So, ive just started stacking....

[Happypanda88]

Welcome to the forum @AaaGee

There are already lots of good advice and suggestions to your queries. 

20 hours ago, AaaGee said:

Also im struggling with variety.  I dont want to buy any fakes which is keeping me down the brit path. But looking on the pictures only thread on here i see some of you really go to town on weights and variety. How do you know youve bought legitimately?

You can buy from established and refutable dealers to avoid any fakes.  When I first started stacking a few years ago, I bought different silver bullion coins from a dealer - Britannias, Canadian Maples, American Silver Eagles, Kookaburras, Noah Ark, Silver Pandas etc.  This enabled me to identify how each one should look and feel.  After that and with a bit more confidence, I wasn't overly concerned about sourcing them from the well known auction site. I have managed to get some real bargains.

Another suggestion if you're serious about stacking is that make sure you keep a record of all your purchases...ideally in a spreadsheet. Details such as Date of Purchase, Amount Paid, Price Per Ounce etc

In years to come, you will be able to see how well you have done. Enjoy the journey !  👍

 

 

[TeaTime]

Truthfully ?

Both gold and silver are volatile and are not a particularly good investment. The majority consensus seems to be to invest in gold right now because of the VAT-free status. I would wager that anyone who purchased investment gold in the last 12 months is watching the spot-price drop right now and not feeling particularly clever. It's a similar picture for silver (with, historically, more volatility - which can equate to bigger losses/profits)

My advice would be to look at buying PMs with a value over and above the intrinsic. If you can combine the value of the precious metal with a numismatic element this can off-set price changes. An example would be if you could purchase something like an Edward VII sovereign at bullion prices or earlier Britannia (.958 silver) coins. I'm not going to go into the rabbit hole of pure numismatics - that's collecting, not stacking. 

This only works if you have an exit strategy that doesn't involve selling your stack to a PM dealer. In that case spot price is everything and you'd just as well invest in coffee stocks.

The ideal scenario is to be a collector with a stacker mentality... The pleasure of owning something can mitigate changes in spot. 

[Dakaras]

19 minutes ago, TeaTime said:

Truthfully ?

Both gold and silver are volatile and are not a particularly good investment. The majority consensus seems to be to invest in gold right now because of the VAT-free status. I would wager that anyone who purchased investment gold in the last 12 months is watching the spot-price drop right now and not feeling particularly clever. It's a similar picture for silver (with, historically, more volatility - which can equate to bigger losses/profits)

My advice would be to look at buying PMs with a value over and above the intrinsic. If you can combine the value of the precious metal with a numismatic element this can off-set price changes. An example would be if you could purchase something like an Edward VII sovereign at bullion prices or earlier Britannia (.958 silver) coins. I'm not going to go into the rabbit hole of pure numismatics - that's collecting, not stacking. 

This only works if you have an exit strategy that doesn't involve selling your stack to a PM dealer. In that case spot price is everything and you'd just as well invest in coffee stocks.

The ideal scenario is to be a collector with a stacker mentality... The pleasure of owning something can mitigate changes in spot. 

That's a great summing up of my approach. 

[GoldDiggerDave]

21 hours ago, AaaGee said:

As per title. A few months ago a friend of mine told me that he had started buying 1oz silver Britannia coins as an investment.

Honestly silver is really not that much of an investment.....and I know I might upset a few on here by saying that, silver is a gamble not an investment due to the high dealer premiums, vat and postage is an utter killer if buying in small amounts

If you bought a 1oz silver 999 coin today it would cost around £26 for £15.64p worth of silver. in this scenario you would need spot to double to make a small return, 50p for a capsule would equal 10% of your profit if silver doubled so £4.78 profit per oz if spot doubled.  18% ish return is not bad right?    But for this to make any real world impact you need to be sat on kg's of silver then you have to think about storage a decent safe will cost a very large percentage of the silver you can store in side, it's diminishing returns.       

Not trying to put you off buying silver just like I would not put anyone off who wants to buy a lottery ticket, there are too many bozo's on youtube saying silver is a hedge against inflation how?  Someone explain this to me, silver a hedge against inflation when real world inflation is running at 40% over 7 months......sorry folks but I have to call utter BS here.    

Have I got silver? yes of course, got it as it's a cheap way to collect 1oz coins of different designs, and if silver gets to £12-£13 I will be hovering some up, and yes you can make money but it's not an investment and it's most definitely not a long term store of wealth, see the last 10 years below.

I can't stress enough I'm not putting you off silver just trying to open your eyes to the BS buzzwords that are pointblank misguiding people into thinking it's an investment, over paying  debt over the last 10 years is likely to make you better off than holding silver, (of course do your own home work here) 

And the ugly monster in the room

I see a very strange thing with some silver stackers, once they have their stack some are wishing and begging for the economy to collapse as they think it will not only save them make them rich in a SHFT event, this is simply beyond stupid in so many ways I will not go into, but no doubt you have seen these people online......

A sovereign per month or every two months  is a reasonable goal for a store of wealth, and yes buy silver for fun and treat it like buying  lottery tickets for the day it might "got to the moon"  but don't buy it on the back of someone telling you it's an investment or even worse a hedge against inflation. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Darr3nG]

12 hours ago, GoldDiggerDave said:

sovereigns all day mate. 

You should get that printed on a t-shirt  

[Darr3nG]

[LemmyMcGregor]

5 minutes ago, Darr3nG said:

I'm just starting a t-shirt printing business, how many do you want? 🤣

[Darr3nG]

7 minutes ago, LemmyMcGregor said:

how many do you want? 🤣

25 to fill a tube...  

[LemmyMcGregor]

53 minutes ago, GoldDiggerDave said:

A sovereign per month or every two months  is a reasonable goal for a store of wealth, and yes buy silver for fun and treat it like buying  lottery tickets for the day it might "got to the moon"  but don't buy it on the back of someone telling you it's an investment or even worse a hedge against inflation.

This is spot on what I'm doing.

I'm actually having a fair bit of fun with old silver coinage, half crowns and florins are beautiful and I wish we still had circulation coins like those, mostly aquired around spot, some just under, some just over, even outs in the long run.

[Bigmarc]

1 hour ago, GoldDiggerDave said:

Honestly silver is really not that much of an investment.....and I know I might upset a few on here by saying that, silver is a gamble not an investment due to the high dealer premiums, vat and postage is an utter killer if buying in small amounts

If you bought a 1oz silver 999 coin today it would cost around £26 for £15.64p worth of silver. in this scenario you would need spot to double to make a small return, 50p for a capsule would equal 10% of your profit if silver doubled so £4.78 profit per oz if spot doubled.  18% ish return is not bad right?    But for this to make any real world impact you need to be sat on kg's of silver then you have to think about storage a decent safe will cost a very large percentage of the silver you can store in side, it's diminishing returns.       

Not trying to put you off buying silver just like I would not put anyone off who wants to buy a lottery ticket, there are too many bozo's on youtube saying silver is a hedge against inflation how?  Someone explain this to me, silver a hedge against inflation when real world inflation is running at 40% over 7 months......sorry folks but I have to call utter BS here.    

Have I got silver? yes of course, got it as it's a cheap way to collect 1oz coins of different designs, and if silver gets to £12-£13 I will be hovering some up, and yes you can make money but it's not an investment and it's most definitely not a long term store of wealth, see the last 10 years below.

I can't stress enough I'm not putting you off silver just trying to open your eyes to the BS buzzwords that are pointblank misguiding people into thinking it's an investment, over paying  debt over the last 10 years is likely to make you better off than holding silver, (of course do your own home work here) 

And the ugly monster in the room

I see a very strange thing with some silver stackers, once they have their stack some are wishing and begging for the economy to collapse as they think it will not only save them make them rich in a SHFT event, this is simply beyond stupid in so many ways I will not go into, but no doubt you have seen these people online......

A sovereign per month or every two months  is a reasonable goal for a store of wealth, and yes buy silver for fun and treat it like buying  lottery tickets for the day it might "got to the moon"  but don't buy it on the back of someone telling you it's an investment or even worse a hedge against inflation. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You think that's bad, you should see my ten year tin chart. 

[Darr3nG]

1 minute ago, Bigmarc said:

you should see my ten year tin chart

You buying the dip?  

[Bigmarc]

34 minutes ago, Darr3nG said:

You buying the dip?  

Na, just accumulating, little by little, long term. 

[Paul]

@AaaGee  hopefully for a bit of motivation what is possible with determination and sticking to your plan, Ive been a stacker now since the mid 2000s, not on a six figure income but have worked hard in life to earn what i have - Ive bought regular and often every month 

and my own little gold/silver/precious metals life story 

Lastly, use the forum search box, loads and loads of helpful info on not just gold/silver but also psychology/money saving/minimalism/health/rejecting consumerism

[Happypanda88]

Poor @Aaagee just joined The Silver Forum and some members are rubbishing silver ! 😆 

While I somewhat agree with the assessment that silver is volatile and not really a good investment based on last couple years of data. On top of that, there's 20% VAT at retail for people in the UK. But with silver being a small market and therefore heavily manipulated by paper silver trades, who knows what it will do in the next 5 to 10 years. 

I remembered back in 2015, there was a similar sentiment where some people were rubbishing silver because the price had peaked in April 2011 and began a long decline. But there are those who felt it was a good buying opportunity. I think I did rather well buying the dip back then.

 

 

Who knows, in a few years members might be talking about the missed buying opportunity. 😁 

EDIT:  I forgot to mention that I was on the same boat trip as @sixgun .  Yes, you guessed right. We were involved in a tragic boating accident and our stacks sunk to the bottom of the lake ! 🙄

Edited July 20, 2022 by Happypanda88

[Gordy]

2 hours ago, Dakaras said:

I would wager that anyone who purchased investment gold in the last 12 months is watching the spot-price drop right now and not feeling particularly clever.

Buying gold within the last 12 months shouldnt probably worry savvy buyers as 12 months ago spot was around the £1300.00 mark so any drop atm isnt anything to worry about, its knowing when to buy and when to be patient, longer investers in gold are not worried in the least.. and as the chart the Golddigger dave put on you can see how gold has faired so dont be worried about dipping into the gold market when you have the funds.

One bit of advice from my end is if you decide to buy anything in the future whether it be gold or silver etc, leave BBP alone as they are not good value for money...

Golddiggerdave charts are from there and i also use their charts for checking prices as they are good (imho only) but i never purchase from them.

If its the trust thing about sending money to total strangers when buying, stick to dealers and there are a few on here that are trustworthy, even if they have a strange dress sense when holidaying in the french alps... 😁 

[LawrenceChard]

14 hours ago, AaaGee said:

Ah, i didn't know that about 999. 

Ive got 4x1G pamps that are sealed. Also the 2x999 coins havnt been touched and the capsules haven't been opened.

Something learnt 🙂

 

Do you know what percentage premium you paid for the 1 gram bars, and 2x999 gold coins?

You should know, especially if you are buying as an investment rather than just spending money because you have too much of it. It is the only way to compare value.

What size were the 2x999 gold coins?

I ask because you will almost always pay a higher premium for small sizes.

In general, the more you share the information you already have, the better and more relevant the advice you will receive here on TSF or anywhere, for that matter.

😎

[LemmyMcGregor]

17 minutes ago, Gordy said:

leave BBP alone as they are not good value for money...

Agreed, never been a fan of pale ales and Boston Beer Party doesn't really deliver. Amusing name though.

[LawrenceChard]

11 minutes ago, LemmyMcGregor said:

Agreed, never been a fan of pale ales and Boston Beer Party doesn't really deliver. Amusing name though.

Apparently, it is 5.6% ABV, which could be important to know, as it affects flavour, and how much you can safely drink.

It is almost as important as knowing how much % premium you are paying on gold coins.

😎

[AaaGee]

3 hours ago, LawrenceChard said:

Do you know what percentage premium you paid for the 1 gram bars, and 2x999 gold coins?

You should know, especially if you are buying as an investment rather than just spending money because you have too much of it. It is the only way to compare value.

What size were the 2x999 gold coins?

I ask because you will almost always pay a higher premium for small sizes.

In general, the more you share the information you already have, the better and more relevant the advice you will receive here on TSF or anywhere, for that matter.

😎

Ok, it looks like i need to learn a LOT before i carry on with this. Ill keep the silver i have and keep buying more but turn my attention to the gold. No idea how much ive paid over the odds but here you go....

 

02/05/22 

2022 1/4 0z brit 999 £424.80

 

21/6/22

Umicore 1g bar x2 £133.60

 

02/07/22

Umicore 1g bar x2 £134.00

 

06/07/22

2021 1/4 oz brit 999 £432.60

 

18/07/22

1/10 oz brit 999 £171.30

 

Thats my lot in gold + 30 2021/22 1 0z brits.

 

Let me know how badly ive done cheers. 

 

[Paul]

17 minutes ago, AaaGee said:

Ok, it looks like i need to learn a LOT before i carry on with this. Ill keep the silver i have and keep buying more but turn my attention to the gold. No idea how much ive paid over the odds but here you go....

 

02/05/22 

2022 1/4 0z brit 999 £424.80

 

21/6/22

Umicore 1g bar x2 £133.60

 

02/07/22

Umicore 1g bar x2 £134.00

 

06/07/22

2021 1/4 oz brit 999 £432.60

 

18/07/22

1/10 oz brit 999 £171.30

 

Thats my lot in gold + 30 2021/22 1 0z brits.

 

Let me know how badly ive done cheers. 

 

 

Bargains to be had here on the forum here from the right sellers,once you've found your feet 

 

[AaaGee]

Thanks for showing me that. I cant decide if im happy or sad about that lol.

I just bought yesterday so going to be a while before i buy again. But brilliant to know theres cheaper than going full retail about

Thanks again 👍

[Paul]

1 minute ago, AaaGee said:

Thanks for showing me that. I cant decide if im happy or sad about that lol.

I just bought yesterday so going to be a while before i buy again. But brilliant to know theres cheaper than going full retail about

Thanks again 👍

They're sold out anyway ! The overly frugal lurkers here were teased out with a good for sale thread !!! 

[Paul]

5 minutes ago, AaaGee said:

Thanks for showing me that. I cant decide if im happy or sad about that lol.

I just bought yesterday so going to be a while before i buy again. But brilliant to know theres cheaper than going full retail about

Thanks again 👍

Lots of good sellers here, who price to sell/make a deal, if you can beat

@James32to it ! Lol

Edited July 20, 2022 by Paul

[LawrenceChard]

2 hours ago, AaaGee said:

Ok, it looks like i need to learn a LOT before i carry on with this. Ill keep the silver i have and keep buying more but turn my attention to the gold. No idea how much ive paid over the odds but here you go....

02/05/22 

2022 1/4 0z brit 999 £424.80

21/6/22

Umicore 1g bar x2 £133.60

02/07/22

Umicore 1g bar x2 £134.00

06/07/22

2021 1/4 oz brit 999 £432.60

18/07/22

1/10 oz brit 999 £171.30

Thats my lot in gold + 30 2021/22 1 0z brits.

Let me know how badly ive done cheers. 

 

I guess these "Thats my lot in gold + 30 2021/22 1 0z brits." are silver, not gold or platinum, but...

... Now you're trying to get me to do all the hard work.

You could look up the gold price for the relevant days. There are lots of gold price sites online, but ours is here:

https://www.chards.co.uk/gold-price/gold-spot-price

From that you should be able to work out what percentage premium you were paying.

It is more relevant though, to know the spot gold price at the time you dealt, which is difficult in retrospect.

Another way would be to show the linke here to the sites/pages you bought from, then I am sure you will get (mainly) helpful comments.

The best sites, IMO, and I am slightly biased, but with good reason, show you the percentage premiums to make comparison easier.

I / we don't advise small sizes for investment, but here for example:

https://www.chards.co.uk/2022-gold-double-sovereign-uncirculated-coin/15698

You can see:

Quantity	Premium %	Price Per Item	Total	Est UK Delivery
1	4.5	£700.28	£700.28	£6.00
2	4.4	£699.61	£1,399.22	£6.00
5	4.1	£697.59	£3,487.95	£8.00
15	3.9	£696.25	£10,443.75	£12.00
30	3.7	£694.91	£20,847.30	£19.00
75	3.65	£694.58	£52,093.50	£45.00
150	3.5	£693.57	£104,035.50	£95.60
300+	3.4	£692.90	£207,870.00	£164.60

So everything is easy and transparent.

There is also 

Price Comparison Against Other UK Bullion Dealers - Updated at 20-Jul-2022 16:00

Qty	Chards (Excl Delivery)	Chards (Inc Delivery)	B*	G*	RM	UKB
1	£701.37	£707.37	OOS	OOS	£727.18	£725.46
2	£700.70	£703.70	OOS	OOS	£723.67	£724.73
5	£698.69	£700.29	OOS	OOS	£720.36	£724.01
15	£697.35	£698.15	OOS	OOS	£718.38	£723.28
30	£696.00	£696.63	OOS	OOS	£716.65	£721.11
75	£695.67	£696.27	OOS	OOS	£714.48	£719.65
150	£694.66	£695.30	OOS	OOS	OOS	£719.29
300	£693.99	£694.54	OOS	OOS	OOS	£718.93

To make it even easier still.

Obviously, if you buy privately, perhaps from other TSF members, you should try to buy at better premiums / prices than above.

🙂

[LawrenceChard]

2 hours ago, AaaGee said:

Thanks for showing me that. I cant decide if im happy or sad about that lol.

I just bought yesterday so going to be a while before i buy again. But brilliant to know theres cheaper than going full retail about

Thanks again 👍

But as you probably know now, some dealers are cheaper and better than others.

😎