silenceissilver

1 hour ago, sixgun said:

i call it fraud and criminal but the powers that should not be give it the green light. 

This wording could also be seen as a demand for more regulation. Just to anyone who might read it that way - we have too many regulations, not too few. It's the original green light that's the problem - the green light to print money as a cartel which actually means there is a red light for anyone else to offer money (e.g. gold backed) which really is the problem.

1 hour ago, HighlandTiger said:

The only problem I see with this scenario, is that if the reddit guys succeed in their plans of bringing down hedge funds and banks, then the already fecked economy is going to get an even bigger hit. The stock market crashes as everyone sells their long positions to cover their shorts, the economy crashes, inflation rises, unemployment rises, austerity goes back on the table, peoples pension pots decrease massively, and we're all screwed.

Whilst the reddit lemmings are thinking they are sticking it to the man, they are actually in danger of destroying their own lives.

The only hope on the horizon, is that all these bored people sitting at home isolating, pretending to be day traders, will eventually go back to work and p!ssing their wages away down the pub/bookies/casino, instead of the SM, or they lose all their cash because they weren't quick enough to sell at a profit.

Being part of a massive group sticking it to the government, is all well and good but you have to live with your actions afterwards.

By trying to see the bigger picture, I'm now, hoping that the reddit craze gets stomped on and crushed by the big guys,......The damage they could cause is just not worth it. 

Of course the economy will crash and anything could be the black swan event, also this. So don't blame them for potentially triggering it. As a matter of fact when it crashes I would rather have it been triggered not by the powers that shouldn't be as they would, in this case, have most control over what would happen next. And next will be the battle between socialism and freedom. The powers that be will try to use it as catalyst for their so called Great Reset (which would rather be a transformation after a reset).  Maybe this whole thing is a false flag in order to be able to blame very evil white supremacist Nazis Trump supporters for the fiat crash, in the first place. I don't think that's very likely the case at all but neither can one just take the predominant narrative as if it was an established fact.

About £2400 after a high of ca. £2700.

I think what all previous answers miss, is the effects of the lockdowns, instead most seem to project the present into the future in a linear way. What has piled up in the economy, will break out and likely so in 2021. As a matter of fact, if this happens, my prediction is still very conservative. Yet, there is no guarantee and piling up could continue for yet another year. In that case I'd say 5% above it's all time high.

34 minutes ago, Dimitri said:

Am wondering if purchasing from abroad solves the problem?

For 2.5K it hardly pays off to go abroad for buying it I guess but maybe it does somewhat with a 50 Pound Ryan Air flight if you get away with 100 Pounds altogether for the whole trip. I have bought one ounce in a shop in Vienna, where also nobody asked for an ID. I also brought it to the UK in my hand laguage. They will see the metal in the scanner but no one said anything in may case and the limit for bringing it here is 10K as far as I know. However, if you are unlucky, they might want to see it and then it's not anonymous, any longer - if they take notes of it. Till Last year you could have gone to Germany but they have lowered their limit from 10K to only 2K with the turn of the year.

Theoretically, the limit is 5000 Pounds as far as I know but unfortunately, some dealers ask for an ID at any purchase. That's also the case because the limit is not just 5K for one purchase but per year and obviously they could forget you after a few weeks or months, so there is a grey area and they want to cover themselves - also one member here said, they are under pressure from the authorities. Of course it has nothing to to with preventing money laundering (that's done with fake businesses) but with a paranoid state.

I have once bought only 2 Sovereigns at a well known London dealer who wanted to see an ID but also 5 Sovereigns at once and a few more over the same year at an unknown local jeweller. However, his prices were not particularly good.

I think the objection, if you don't have to hide anything, you don't need to worry leaving your ID there is not thought through. I don't do anything abnormal on the toilet too, yet I would not like a record of it stored at a shop or even the government. History - and the present - have shown time and again, you can't trust governments. The reset is coming closer, it's principally unavoidable in a fiat system and the powers that be talk openly about it now (e.g. at the World Economic Forum). Of course many people will lose their savings in this process and the government will grab everything they can. I think a literal gold confiscation is yet unlikely as their are much easier ways to get much bigger amounts, from the people. However, chances are that they will continue to make it more difficult, add more taxes etc, around gold. That is unless their attempts to install socialism backfire, of course.

So, you can only look for more bullion dealers/jewellers till you find one that doesn't require an ID. I have also once bought a Sovereign at a pawn shop, they didn't ask for an ID either, however, their sell (and buy) prices are often (but not always) really bad. But trying them out is most likely a wast of time, chances are really low there. Try small and unknown jewellers and shops that offer antiquities.

13 minutes ago, dga00 said:

I do not understand why people are making fun of a man's opinion.
This thread was started in March, when gold price took a small dive. And maybe, under "normal" economical circumstances, the price would have gone even lower for a short while.
But let's remember what happened in the mean time:
- PPP(payroll protection program)
- stimulus checks
- eviction moratoriums
- unemployment benefits
The FED alone expanded their balance sheet by 3 trillion dollars. Not to mention other central banks.

All that new, cheap money had to go somewhere.

The Fakedemic is, amongst other things (introducing slavery, aka NWO) a cover up for the reset. Already last year, I wrote on the silver forum about an expert that predicted the start of the economic collapse for 2020, since 2018 - Markus Krall, the guy who created the internal stress tests for 80% of German and 50% of the banks in the Eurozone - so hardly a random doomsday prophet.

If we get socialism aka slavery - and this is what the fakedemic is all about - the economic output will be tiny for as long as slavery lasts. Of course if this attempt is succesfull ALL assets lose value however as said - the fakedemic is also a cover up for the reset - so before full scale slavery the dollar would collapse and thus the very specific prediction of gold in Dollars is ridiculous. Also, he doesn't really believe what he says - he doesn't put his money where his mouth is. He declined a bet about his predictions on the basis that something I said about the FED would be wrong. AND - he is not to be seen here, when gold rises.

No Sir, no sight of Wonger since the last big flood of fiat money into the gold market!

I hope they haven't cut off his internet since his latest losses.

16 minutes ago, HGr said:

I hesitated earlier in the year, when sovs were still 280, and regret it. Waiting is painful watching, so I am buying small amounts each month and will continue all the way to the top. 

Fingers crossed for another big dip but if it doesn't happen, so be it. 

What is keeping me up at night is the question of whether I should liquidate everything else and go balls deep into PM's. 

Thankfully I bought more than usually just at the very start of the bull ran last summer. "1009£  spot price - maybe I should wait till it's down to at least 1007£?" Thanks God I didn't, after all. But I remember how I hesitated.  I buy monthly but even for those purchases I wish the prices were lower. I will have to downgrade my monthly purchase to one Sovereign a month....half a Sovereign a month....a quarter Sovereign a month and eventually they will need to introduce an eighth sovereign for me.

2 hours ago, Abyss said:

Can we rename this thread @ChrisSilver it needs to be called The coming Gold Boom. We have broken intraday the all time high price of Gold.

It already reminds me of last summer when gold just didn't stop climbing and when I continued to wish it would go back again so I could buy cheaper. So do I now but it seems it's futile.

7 hours ago, HerefordBullyun said:

Unfortunately  oil has never been historically money. Oil will decline and the petrodollar won't exist. Why do you think majority of oil providers for energy are looking at greener alternatives. There many corporations that are looking for something different. Silver and gold will exist but the former will be eaten up by industry and will be a. Harder to mine and b. Become rarer. Yes they will go up and down but because they are finite, they still last the test of time. And historically that's been proven.

That's actually another topic but the big oil corporations back the so-called renewable energies because they increase the need for conventional energies! Less oil rather but more coal, gas etc. Why? Because there are times without wind and sun there is the need for an additional buffer! More "renewable" energy = more conventinal energy on top of that!

(There is of course also the theory that oil is everywhere if you dig deep enough and is created geologically all the time, not just millions of years ago andthe Russians would have the methods to dig deep enough and hold it back because they sell so much oil and gas. I don't know if that is true but if it is, oil will eventually become much cheaper and every country can get its own oil.)

2 hours ago, Wonger said:

I will not enter into any bet with anyone who refuses to deal with fact and reality, the Fed is private and to suggest otherwise is absolutely absurd!

Quod erat demonstrandum!

I have never really expected to get an ounce of gold from you, however I have expected you to make up a lousy excuse to avoid the bet.

2 hours ago, Wonger said:

More made up nonsense as the poster goes along trying to wriggle out of admitting they are wrong and they expect me to enter into a bet with them? 😁

There was an act in 1913 that enabled the FED. That's why I said it was - enabled by the government and thus has state elements (apart from other state elements that I didn't even mention). The FED still relies on the government's enablement today. The FED is NOT and never was a purely private entity. It's a classical corporatist entity, held by private individuals, enabled and empowered by the state - because the private individuals lobbied at the state to get - state guaranteed privileges and thus has STATE ELEMENTS.

Anyway, that doesn't really matter in the context of our non-bet. You have shown you don't put your money where you mouth is. That's all I really wanted you to do. I'm sure you will have an answer to this too. I don't care and I might not respond, because as funny as it was, it's getting tiresome,  @Eco ah sorry, I mean @Wonger .

45 minutes ago, Wonger said:

The Federal Reserve stock is privately held, its fully privately owned and I will not communicate with you any further as you refuse to deal with facts! 

I have named the state-elements, not challanged the owernship. Anyway, what a loss - well, actually yes, the loss of one ounce of gold

22 hours ago, Wonger said:

You are entitled to your own opinion, the fact is you offered me a straight forward bet either Gold LBMA am or pm fix drops below $500 or it does not. However you then tried adding a clause which you think is easily defined, I am showing you its not and can never be so. The following question of "What if the Fed announces US Treasury yield curve targeting revaluing the USD via US Treasury purchases made through the US Treasury on the Feds behalf?" is fully understood by myself I can assure you, its a revaluation of the USD orchestrated  by the FED (Non Government entity) but executed through the US Treasury (Government entity) You can post here all you want accusing me of avoiding the bet, the simple truth is you have tried to add a clause and it seems you do not understand the ramification, unless you define this clause there is no bet! 

"you think is easily defined, I am showing you its not and can never be so.

...

unless you define this clause there is no bet!"

The FED has never been fully private, it has been enabled by the state in the first place but now it has even been attached to the treasury by presidential order. All of this wouldn't even matter because I made it clear, it needs to be a revaluation by government act (or at least presidential order). Who carries out details of this swap old US Dollar against new US Dollar doesn't matter at all.

This being said, my assumption that you would avoid the bet by coming up with endless questions about the details of how a revaluation could be carried out - well, you have just confirmed it, see your quote that I have made bold.

4 hours ago, Wonger said:

To answer a few quick questions, the bet is not what it seems to anyone not in the markets, because either party can simply hedge off the risk, I can simply sell put premium for the 1oz $1900 value and the other party can simply buy a $500 put for the 3oz $5700 value, this is obviously what I would do, Im not sure about the other party, its up to them, but i know what i would do, and your not paying me $500 are you, your paying me 1oz of Gold!

Im not long equities to hedge Short Gold futures, Ive been long equities via S&P 500 futures with a target that is very close, its so close 90% of the long position is now closed, were looking to Short equities right here, Gold and equities will soon collapse, sorry guys, but thats always been my view, were going into the abyss and as much as I like the shiny, its going to be taken down with everything else!  

So we could both hedge our bets. And? Is this a reason not to enter the bet in first place? I won't hedge it because it would unnecessarily reduce my gain - one troy ounce of gold. As predicted you keep coming up with new reasons why you shouldn't enter the bet. I have also asked you to explain your quote below, I don't think you know what it means, yourself. It was a clarification question about my restriction (bet void in case of a revaluation of the Dollar). So please expand on this:

On 21/07/2020 at 23:57, Wonger said:

What if the Fed announces US Treasury yield curve targeting revaluing the USD via US Treasury purchases made through the US Treasury on the Feds behalf?

12 minutes ago, dicker said:

I think we are man down, which is a shame.  I was keen to understand what was going on in the gold market, the world of high finance and what Wongers trading desk made of the market movements.  

Perhaps he is out at a meeting with the government as per one of his previous posts.

Best

Dicker

Sorry for having driven out Wonger with my bet offer. I too wish he'd come back. I want my free ounce of gold!

34 minutes ago, sovereignsteve said:

The question is exactly what is the stake?

If its 3 oz. of physical gold, technically you're only risking 3 oz at $400 if by some miracle it does go to 400.

Chances are you'll win one oz at $2000 or whatever😄

Well, if there is a revaluation o the Dollar it changes the value of 400 Dollar. It might be the same as now 4000. That's the whole point of this restriction. Such revaluations do always happen after hyperinflations and if there is one with the US Dollar before the end of 2021 and one zero cancelled out compared to its current purchasing power (and a few more, altogether), Gold could be have double the purchasing power compared to now, yet I would have lost the bet. As said, Wonger implies a massive loss of purchasing power and I want to make sure, it is about that.

10 minutes ago, Darr3nG said:

Flat-lined for me, but then I am holding the screen at a funny angle

8 minutes ago, sovereignsteve said:

@silenceissilver

This is the only way you will possibly get your wager out of Wonger. I would say any revaluation of the usd in the timescale you suggest is pretty much negligible.

I agree it's not particularily high but I don't think it's negligible either and certainly too high for me to risk 3 ounces of gold, losing my bet on technicalities (whereas Wonger clearly means a massive loss of purchasing power).That would be like Usain Bolt being beaten in a 100m race by an 80 year old guy on a cane because of 2 jump starts.

1 hour ago, Martlet said:

Seems to me this wager is really simple, no conditions except $price recorded by LMBA on $date.   If some re-valuation or other far out scenario occurs, roll with it. 

It is simple. The restriction is also simple. The revaluation of the Dollar/effectively he introduction of a new US currency, also called Dollar, where the new average annual salary is e.g. $1000 means the bet is void.

No one knows if this will happen but it's not a far fetched scenario and it's not in line with Wonger's claims. He clearly implies a massive loss of purchasing power.

10 hours ago, Wonger said:

What if the Fed announces US Treasury yield curve targeting revaluing the USD via US Treasury purchases made through the US Treasury on the Feds behalf?

This doesn't make any sense to me. Are you trying to avoid agreeing to the bet by running through an endless number of sligthly different scenarios from A to Z? You wouldn't do this, would you?

So, what do you actually mean with this, please explain!

22 minutes ago, Wonger said:

Would this include the US Treasury re valuing Gold or do you need to think about that one? 😉 

If the US Dollar is revaluaded per se, it will affect the gold spot price. If gold is revaluated against the Dollar without the Dollar being revaluated per se (against everything else) then the answer is no - it would not be included in the restriction. But in practice this won't and can't happen (if it directly affects the spot price). But keep in mind, the bet would still be about the spot price, not the value the FED/treasury has in their books, for one ounce of gold.

21 minutes ago, Wonger said:

The definition of Deflation is a contraction of the Currency supply leading to increased purchasing power and in the circumstance of a USD revaluation it would be the complete opposite, it would be a decrease in purchasing power, the USD would be diluted which is called Inflation! 😉   

Revaluation means a new value is attached to the currency. As this was unclear to you - that's also how you have to read it. Deal?

1 hour ago, TheApe said:

Without an escrow you have zero chance of seeing that😂.

Not betting against this, lol. Anyone here wants to take that role? @Wonger May I suggest whoever does it, get a one ounce silver coin from the loser and it has to be someone with a high value in positive feedback and no negative feedback in trading and someone we can both agree on but I guess you will reject anyone here

5 hours ago, TheApe said:

My Gold and Silver stocks are through the roof!!!!😁

When is this joke of a thread going to be closed.

When I got my one troy ounce of gold from @Wonger

Not a single day earlier!

On 20/07/2020 at 19:54, Wonger said:

Can you define "similar" so I can fully understand your rules? 😁

Any scenario where the US Dollar is directly revalued (where the purchasing power of the UD Dollar goes up) per any form of government decree (thus a de facto revaluation (increase of purchasing power) via a deflation is excluded from this restriction).

Edit: per any form of government decree (US government  only) or by US law