Best bank that allows you to make a bank transfer without blocking ?

[bluemoon]

1 hour ago, Bratnia said:

The decentralised transaction element is the part that interests me. Up to now I've had zero interest in bitcoin/crypto's etc., however the potential of selling gold for bitcoin whilst simultaneously placing a short sell on the bitcoin spot market would negate the bitcoin price volatility. Wouldn't matter if the price of bitcoin doubled or halved before you later spent the bitcoin (re-bought gold) - it would still buy back the same amount of ounces of gold (less costs).

As I understand it short selling bitcoin requires bitcoin as collateral, which you'd have from having sold gold for bitcoin. It's not a derivative market so there's no leverage (1:1) so low risk. Then later you repurchase gold, anywhere else in the world that caters for doing so, paying in bitcoin whilst closing the short bitcoin position. There'd be transaction costs/fees (and spot market fees are typically higher than futures) and gold sell/re-buy spreads however those costs are perhaps less than it might have otherwise cost to transport physical gold across international borders or to have liquidated into domestic currency (such as Pounds), electronic transfer those Pound and repurchase gold elsewhere - and without the hassles of having transactions halted pending 'fraud' investigations when selling gold for Pounds and/or sending/conveying Pounds abroad.

Fundamentally requires ...

1. Someone prepared to buy your gold and pay in bitcoin

2. A account/whatever in which to receive/hold the bitcoin

3. A short spot bitcoin market account

4. Someone prepared to sell you gold for bitcoin

I'd imagine that 2 and 3 might be available within the same account/outfit. But with low, near zero knowledge about bitcoin I have no idea about possible accounts/outfits for that, but my interest is piqued enough to start investigating such avenues, if not just only as a fallback option for if "conventional" selling (or buying) gold ever did become more problematic.

I dislike the modern world where bank deposits sees that money become the banks money; Or stock brokerage accounts where deposits becomes the brokers money, where they'll buy the stocks/shares you like, but registered in their name, not yours. And where the tendency is towards Bail-In's where savers/investors fund bail-out's, not taxpayers. Considerable concentration risk factors should a fraud/failure instance occur during the next 20, 30, whatever years that you might be investing. One way to alleviate that as I see it is to for instance hold 25% in a 2x leverage stock, 75% in physical gold (coins/whatever) instead of 50/50 stock/gold. This is a US data example for that. So if the stock brokerage falters/fails perhaps as part of broader contagion due to a large fraud/whatever, then you're still sitting on 75% physical gold holdings and are likely down a lot less than many others (so relatively wealthier) for having hedged some of the risk.

While I haven't bought gold with crypto yet, if I did I would simply buy some crypto then pay for the gold with it. Some bullion dealers take crypto already, and I've seen some forum members take crypto. I would get the crypto from a decentralised exchange like AgoraDesk.

[Bigmarc]

3 hours ago, flyingveepixie said:

I have no idea how to re-access it as the 12 word recovery code doesn't work

Massive issue which will also hinder mass adoption. 

Recently we have all had some sort of experience where the supply chain fails. There are so many factors in the crypto world to think about that it essentially doesn't compare to what we have today. If I want to send money to Australia, then crypto it is but I can't see me nipping to Aldi or paying my mortgage with it. 

 

[EdwardTeach]

On 05/03/2023 at 22:09, Midasfrog said:

Which bank would you use that are not blocking the transfers you want to make ?

@Solachesis @NGMD @Bogart @Midasfrog how many more ?

Nationwide has always worked fine for me.

Edited March 8, 2023 by EdwardTeach

[danieldorkins]

3 hours ago, EdwardTeach said:

Natwest has always worked fine for me.

I had  a squeaky clean business account for 23 years with Natwest, overdraft, couple of business loans, never put a foot wrong, when I sold my business and closed the business account they would not allow me to open a personal account because I personally had no credit history! typical "the computer says no" and the a*******s who are employed by the bank have absolutely no influence! 

rant over

[gji25]

On 06/03/2023 at 07:59, ZRPMs said:

"you will own nothing and be happy" in your 15 minuet city.

Another day, Let battle commence.

it will probably be true in about two generations time but not in the current timeline 

[gji25]

On 07/03/2023 at 15:25, bluemoon said:

While I haven't bought gold with crypto yet, if I did I would simply buy some crypto then pay for the gold with it. Some bullion dealers take crypto already, and I've seen some forum members take crypto. I would get the crypto from a decentralised exchange like AgoraDesk.

how do you access crypto when the internet goes down ?

[bluemoon]

38 minutes ago, gji25 said:

how do you access crypto when the internet goes down ?

I guess we don't. Hope the CBDC pushers dreaming of phasing out cash think of that.

Edited March 8, 2023 by bluemoon

[EdwardTeach]

1 hour ago, danieldorkins said:

I had  a squeaky clean business account for 23 years with Natwest, overdraft, couple of business loans, never put a foot wrong, when I sold my business and closed the business account they would not allow me to open a personal account because I personally had no credit history! typical "the computer says no" and the a*******s who are employed by the bank have absolutely no influence! 

rant over

Oops my mistake. I ment to say Nationwide not Natwest.

I'm not sure why I named the wrong bank. Bit of a blond moment there. 🤭

[Solachesis]

1 hour ago, gji25 said:

how do you access crypto when the internet goes down ?

you mean in a general scenario or personally? Because if the internet ceased, your crypto balance would be the least of your worries. So many crucial services are ran and are maintained across the internet. Imagine not being able to access medical records, locate patients, have air traffic control communicate with each other.

on a personal level, the same as using a bank account to make purchases, you can't log into online banking without a connection, and make transfers, or pay for things. Card machines are wireless and would not connect, you couldn't sell your gold for a fair price on here without internet either, you'd have to go to a pawn shop.

cash is the only thing which would be usable in that scenario, but I don't think its an argument against the usage of crypto, as like I said, we'd have bigger worries.   

[Roy]

37 minutes ago, EdwardTeach said:

Bit of a blond moment there. 🤭

Blackbeard was a blondie?! 😎

[Roy]

23 minutes ago, Solachesis said:

on a personal level, the same as using a bank account to make purchases, you can't log into online banking without a connection, and make transfers, or pay for things. Card machines are wireless and would not connect, you couldn't sell your gold for a fair price on here without internet either, you'd have to go to a pawn shop.

A good point, but note that 1.7 billion (2017) people in the world are 'unbanked', including 63,000,000 Americans 😇

[Squashie]

On 07/03/2023 at 10:07, danieldorkins said:

… recently I have looked at and joined https://www.tallymoney.com/ well worth looking at and could be of interest to many members on here!

 

Curiosity got the better of me and I googled it. Tally money is certainly an interesting idea. Surprised it wasn’t discussed further here…

[gji25]

2 hours ago, Solachesis said:

you mean in a general scenario or personally? Because if the internet ceased, your crypto balance would be the least of your worries. So many crucial services are ran and are maintained across the internet. Imagine not being able to access medical records, locate patients, have air traffic control communicate with each other.

on a personal level, the same as using a bank account to make purchases, you can't log into online banking without a connection, and make transfers, or pay for things. Card machines are wireless and would not connect, you couldn't sell your gold for a fair price on here without internet either, you'd have to go to a pawn shop.

cash is the only thing which would be usable in that scenario, but I don't think its an argument against the usage of crypto, as like I said, we'd have bigger worries.   

then how did people manage before the internet ? did planes not fly/ were medical records not kept/ was there no communications. they have internet blackouts on a regular basis in india, but they still manage. i wonder how 😉 . maybe there preparing for the future

Edited March 9, 2023 by gji25
typo

[Squashie]

5 hours ago, gji25 said:

then how did people manage before the internet ? did planes not fly/ were medical records not kept/ was there no communications. they have internet blackouts on a regular basis in india, but they still manage. i wonder how 😉 . maybe there preparing for the future

I think most of the infrastructure now relies heavily on internet access, and the point being made was that a sudden, unexpected outage could cause a period of chaos before a workaround was found. I could be wrong, but I know that in my job, a loss of internet (which is almost a daily occurrence) basically halts work. And trust me, the work has nothing to do with computers!

[Bigmarc]

7 hours ago, Squashie said:

Curiosity got the better of me and I googled it. Tally money is certainly an interesting idea. Surprised it wasn’t discussed further here…

Kinisis has been mentioned on the forum loads along with a few others. I had a quick look at tally and dropped it when I see the company name had been changed 4 times, had loads of past directors and the current one looks like some sort of venture capitalists on paper. 

One thin I think people forget with these sort of things is although that are FCA approved it only means that your fiat money is safe. If it's called anything else such as tally, bitcoin, Ethereum or bigmarc coin then it's good as gone if the company goes belly up. Even on crypto exchanges I leave it in £'s till the very last minute, then exchange and put into my wallet. 

 

[Squashie]

8 minutes ago, Bigmarc said:

Kinisis has been mentioned on the forum loads along with a few others. I had a quick look at tally and dropped it when I see the company name had been changed 4 times, had loads of past directors and the current one looks like some sort of venture capitalists on paper. 

One thin I think people forget with these sort of things is although that are FCA approved it only means that your fiat money is safe. If it's called anything else such as tally, bitcoin, Ethereum or bigmarc coin then it's good as gone if the company goes belly up. Even on crypto exchanges I leave it in £'s till the very last minute, then exchange and put into my wallet. 

 

Up until recently I've only used the forum to buy/sell, I've only just ventured into the deep dark remainder 😂 I did think it has probably been mentioned here before, will dig out the threads later on.

I didn't realise it had changed name etc, only had a quick scan. It's a shame, this type of company gives gold a bad name in the public eye. I think the idea is interesting - a private, gold backed bank. How would it work, if it could work at all? Hmm ...

Edited March 9, 2023 by Squashie
Typo

[danieldorkins]

9 hours ago, Bigmarc said:

Kinisis has been mentioned on the forum loads along with a few others. I had a quick look at tally and dropped it when I see the company name had been changed 4 times, had loads of past directors and the current one looks like some sort of venture capitalists on paper. 

One thin I think people forget with these sort of things is although that are FCA approved it only means that your fiat money is safe. If it's called anything else such as tally, bitcoin, Ethereum or bigmarc coin then it's good as gone if the company goes belly up. Even on crypto exchanges I leave it in £'s till the very last minute, then exchange and put into my wallet. 

 

I have actually done a fair bit of reading on this (Tally Money) yes they have changed names and this is No.4 however, I changed my business name 3 times! so don't read too much into that, directors and secretaries come and go, they have been in operation since 2009.

The reviews and feedback, from many different sources, are all very good, there is also a lot of information on "new banking systems" taking over from the old dinosaurs including systems looking at using gold as a back up, it's true that if your fiat currency paid in changes to "Tally" or others you will not be compensated for loss by the FCA, however Tally is licensed by the FCA to operate and Tally insure your money upto 90% (for what that is worth)

I know very little about the banking system but totally dissillusioned by the regular banks and looking for an option, I am giving Tally a try, only small amounts that I am prepared to gamble, I will see how it goes, could be interesting and I will update on here!

Edited March 9, 2023 by danieldorkins

[Bigmarc]

1 hour ago, danieldorkins said:

I have actually done a fair bit of reading on this (Tally Money) yes they have changed names and this is No.4 however, I changed my business name 3 times! so don't read too much into that, directors and secretaries come and go, they have been in operation since 2009.

Just first impressions that's all. Name changes and persons with significant control changes just raise a red flag as you are essentially putting your money in to a produced that's backed by gold. I don't think you can take delivery of gold so you are not buying gold. It says the gold is insured, but is the company and the tally tokens?

Basically is it allocated or unallocated? 

Edited March 9, 2023 by Bigmarc

[danieldorkins]

4 hours ago, Bigmarc said:

Just first impressions that's all. Name changes and persons with significant control changes just raise a red flag as you are essentially putting your money in to a produced that's backed by gold. I don't think you can take delivery of gold so you are not buying gold. It says the gold is insured, but is the company and the tally tokens?

Basically is it allocated or unallocated? 

I have asked the question!

[PhilOdgny]

22 hours ago, gji25 said:

then how did people manage before the internet ? did planes not fly/ were medical records not kept/ was there no communications. they have internet blackouts on a regular basis in india, but they still manage. i wonder how 😉 . maybe there preparing for the future

Before the internet records would be kept in localised computer systems with no or limited network connections ... or perhaps in paper-based storage systems (filing cabinets).

The "internet" is designed to be resilient to attack and, contrary to what most people today understand, is not the same thing as the "World Wide Web" which is a layer that runs on top of the "internet" and is what most people interact with.

I work in IT and in business it is constantly regarded as a "cost centre" when in reality it is saving money versus the alternative of not using modern IT which is so bloody annoying.

[flyingveepixie]

7 hours ago, PhilOdgny said:

Before the internet records would be kept in localised computer systems with no or limited network connections ... or perhaps in paper-based storage systems (filing cabinets).

Paper based systems as recently as 1980 and possiby even beyond just at that time of change where computers were beginning to become a common thing. I remember it clearly.

Edited March 10, 2023 by flyingveepixie

[danieldorkins]

On 09/03/2023 at 17:59, Bigmarc said:

Just first impressions that's all. Name changes and persons with significant control changes just raise a red flag as you are essentially putting your money in to a produced that's backed by gold. I don't think you can take delivery of gold so you are not buying gold. It says the gold is insured, but is the company and the tally tokens?

Basically is it allocated or unallocated? 

 

22 hours ago, danieldorkins said:

I have asked the question!

This is the answer received:

"Thanks for getting in touch.

The gold is allocated to you and Tally is the custodian of the gold. Just so you know we do not offer the service of gold delivery."

sort of yes it's yours but you can't get your hands on it - interesting conundram!
 

[SidS]

6 hours ago, danieldorkins said:

 

This is the answer received:

"Thanks for getting in touch.

The gold is allocated to you and Tally is the custodian of the gold. Just so you know we do not offer the service of gold delivery."

sort of yes it's yours but you can't get your hands on it - interesting conundram!
 

Unallocated gold. Basically there is (somewhere) a quantity of gold and you purchase shares in it (for want of a better word). The same piece of gold can be sold over and over again to multiple purchasers. None of whom can take delivery of it - you can however cash out the fiat value of it at any time.

It's like betting on a horse, it can win a race or it can lose the race, but no matter how much money you put on it, you never buy the racehorse.

Edited March 11, 2023 by SidS

[Bigmarc]

9 hours ago, danieldorkins said:

 

This is the answer received:

"Thanks for getting in touch.

The gold is allocated to you and Tally is the custodian of the gold. Just so you know we do not offer the service of gold delivery."

sort of yes it's yours but you can't get your hands on it - interesting conundram!
 

Ok that ok, as long as the asset of gold is yours and not tally money's. 

Yesterday silicon valley bank went down. Customers funds are insured up to $250,000 dollars and its assets will go to the creditors to fight over, so what I was trying to get at is that they have effectively sold you a "tally", so it looked like to me that the company owns the gold, owns your money and you own a tally. 

I have a revolute account and they have a commodities section that I use sometimes. They clearly state that it's gold backed up but I don't own it, they do. This maybe why I am cautious even tho I know the risk.

[Bigmarc]

Just to add on silicone valley bank. USDC (crypto stable coin) has 30% of its holdings in this bank. It's currently not very stable but could create an opportunity to gets some cheap crypto over the next week or so. Wait until the contagion has died out.