Sovereign Problem

[AdamDutton]

Just now, James32 said:

Usually a massive red flag tbh, may half a percent..sure but not as high as 97%

No ones going to know until it gets melted down 

[VeracityM]

Just now, AdamDutton said:

No ones going to know until it gets melted down 

Usually means it is heavily plated - and this is Atkinsons belief, which is what they want to cut it and will only pay £200

[Sovhead]

3 minutes ago, SlowFrog said:

So, in the reference photo we're looking at as a genuine sov, the s is super close to the neckline. In the suspect coin, it's a little further away. Now check this one via BBP - hahaha. I have no idea what to make of any of it at this point. Full link for reference:

https://www.bullionbypost.co.uk/gold-sovereign-specific-year/victoria-young-head-1871-1887/1876-gold-sovereign-victoria-young-head-s/

 

That’s crazy they’re so different and there are even crazier things happening…..

[Leonmarsh]

Let's not forget Atkinson's sent a fake coin to backyard bullion so it happens to all the dealers, 

Adam is sorting it and a stand up guy 

[SlowFrog]

3 minutes ago, James32 said:

Usually a massive red flag tbh, may half a percent..sure but not as high as 97%

Even in Australia, in 1876?

[AdamDutton]

@Leonmarsh Thank you much appreciated. Leon has been a good customer for years and I hope in the future we will do business again. Majority of my stock comes from legitimate sources. If I named where from you would recognise the name. Even worse the sovereign was bought from a source that probably over half of the forum would know who that business is. It's been over 2 years therefore I probably couldn't get a refund from the coin in question.

[Roy]

Who's good at maths?

If the sovereign has 97% gold, and weighs the correct weight, surely it would be much smaller in diameter or thickness.

A good old specific gravity test would reveal, old school like.

[Upsidedown]

Be interesting if it is a jewellery coin, because every sovereign copy I've seen in jewelers look like they've been hand crafted by stevie wonder.

[AdamDutton]

To be even more transparent I rarely buy from the general public. My major sources are businesses that have been around for over 100 years in some instances. Dealers buy from these sources as-well. I can't be revealing names as I can't cut the hand that is feeding me. 

[AdamDutton]

* some not all to make it clear 

[James32]

8 minutes ago, AdamDutton said:

To be even more transparent I rarely buy from the general public. My major sources are businesses that have been around for over 100 years in some instances. Dealers buy from these sources as-well. I can't be revealing names as I can't cut the hand that is feeding me. 

Gowaaan give us your source 😆 

[andrewse]

Maybe get some decent front and back pic firsts from overhead..  then pretty sure you can just blow torch or gas lighter it for a minute or 2 to check if plated.. Will proba ly go black if it is.. Real gold should be unaffected.. just doesnt rule out fully gold fake..

[AdamDutton]

1 minute ago, andrewse said:

Maybe get some decent front and back pic firsts from overhead..  then pretty sure you can just blow torch or gas lighter it for a minute or 2 to check if plated.. Will proba ly go black if it is.. Real gold should be unaffected.. just doesnt rule out fully gold fake..

Possible its a fake sovereign with real gold 

[Orpster]

58 minutes ago, Sovhead said:

I disagree.

The S is far closer to the neckline in one of them than the other, 

Caused me to dig out a pick of my Sydney's - no real consistency  

[SeverinDigsSovereigns]

46 minutes ago, SlowFrog said:

So, in the reference photo we're looking at as a genuine sov, the s is super close to the neckline. In the suspect coin, it's a little further away. Now check this one via BBP - hahaha. I have no idea what to make of any of it at this point. Full link for reference:

https://www.bullionbypost.co.uk/gold-sovereign-specific-year/victoria-young-head-1871-1887/1876-gold-sovereign-victoria-young-head-s/

 

I just looked at an 1887s I have, once in NGC holder and cracked out, and S appears far from the next much like this BBP coin. Of course NGC can be wrong but this particular coin of mine doesn't look very wrong to me, and I guess the mint mark could appear in a very liberal manner?

[andrewse]

Just now, Orpster said:

Caused me to dig out a pick of my Sydney's - no real consistency  

All over the shop those 'S's haha

[Upsidedown]

1 minute ago, Orpster said:

Caused me to dig out a pick of my Sydney's - no real consistency  

Don't you start getting concerned, I just bought a load of you! 😅

[bobski]

Buyer needs to send to Dave to give a full appraisal

We've all lost hours chasing stuff we didn't need to chase. No need to bully Adam into paying your days wages.

 

PS. Where did Atkinson's say they would pay you £200 for it?

[Orpster]

Just now, Upsidedown said:

Don't you start getting concerned, I just bought a load of you! 😅

Ha ha, I am not concerned

My point is more in these times and particularly in the branch mints, the setting of the dies was all over the place, they are not even consistent for the same year/mint

[Sovhead]

2 minutes ago, Orpster said:

Caused me to dig out a pick of my Sydney's - no real consistency  

Nae bother Musk 🤣🤣🤣🤣

massive differences 👍🏻

[Upsidedown]

Just now, Orpster said:

Ha ha, I am not concerned

My point is more in these times and particularly in the branch mints, the setting of the dies was all over the place, they are not even consistent for the same year/mint

I'm only joking mate 😁

Same with all coins from the time, my American ones were the same, mint marks all over the place.

[Orpster]

Just now, Upsidedown said:

I'm only joking mate 😁

Same with all coins from the time, my American ones were the same, mint marks all over the place.

Yea I'm looking now, these are all 1881 for example - closer but still not perfectly aligned I don't think

[VeracityM]

4 minutes ago, bobski said:

Buyer needs to send to Dave to give a full appraisal

We've all lost hours chasing stuff we didn't need to chase. No need to bully Adam into paying your days wages.

 

PS. Where did Atkinson's say they would pay you £200 for it?

Thanks for your appraisal of the situation 

I don't remember 'bullying' anyone into it. Maybe you know more than me - please update me.

As far as I knew, I was offered a 'complimentary' and then when I asked for clarification, I was offered both.

My losses are real - spending many hours that I hadn't planned (or intended) to spend this morning / afternoon. Trying to ensure I don't accuse someone unnecessarily. Making sure I had as many facts as I could. Collating opinions so that I don't make a mistake and be an arse to someone inadvertently.

Yes, we all have irritations to contend with, whether we accept losses depends on from whom and for how much. Doesn't mean we have to accept them. My time has a real value - especially today.

I bought, in good faith from a Platinum Business seller. I try and minimise my losses that way. Lessons learned though.

Atkinsons spent some time on the phone with me this morning and some emails. My account with them has taken an, as yet, unquantifiable hit.

Edited December 8, 2023 by VeracityM

[SlowFrog]

4 minutes ago, Orpster said:

Caused me to dig out a pick of my Sydney's - no real consistency  

Cracking post! Appreciate seeing all these together - the range of differences is really quite remarkable. I'm personally not convinced they'd be nailing a 22 carat alloy each and every time back then.

"We're missing the copper delivery, Joey! I reckon Mick's pissed again. Ah bugger it, I'll just throw in some extra gold.."

[Spyder]

I have a question, ''Why would Atkinson pay £200 for a coin they think is plated''.  I have never known a jeweller that would take a gamble of £200 if they thought it was plated.  What is the point of a £15k machine if it can not tell the difference between a solid gold coin and one plated.  

Question for the buyer, if you had doubts about the coin, did you inform the seller before deciding to post to Atkinson?  This would have saved you postage. If you posted additional coins to sell, then no real extra postage fees occurred apart from one package for the return.