Today I Received.....

[Gruff]

11 minutes ago, TheShinyStuff said:

My Pistrucci arrived yesterday, just the 2oz silver. Didn't have a chance to open until late last night. I wish I hadn't bothered. The worst coin I have received from the comedians at RM.

There is so much of the frosting missing it is laughable. I have highlighted the worst bits. The entire sword takes the cake though!

I don't want it in this state, but any chance of a replacement? Is it worth the hassle? I might just ask for a refund, I couldn't sell this duffer with a clear conscience, any thoughts/advice would be welcome.

Refund if it was mine. I'd be gutted, but this is embarrassing for the RM at this point. I refer back to a previous flippant comment, but the more I see, the more it appears it has some weight. Visually impaired QCs for diversity.. 

[TheShinyStuff]

1 minute ago, Taikonaut said:

Is that frost lost or tarnish?

Its the absence of frost!

[TheShinyStuff]

3 minutes ago, Gruff said:

Refund if it was mine. I'd be gutted, but this is embarrassing for the RM at this point. I refer back to a previous flippant comment, but the more I see, the more it appears it has some weight. Visually impaired QCs for diversity.. 

Comes from the intellectually and morally challenged management I'd imagine. They genuinely don't care. I would buy a can of beans that was in that shape, let alone £275 for 2oz of silver...

[Darr3nG]

18 minutes ago, TheShinyStuff said:

any chance of a replacement? Is it worth the hassle? I might just ask for a refund

If you want the coin, ask for a replacement - return post is at their cost.

[Taikonaut]

Looks like its a "Trial of the Pyx" example got sent out by mistake😕

[TheShinyStuff]

1 minute ago, Darr3nG said:

If you want the coin, ask for a replacement - return post is at their cost.

I do want one, just not sure a replacement will be an option if they're sold out. But I'll speak to them romorrow.

[timsk]

2 hours ago, TheShinyStuff said:

I do want one, just not sure a replacement will be an option if they're sold out. But I'll speak to them romorrow.

If RM say they've sold out - demand that they strike a replacement coin for you. I say this because I know BackyardBullion has done exactly this in the past and recommended a subscriber on his YouTube channel do the same. If everyone does this and refuses to accept a refund, sooner or later the RM will be forced to up their game in the QC department and introduce protocols that are clearly not in place at the moment to ensure that proof products are at least worthy of their name - if not their generally inflated price.

[Upsidedown]

What actually is frosting?

Excuse my ignorance as I don't collect proof/frosted coins.

I was under the impression a rougher part of the die causes the effect, or is it just stuck on by I assume knowing the royal mint, PVA

How does frosting come off?

[Silverlocks]

3 minutes ago, Upsidedown said:

What actually is frosting?

Excuse my ignorance as I don't collect proof/frosted coins.

I was under the impression a rougher part of the die causes the effect, or is it just stuck on by I assume knowing the royal mint, PVA

How does frosting come off?

Frosting is the satin finish on the coin.  Depending on the design it might be on the whole face of the coin, or just the device (or just the fields in the case of reverse proofs).  It's quite delicate and marks easily.  Here's a picture of the obverse of a proof Brit.  The fields are a mirror finish, and the effigy and inscription are frosted.  You can also see frosting on the rim of the coin.

 

 

 

Edited March 17 by Silverlocks

[Upsidedown]

Just now, Silverlocks said:

Frosting is the satin finish on the coin.  Depending on the design it might be on the whole face of the coin, or just the device (or just the fields in the case of reverse proofs).  It's quite delicate and marks easily.

Is that done with die, lasers or acid?

[paulmerton]

3 minutes ago, Upsidedown said:

What actually is frosting?

Excuse my ignorance as I don't collect proof/frosted coins.

I was under the impression a rougher part of the die causes the effect, or is it just stuck on by I assume knowing the royal mint, PVA

How does frosting come off?

The frosted effect comes from the die. Parts of it can appear to be missing on the coin if:

The frosted part of the die is impacted, or polished by mistake.

The coin is impacted.

A small fleck of metal is retained by the die and prevents the frosting being imparted onto the blank.

[Silverlocks]

1 minute ago, Upsidedown said:

Is that done with die, lasers or acid?

Normally on the die, although it could be applied after the coin is minted.  I don't think that approach is normally taken with normal sized coins, but sometimes it is done with larger coins such as 1kg.

[Upsidedown]

Very interesting, thanks guys

[paulmerton]

2 minutes ago, Upsidedown said:

Is that done with die, lasers or acid?

The laser-cut surfaces are naturally frosty. During the polishing of the background fields they sometimes have to re-add the frostiness (e.g. if they accidentally hit the frosted area with the polishing stick) and they do this by masking the already-polished areas and sand blasting the die.

[Silverlocks]

Just now, Upsidedown said:

Very interesting, thanks guys

It gets even more fun.  The cartwheel effect you can see on uncirculated coins is caused by the coin being squeezed slightly outwards from the pressure of the minting process.  It elongates the small impressions made by the frosting slightly, and this affects the way the coin reflects the light.

[Charliemouse]

14 minutes ago, Upsidedown said:

What actually is frosting?

Excuse my ignorance as I don't collect proof/frosted coins.

I was under the impression a rougher part of the die causes the effect, or is it just stuck on by I assume knowing the royal mint, PVA

How does frosting come off?

My understanding is that it is created by laser etching, sand or bead blasting the surface of the die with various materials.

Because it forms a very fine 'detailed' surface, it is very fragile, and tends to go missing on sharp edges and bends in the design.  Plus it can break off.

[Taikonaut]

I always thought it was acid. Sand blasting sounds very fragile but if that is the method I'm not suprise there are so many frosting flaws.

[paulmerton]

3 hours ago, Taikonaut said:

I always thought it was acid. Sand blasting sounds very fragile but if that is the method I'm not suprise there are so many frosting flaws.

The frosting is applied to the dies, not individual coins after being struck.

[NGMD]

Whatever the process, most other mints around the world managed to deliver the coins in top quality condition to the customer. It is a QA issue. A blind one or lazy.

[Upsidedown]

6 hours ago, Upsidedown said:

Today I want to show:

THE ROYAL MINTS NEWLY UNVEILED QUALITY CONTROL LASER

 

Don't worry, the royal mint have a new QC laser

[Silverlocks]

2 minutes ago, NGMD said:

Whatever the process, most other mints around the world managed to deliver the coins in top quality condition to the customer. It is a QA issue. A blind one or lazy.

It's pretty clear that the Royal Munt have some culture or staffing problems.  Whether it's management who don't care or staff who want to take the mick out of rich Knuts buying expensive gold coins, there's clearly a lot of issues with the training and/or motivation of the staff.  This sort of thing always comes from the top. 

[NGMD]

49 minutes ago, Silverlocks said:

It's pretty clear that the Royal Munt have some culture or staffing problems.  Whether it's management who don't care or staff who want to take the mick out of rich Knuts buying expensive gold coins, there's clearly a lot of issues with the training and/or motivation of the staff.  This sort of thing always comes from the top. 

@Charliemouse showed some close ups and even though technology has improved, RM has gone backwards. Enough people have complained publicly and are the laughing stock of the industry. Top or bottom, it must be costing them financially. 
Case in point, the returns on the new GE, It's horrendous.

Edited March 18 by NGMD

[bobski]

19 minutes ago, NGMD said:

@Charliemouse showed some close ups and even though technology has improved, RM has gone backwards. Enough people have complained publicly and are the laughing stock of the industry. Top or bottom, it must be costing them financially. 
Case in point, the returns on the new GE, It's horrendous.

The technology is there to make the most amazing bars and coins. Give me a week in there by myself and I could prove my point.

High ESG scores don't come from master craftsmen, They come from blue-haired, diversity hires.

It's why we can't have nice things anymore

[Silverlocks]

10 minutes ago, bobski said:

The technology is there to make the most amazing bars and coins. Give me a week in there by myself and I could prove my point.

High ESG scores don't come from master craftsmen, They come from blue-haired, diversity hires.

It's why we can't have nice things anymore

There's any number of incompetent white, male jobsworths in the work force.  You don't need diversity to explain that.

[Taikonaut]

I bet their quality control cherry picked the good ones for themselves and send out all the bad ones to customers. If they have good ones spare they may go out to  a lucky customer like a lottery or a dealer of their choosing. They are a public sector employers, they use your taxes to hire people, It keeps people in the job to process returns and if bad coins are not returned they have gotten rid of a rotten apple.