2017 Sovereign

[Paul]

49 minutes ago, mondy41 said:

I just don't understand this  - Why would someone buy from ebay at a premium - How can anyone not realise these are available from the Mint  - What am I missing here.

the market for 'anonymous' fully verified ebay/paypal accounts if rife and popular. through sites like Aspkins  

Folk can source and buy stuff not tied to their name i.e. not declaring sales for tax purposes/NI etc.  approx 30%  saving to being legit

Folk can source counterfeit stuff easily and cheaply through alibaba for re-sale on ebay with any link to their own name or bank account

Folk can sell their stationary cupboard  'borrowings' from work for 100% profit

PayPal allows easy spending of accumulated funds easily into others things of value (ie gold/silver) for delivery to any Argos of choosing via 'click & collect' service and not having to be delivered to a physical home/account address

When said earned fund never touch your actual bank account no paper trail is created or left so as such never needs to be declared

By going this anonoymous route some buyers are happy to pay a little over the odds for items they could easily get via other places at a cheaper price

[Oldun]

4 hours ago, Numistacker said:

 

How does this happen? So much money to create these glossy marketing packs


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Outsourcing ? A human error when reading 3 coin premier set and assuming the 3 coin set was the same ?  This is what definitely happened imho as I had to check twice when reading the Royal Mint homepage. 

[silverin]

Caved in and bought the 3 coin set yesterday

[Topboy]

I bought the cheaper 3 set after watching numistacker on u tube . Also watched 2016 proof britanias. His blog made these coins a guaranteed no brainer. . As easy profit in all of them. 

[Roy]

Topboy, be careful.... Numistacker's videos should carry a government wealth warning! 

[Topboy]

Im a newbie but learning fast.

[morezone]

If the bullion version turns out to be the same, we can expect these to stagnate or lose.  If they are different, then there may be some gain but hard to judge by how much if any.  1989 4 coin can be bought for £3500 and the 2017 5 coin retails for close to this although the 1989 had a much higher mintage.  The 2002, 2005, 2012 with bullion of the same design have the 3 coin premium sets around £1100 with the current 2017 retailing for £1450 and again these older sets had higher mintages.  The 2002, 2005, 2012 proofs are around £500ish and the 2017 retails for £430.  The 1989 Proof is £8-900ish with similar mintage to the 2017, no bullion of the same design but is now 25+ years old.  It all hinges on what the bullion design will be and is a bit of a gamble.  

[Topboy]

The cheaper 3 set is already at 1021 pounds bid 23 hours 2go

[HelpingHands]

4 minutes ago, Topboy said:

The cheaper 3 set is already at 1021 pounds bid 23 hours 2go

This could be a one off before others appear on ebay.

There are sellers with the full sov and half sov listed but I can only see one US seller with a buy it now sale on the half.

[morezone]

2 minutes ago, Topboy said:

The cheaper 3 set is already at 1021 pounds bid 23 hours 2go

Considering the set is still available at the Mint it's not a true indication of what the set is actually worth.  Will it still hold in 6 months, a year, 2 years, 5 years, 10 years.  A lot of us are not buying to flip so we are hoping that in years to come, it will still be worth (ideally considerably) more than what we paid.

[Sovereign]

already got one full ordered do i cancel it and get the 3 coins set for an extra £320 ? not sure ..

[Sovereign]

new listing on ebay for the 3 coins set 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2017-3-PROOF-Coin-Gold-Sovereign-Set-in-22-CARAT-GOLD-/162260724568?hash=item25c77e2b58:g:e5cAAOSw5cNYFKiS

[Stu]

Have sent the mint an email asking if the new/old design 2017 will be on the bullion 2017 sovereigns, I will post the response here to everyone. . I have reserved a proof sov on credit card via topcasback. If rm are going proof only I will keep. If they are producing bullion with this coin I will return the proof and buy bullion. Have time to play with as rm will not debit card until despatch (late Nov) and have 14 days to return after receipt of delivery. My idea of a hedge but we will see. Any one see a flaw other than return delivery costs, please let me know. I had contemplated 3 sovs but chickened out. I am really not a buy/sell guy but will see what happens. Ultimately can cancel order anytime in the intervining period. 

[HelpingHands]

6 minutes ago, Stu said:

. Any one see a flaw other than return delivery costs, please let me know

What are you going to do if they don't know or won't tell you?

[Stu]

Drive down to the valleys with the heavies. seriously though, if they "won't tell" then I will probably just return the goods. Unless I fall for the design which is not very likely. We will hopefully have an answer to the bullion question before  need to return under the 14 day rule.

[HelpingHands]

I hope I'm wrong but the more I think about it I expect them to follow the way of the Britannia (Unique design on proof only).

 

[PureGold]

I've ordered the proof and if they do a bullion version I'll get a couple of them as well 

[Stu]

13 minutes ago, HelpingHands said:

I hope I'm wrong but the more I think about it I expect them to follow the way of the Britannia (Unique design on proof only).

 

I think the same and have decided to take a special delivery gamble. Would much prefer they they changed the design also for the bullion sov but will see what happens. I think Royal mint and banco de Mexico have a bet running to see who who can be the most undeferential to their customers. 

[fehk2001]

9 minutes ago, HelpingHands said:

I hope I'm wrong but the more I think about it I expect them to follow the way of the Britannia (Unique design on proof only).

 

it is always nice to have golden ( coin )cornflakes for Christmas day breakfast you know????? 

[Guest]

I am not sure I understand all the dialogue about the bullion edition. I have both the proof and bullion addition of 2002 and 2005 and the bullion of 2012 and the bullion versions are nowhere even close to the beauty of the proof sovereigns. I know which I would rather have.


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[HawkHybrid]

I think people who just want a potentially favourable

alternative design would like the bullion version.

proof is nicer but does have its investment drawbacks.

 

HH

[sovereignsteve]

37 minutes ago, Numistacker said:

I am not sure I understand all the dialogue about the bullion edition. I have both the proof and bullion addition of 2002 and 2005 and the bullion of 2012 and the bullion versions are nowhere even close to the beauty of the proof sovereigns. I know which I would rather have.


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The 2012 is actually the extreme of this argument; the bullion is appalling but the proof is magnificent.

The beauty of the proofs aside, there are fewer collectors of proofs than bullion sovs but many bullion collectors want to own a proof of the one-off designs because they are different. It might also have something to do with the crap finish of modern bullion sovs, the new designs can only be appreciated in proof.

G&D proofs are not that popular and the re-sale values reflect this but the alt design proofs keep their value due to limited mintage and popularity. Similar to most coins really.

Even if the RM do mint the 2017 sov with the same design as the proof, unless the finish is more akin to an old style bullion sov, they will look awful and the proof should keep the value similar to a 2002 2005 or 2012 proof.

However, to make much of a profit over the issue price, and achieve a price similar to the 1989, the new bullion sov needs to be a G&D design.

 

[Oldun]

From RM

 

3 coin premium set (double, full and half sov) 100% reserved so just returns if anyone sends back or can't pay.

3 coin set (full, half, quarter) 72% reserved - it says 60% reserved but there are 280 sets remaining out of 1000, so.....

5 coin set (quin, double, full, half and quarter) 100% reserved, so returns and unpaids only possibly)

Single Boxed Full sov (no idea as can only order 3 per household but that option is still available)

Single Boxed Half sov 1303 of 2500 remaining

Single Boxed Quarter sov 858 of 2,500 remaining

[mondy41]

Chards has increased the price of the 2017 full to £415 and have the three coin premium on sale now for £1395

[PureGold]

Seems like most people want a 1/4 Queens Beast Proof and a 2017 bullion sovereign (same design) or is it they want what they can't have???