Auctions Including Fake or Highly Suspect Gold Sovereigns

[LawrenceChard]

I and other TSF members have noticed a number of auction houses listing obvious counterfeit sovereigns for sale.

This would be a good place to post them.

It is probably not worth including any on ebay which should have its own section, but "local" auctioneers and even specialist numismatic auction houses appear to list fake sovereigns without properly cataloguing them, so innocent buyers could become victims.

I will link a few recent ones here.

Please feel free to add any suspicious ones, but try to include a link to the actual auction and lot number, not just a screenshot.

😎

[LawrenceChard]

This was last year, but I only recently realised the auction house had never contacted me to say thanks, or otherwise let me know the outcome, which I thought was unprofessional, and very poor practice:

This was Frühwald of Vienna Austria

Edited April 11, 2022 by LawrenceChard

[monkstax]

What a good idea, I am sure this will benefit many of the members here!

 

[MJCOIN]

Great idea. I have a feeling this thread will be busy.

[LawrenceChard]

Questionable authenticity on sovereigns

 

45 fakes in just two photos!

Unknown European auction house.

 

[LawrenceChard]

1957 Gold Sovereign - Striking Error or Fake?

Royal Berkshire Sovereign collection at St James Auctions

[LawrenceChard]

Another suspect sovereign being auctioned.

 

https://www.easyliveauction.com/catalogue/lot/7a61f783a129b9de62607bc164e0d597/0af8d24542e81eb9357e7ef448a6646f/general-sale-viewing-and-room-bidding-available-lot-111/

A non-existent 1918 London Mint, very obvious fake!

Sold for Hammer £300

Edited April 11, 2022 by LawrenceChard

[LawrenceChard]

What makes this worth £5k plus 1917 Sovereign?

 

Yet another 1917 London Mint fake sovereign.

[Bruce06]

Very nice idea, as we can learn through these fake sovereign photos n reduce chance of making mistakes to buy a counterfeit one.  Sadly, this post may become one of the hottest posts in this forum😅

[Foster88]

Great idea as a thread @LawrenceChard

From one of The Golden Girls herself.... this is quite apt.

I think this is the opinion of a numismatist or the emerging numismatist in all of us. 😆

Edited April 12, 2022 by Foster88

[MJCOIN]

Aside from not checking the authenticity of coins I've seen several auction houses remove proof sovereigns from their capsules so they can take photographs of them, in the process destroying their value by leaving them marked.

The term 'proof sovereign' seems to get used to describe bullion sovereigns quite regularly too.

Edited April 12, 2022 by MJCOIN

[GoldDiggerDave]

@MJCOIN Taking a proof out of the capsule to take photos in the norm, I would not trust a run of the mill auction house to do this.  Watching some of these people handle coins makes by blood boil. There's a pawn broker near me who displays sovereigns with doubled up sticky tape and sticks them up and the staff are clueless,  I do go in and check for rare dates from time to time, I did buy a great 2014 proof sovereign in a capsule they thought it was a bullion 😂😂😂

 

[sovereignsteve]

The non-specialist auction houses shouldn't be selling coins at all as they haven't a clue as to authenticity etc.

[sovereignsteve]

It wasn't so bad before internet buying as only local buyers had the chance to inspect and buy. In general you had local buyers without a clue and paying too much from auctioneers who were also clueless.😁

it did open up opportunities for local buyers who did know what they were doing though🙂

Edited April 12, 2022 by sovereignsteve

[xthomasx]

I had another case in January. WAG (an auction house where I am bidding quite a lot) had this lot of sovereigns, including 1918 and 1919 without mintmarks:

https://www.sixbid.com/de/wag-online-auktionen-ohg/9169/lots-goldmunzen/7777652/grobritannien-sovereign-1911-c-fbidis-ltrpar?term=893

I notified the auction house, and the lot was withdrawn very fast.

Now, three months and three auctions later, the 1919 piece (or a very similar one; with the same *really* big second 9) was auctioned off as part of another lot, and sold:

https://www.sixbid.com/de/wag-online-auktionen-ohg/9435/lots-goldmunzen/8045192/grobritannien-sovereign-1910-1912-1913

 

[dicker]

I left a review of a very small and odd gold coin shop in Norfolk.  They had little stock and the proprietor had a small box of loose coins that he produced. The coins were out of capsules and just rattling around.  He said something along the lines of:

”These are the really valuable ones, they are proof”.

As he tipped them out on the counter as one might a tube of smarties at a childrens party, I politely decline further inspection.

[Foster88]

2 hours ago, dicker said:

The coins were out of capsules and just rattling around.

That reminds me, who else sold coins like this. 🤔

Oh yeah, the RM with the 2022 proof sovereign.

[GoldDiggerDave]

3 minutes ago, Foster88 said:

That reminds me, who else sold coins like this. 🤔

Oh yeah, the RM with the 2022 proof sovereign.

Just got 2 proof 1/2 2022 sovereign from the Perth mint and I could not get the capsules open they were so tight!…….And they have been shipped half way around the planet. 

[Foster88]

30 minutes ago, GoldDiggerDave said:

Just got 2 proof 1/2 2022 sovereign from the Perth mint and I could not get the capsules open they were so tight!…….And they have been shipped half way around the planet. 

You couldn’t make that up really.

Did they have the foam inserts that they added later?

[manofstone]

Hi All,

My first time posting, so please treat me gently and please, please ring me in the morning!

Read this great thread a couple of days so thanks to ALL especially Mr Chard. It set alarm bells ringing on my minuscule collection.

Just purchased a 1817 at auction am yet to settle the account so any help on the authenticity of this one would be appreciated 

The same auction had a 1922 London mint listed, pointed that one out to them and it was withdrawn from sale, now likely hanging on their Christmas tree.

Consequently have concerns on this, tree decoration? any thoughts? and thanks

N.B. it lists the gross weight at 9.5 grms

[stefffana]

2 hours ago, manofstone said:

Hi All,

My first time posting, so please treat me gently and please, please ring me in the morning!

Read this great thread a couple of days so thanks to ALL especially Mr Chard. It set alarm bells ringing on my minuscule collection.

Just purchased a 1817 at auction am yet to settle the account so any help on the authenticity of this one would be appreciated 

The same auction had a 1922 London mint listed, pointed that one out to them and it was withdrawn from sale, now likely hanging on their Christmas tree.

Consequently have concerns on this, tree decoration? any thoughts? and thanks

N.B. it lists the gross weight at 9.5 grms

I really don't know...😓😓😓

@dicker, do you have an opinion, Sir?

[Petra]

Probably the least ‘expert’ on here, however, to my untrained eye the 1s in the date look a bit strange compared to a picture of what I know is a genuine one? 🤔⛄️

[manofstone]

I have couple of concerns.

1. Put a commission bid on, then went to view. It seemed rather shiny for its age, thought it just may have been polished. But reduced the commission bid but couldn't remove it completely.

2. This left the bid at the opening price of £750 below the estimate of £800-£1200 , so wasn't worried as expected some one to bid in the estimate range. On the day of the sale mine was the only bid! yet there was a proper dealer in the room snapping all the other sovereigns. 

So 1. too shiny 2. no body else wanted it!

 

1 hour ago, stefffana said:

I really don't know...😓😓😓

@dicker, do you have an opinion, Sir?

 

[Booky586]

6 hours ago, Petra said:

Probably the least ‘expert’ on here, however, to my untrained eye the 1s in the date look a bit strange compared to a picture of what I know is a genuine one? 🤔⛄️

Yes, I agree. The font is supposed to have a serif, compare it to image a genuine coin below, courtesy of sovereign rarities

I don't think yours is genuine ☹️

[manofstone]

OUCH ! KICK ME, .... but many thanks to Petra and Booky.......  feel the typo comparison might be correct.

In a past life had a graphic design company so know my serifs from my sans, but clearly not on coins.

Others out here please kick me some more1