari that is exclusive and sure to rise in value... you better be prepared to spend a lot of money with them buying less desireable" items first. I don't see how this is any different. Most coins are losers and for every graded Gothic Crown portrait the Coin Connection sells at a big (though likely fair) uplift they have how many stacks of silver proof 50p's that aren't going anywhere? I don't begrudge any business in finding a way to create uplift in order to balance the books and remain profitable.

[BarryWoods]

because a lot of  Mint Marque 'people' appear to be traders and coin business owners! - not  the assumption of just rich private collectors, topping up their collection, that spend a lot, rarely sell.

(What is the proportion  of 'trader types' vs actual collectors in the scheme only the RM know. Some are definitely limited Ltd companies, some would be classified as sole trader by their activities, by HMRC.)

 

They are Mint Marque customers, who are also trading as coin sellers and  do not seem to know the concept of RRP. Lets just mark it up as much as the market will take, logic

When coins hit websites, whether owned by the Mint Marque Customers or associates of them, or Facebook groups ran by them, or they flip instantly on Ebay at multiples of what the price is at the Royal Mint.

It is not in the consumers interest, nor would I say the long term interest of the Royal Mint, When. The. Consumers. Find. Out ( a lot of people are going to get hurt)

 

The public think they are the first purchaser, from a Royal Mint supplied dealer for a product paying RRP.

How would they be expected to realize that is not the case on the actual launch date of a product, or after. And the Royal MINT must know this is happening.

 

When the public find out, the rip off, the price hikes, etc  lots of the public may be 'upset... And they will find out

Unless the Royal Mint gets into this century with it's business model I will certainly never by a proof coin again and will certainly explain why to others

 

My Patience is wearing thin...............................................  I think if the Mint does not take action, something needs to be done to protect the public......

[BarryWoods]

39 minutes ago, Gordy said:

I'll sell you my portrait if you want if it will help you get over it!! 🤣

I'd take it out of the capsule and use it as a door stop =  i'm disposing of all my proof coins, cancelled all orders, removed all funds from RM

 

(and one well established bullion dealer, no longer list RM as it's coin supplier. and has removed all Royal Mint logo and 'blurb' from it's Trusted Partner website page, where Royal Mint WAS listed as a Trusted Partner this morning..)

 

And I've not even started being cross yet.

[NewCoins]

1 minute ago, BarryWoods said:

I'd take it out of the capsule and use it as a door stop =  i'm disposing of all my proof coins, cancelled all orders, removed all funds from RM

 

(and one well established bullion dealer, no longer list RM as it's coin supplier. and has removed all Royal Mint logo and 'blurb' from it's Trusted Partner website page, where Royal Mint WAS listed as a Trusted Partner this morning..)

 

And I've not even started being cross yet.

Sleep on it Barry. What exactly has annoyed you today ?

[Shinus73]

7 minutes ago, BarryWoods said:

When the public find out, the rip off, the price hikes, etc  lots of the public may be 'upset... And they will find out

They already know.
Nobody who bought from a dealer this morning thought they were paying RRP. 
I happen to agree that charging multiples of RRP on the day of release is shabby, and I’ve said that before on here (£2,700 for a 2 Oz three graces, an hour after it sold out at the mint), but everybody knows the game and has a choice.

[Petra]

1 minute ago, Shinus73 said:

They already know.
Nobody who bought from a dealer this morning thought they were paying RRP. 
I happen to agree that charging multiples of RRP on the day of release is shabby, and I’ve said that before on here (£2,700 for a 2 Oz three graces, an hour after it sold out at the mint), but everybody knows the game and has a choice.

 

1 minute ago, Shinus73 said:

They already know.
Nobody who bought from a dealer this morning thought they were paying RRP. 
I happen to agree that charging multiples of RRP on the day of release is shabby, and I’ve said that before on here (£2,700 for a 2 Oz three graces, an hour after it sold out at the mint), but everybody knows the game and has a choice.

Like anything, you don’t have to buy it!

[James32]

Rolex are not like this!!! 

Rolex are market leaders in this model lol....you think they don't know what's going on with their watches?

I mean this respectively.....you did not purchase from the mint originally so why where you expecting one today?

The market has shifted since you're first purchase and again that's not down to RM.

I do agree they should make some changes to their business model and especially website management, but as the old saying goes unfortunately "don't hate the player hate the game"

We...us....the people created this hysteria and no doubt will continue to keep it going.

 

 

 

[Gordy]

17 minutes ago, NewCoins said:

Sleep on it Barry. What exactly has annoyed you today ?

That is funny mate, seriously, over 160 pages on the thread and probably 100 been added just today lol... 

[Gordy]

3 minutes ago, James32 said:

Rolex are not like this!!! 

Rolex are market leaders in this model lol....you think they don't know what's going on with their watches?

I mean this respectively.....you did not purchase from the mint originally so why where you expecting one today?

The market has shifted since you're first purchase and again that's not down to RM.

I do agree they should make some changes to their business model and especially website management, but as the old saying goes unfortunately "don't hate the player hate the game"

We...us....the people created this hysteria and no doubt will continue to keep it going.

 

 

 

Yeah and imagine ordering a silver proof and being told "you're on the waiting list, it'll be with you in 18 months"  and we'll get Gordon Ramsay to deliver it with a ribbon ... Gordy will deliver for nowt if he gets a free cup of tea for his trouble

[FlorinCollector]

No. To it all

[BarryWoods]

Absolutely - My wife is an authorized Cartier and Tiffany Retailer -  No other company in the luxury goods market would behave like this..

 

yes there are specuial customers, say Ferrari  if they by lots of stuff (probably suffering big losses when resold) , then they might get on the list for really special stuff, and at RRP..

BUT - If they flipped it, for instant speculative profit, they would never be on the list again, they might even be banned form buying say any Ferrari at all

 

Royal Mint special customers, seem to be a bit different,

You can point at whatever they want from a big list , and flog it to public trade, be trade yoursel multiple mark up, flipping for instant profits.. and keep coming back for more..!!

slightly different!

 

Royal Mint are aware of my concerns now.

 

This is NOT how Rolex operate!!!

[FlorinCollector]

Try buy a rolex anytime in the next 6 months from an AD. Any model other than a datejust

[Petra]

1 minute ago, BarryWoods said:

Absolutely - My wife is an authorized Cartier and Tiffany Retailer -  No other company in the luxury goods market would behave like this..

 

yes there are specuial customers, say Ferrari  if they by lots of stuff (probably suffering big losses when resold) , then they might get on the list for really special stuff, and at RRP..

BUT - If they flipped it, for instant speculative profit, they would never be on the list again, they might even be banned form buying say any Ferrari at all

 

Royal Mint special customers, seem to be a bit different,

You can point at whatever they want from a big list , and flog it to public trade, be trade yoursel multiple mark up, flipping for instant profits.. and keep coming back for more..!!

slightly different!

 

Royal Mint are aware of my concerns now.

 

This is NOT how Rolex operate!!!

So how would the mint know that I owned the fancy coin for a day and sold it for a profit? 

[BarryWoods]

Just now, FlorinCollector said:

Try buy a rolex anytime in the next 6 months from an AD. Any model other than a datejust

That is NOT the same.. Any special customer flipping it, on EBAY for goodness sake would be ex special customer

 

There were two plain edge coins on ebay - 5 minutes past midnight today. 8 hours before the launch that did not happen.. Grief  

[Paul]

2 minutes ago, BarryWoods said:

This is NOT how Rolex operate!!!

Point me to a Rolex AD where I can buy an instock Daytonas over the counter tomorrow at list RRP and i will personally gift you my own 2oz gold you've missed out on, cos I could resell them all by close of business tomorrow and rebuy it in secondary market with the profits 

[FlorinCollector]

@BarryWoods not true at all. Do you believe when high end watches are flipped these people are blacklisted. Not a chance. Some of the small players are to look good but Rolex love what their watches achieve on the grey market.

[FlorinCollector]

I would understand your point Barry if you bought the quartered arms from the mint and then missed out due to the fact they f***** up.

You bought on the secondary market. 

[BarryWoods]

because the really dumb people doing it have there name on the ebay profile, the Facebook group they ran, and the their account manager knows who they are - Rolex keep an eye on stuff like this, and where there product turn up after launch, as does Cartier , etc etc..This is luxury good not barrow boy market trading-  Good Grief.  And even if they were not that obvious, special VIP product only would be watched for in the market place, where it ends up, gets auction.. it is called protecting the brand ( a thousand year Heritage, the Royal Mint use in all their marketing, with the ultimate celebrity endorsement literally stamped on every product they make - Queen Elisabeth II

 

I don't think Queeny really needs a  public consumer scandal with the heritage of the UK 'Royal' and her face on  all the products, just about now?!!

4 minutes ago, Paul said:

Point me to a Rolex AD where I can buy an instock Daytonas over the counter tomorrow at list RRP and i will personally gift you my own 2oz gold you've missed out on, cos I could resell them all by close of business tomorrow and rebuy it in secondary market with the profits 

this is NOT what is hapening....

 

[FlorinCollector]

Why did you basically endorse the secondary market by buying there. If you were so against it why did you pay the stupid price?

[BarryWoods]

3 minutes ago, FlorinCollector said:

I would understand your point Barry if you bought the quartered arms from the mint and then missed out due to the fact they f***** up.

You bought on the secondary market. 

This is not buyers remorse... this is shocking business practice - I've been a Product Manager, Product Marketing Manager - My wife is an authorised Cartier, Tiffany and other luxury retailer.

Trading standards and consumer rights people are going to have 'kittens' over this. 

 

Coins are the wild west and their are cowboys everywhere...

1 minute ago, FlorinCollector said:

Why did you basically endorse the secondary market by buying there. If you were so against it why did you pay the stupid price?

My point is this is NOT secondary market!!! - 

[FlorinCollector]

The Royal Mint are going to laugh you out the door.