Investigation into Historic Coin Pricing by The Royal Mint

[Silverman2U]

On 04/03/2024 at 01:20, Bruce06 said:

I have bought 2 King George V silver coins from RM site when i started collecting numismatic coins years way back.  After a year, i realized i can purchase similar grade ones at 50-60% from markets, a lesson learned and luckily not sky rocket prices were involved.  These 2 coins are still kept by me up to now and remind me the story behind😅.

👍 

[cjbcomm]

I had a call from the RM today from yet another manager (they seem to change frequently!) trying to flog the George III 2 coin premium set.

This has an 1813 Military Guinea and an 1817 Sov both at MS62. Asking price £31,995!

A bit of research from recent auctions shows these at £9k and £7k as optimistic valuations so about 50% of the price of this set.

That equates to a rather expensive wooden box to house them in!

[BackyardBullion]

Just now, cjbcomm said:

I had a call from the RM today from yet another manager (they seem to change frequently!) trying to flog the George III 2 coin premium set.

This has an 1813 Military Guinea and an 1817 Sov both at MS62. Asking price £31,995!

A bit of research from recent auctions shows these at £9k and £7k as optimistic valuations so about 50% of the price of this set.

That equates to a rather expensive wooden box to house them in!

This is concerning.

Were they pressuring you to buy? Did they say it was a good value set?

[cjbcomm]

1 minute ago, BackyardBullion said:

This is concerning.

Were they pressuring you to buy? Did they say it was a good value set?

Usual soft sales tactics. Great value... low mintage on the 1813 and not many left...set has been selling well so reserve one while you can.. quality box (sic)... would you like me to reserve on now etc. etc.

Told him to send over details which was just a link to their sales page..... subsequent research shows how poor value this really is.

I haven't replied to the chap yet but will do in due course

[BackyardBullion]

Just now, cjbcomm said:

Usual soft sales tactics. Great value... low mintage on the 1813 and not many left...set has been selling well so reserve one while you can.. quality box (sic)... would you like me to reserve on now etc. etc.

Told him to send over details which was just a link to their sales page..... subsequent research shows how poor value this really is.

I haven't replied to the chap yet but will do in due course

Thanks for sharing. 

Really concerning. 

[cjbcomm]

1 minute ago, BackyardBullion said:

Thanks for sharing. 

Really concerning. 

No problem.

Happy for you to use as part of your evidence to them

[ZRPMs]

37 minutes ago, cjbcomm said:

I had a call from the RM today from yet another manager (they seem to change frequently!) trying to flog the George III 2 coin premium set.

This has an 1813 Military Guinea and an 1817 Sov both at MS62. Asking price £31,995!

A bit of research from recent auctions shows these at £9k and £7k as optimistic valuations so about 50% of the price of this set.

That equates to a rather expensive wooden box to house them in!

 

31 minutes ago, cjbcomm said:

Usual soft sales tactics. Great value... low mintage on the 1813 and not many left...set has been selling well so reserve one while you can.. quality box (sic)... would you like me to reserve on now etc. etc.

Told him to send over details which was just a link to their sales page..... subsequent research shows how poor value this really is.

I haven't replied to the chap yet but will do in due course

Same tactic's used on my friend by the mail order mint. It's quite shocking really and another example of price gouging. I typed the term in to bing search and this came up.

United Kingdom Laws and regulations in the United Kingdom do not use the phrase “price gouging” in consumer protection regulation but are similar to U.S. laws. Chapter II of the UK Competition Act 1998 prohibits businesses with market dominance from engaging in "abusive" conduct, including "unfair" pricing.

Price gouging - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Price_gouging

sounds close to the mark to me. 

[cjbcomm]

13 minutes ago, ZRPMs said:

 

Same tactic's used on my friend by the mail order mint. It's quite shocking really and another example of price gouging. I typed the term in to bing search and this came up.

United Kingdom Laws and regulations in the United Kingdom do not use the phrase “price gouging” in consumer protection regulation but are similar to U.S. laws. Chapter II of the UK Competition Act 1998 prohibits businesses with market dominance from engaging in "abusive" conduct, including "unfair" pricing.

Price gouging - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Price_gouging

sounds close to the mark to me. 

You could be right but certainly profiteering to the extreme

[Earthmetal]

I wonder how these pushers get paid. Percentage bonus perhaps?

[cjbcomm]

1 minute ago, Earthmetal said:

I wonder how these pushers get paid. Percentage bonus perhaps?

Probably. Seems to be enough of them so no wonder their prices are ludicrous 

[BackyardBullion]

1 minute ago, Earthmetal said:

I wonder how these pushers get paid. Percentage bonus perhaps?

I suspect they have OTE (on target earnings) 

So rather than a % of the sale they make they would need to achieve certain thresholds for those bonuses to apply

[cjbcomm]

Just now, BackyardBullion said:

I suspect they have OTE (on target earnings) 

So rather than a % of the sale they make they would need to achieve certain thresholds for those bonuses to apply

maybe they'll explain it all to you on your call 😉

[BackyardBullion]

5 minutes ago, cjbcomm said:

maybe they'll explain it all to you on your call 😉

Ha, yeah I doubt it highly!

[BackyardBullion]

Well, I had the call. 

I will be sharing much more in due course. To quickly summarise for those following. 

Some good things and some good feedback to share.

But, also a little bit of "everthing is fine" in some areas. 

I don't quite know what/how to think about everthing right now, I am still digesting it all. 

[365DaysofSilver]

1 minute ago, BackyardBullion said:

Well, I had the call. 

I will be sharing much more in due course. To quickly summarise for those following. 

Some good things and some good feedback to share.

But, also a little bit of "everthing is fine" in some areas. 

I don't quite know what/how to think about everthing right now, I am still digesting it all. 

Great work mate, look forward to hearing about it

[MBTPSilver]

3 hours ago, BackyardBullion said:

Well, I had the call. 

I will be sharing much more in due course. To quickly summarise for those following. 

Some good things and some good feedback to share.

But, also a little bit of "everthing is fine" in some areas. 

I don't quite know what/how to think about everthing right now, I am still digesting it all. 

I'm glad to hear it went ahead, and there was some good feedback at least. I look forward to the video on it.

[AndrewSL76]

If your p*ss was not already at boiling point, take a gander at this horrific* offering:

https://www.royalmint.com/shop/coin-sets/thomas-simon-premium-exclusive-set/

Seems they didn’t listen to a word you said. 

*you read correctly. It is not ‘historic’ it is horrific.

Edited March 7 by AndrewSL76

[BackyardBullion]

Just now, AndrewSL76 said:

If your p*ss was not already at boiling point, take a gander at this horrific* offering:

https://www.royalmint.com/shop/coin-sets/thomas-simon-premium-exclusive-set/?utm_campaign=2024-03-col-premium-exclusives&utm_medium=email&_hsmi=297223811&_hsenc=p2ANqtz-8BDHj4qL80zbI_KzQfSlKpPSYppVy_NpurGyniw3vj2SljaWK9o6xyYcGp2UOXqTQMRHGJnxD7yAklxjgVCdI1WsSUIQ&utm_content=297223810&utm_source=hs_email
 

Seems they didn’t listen to a word you said. 

*you read correctly. It is not ‘historic’ it is horrific.

I would guess that for £200k you can get better value buying directly. 

Difficult one for me to make a video about showing some reference sales though, do you have any?

[Petra]

4 minutes ago, AndrewSL76 said:

If your p*ss was not already at boiling point, take a gander at this horrific* offering:

https://www.royalmint.com/shop/coin-sets/thomas-simon-premium-exclusive-set/

Seems they didn’t listen to a word you said. 

*you read correctly. It is not ‘historic’ it is horrific.

😮limited edition!😂 great looking coins .. but….🤔🤔😳

[Agaupl]

6 minutes ago, BackyardBullion said:

I would guess that for £200k you can get better value buying directly. 

Difficult one for me to make a video about showing some reference sales though, do you have any?

I find these super premium sets less objectionable than the lower value carded ‘horrific value sets’. If you have £200k to mis spend with them, then good luck to you and I don’t really care if you don’t have the time to research (or pay someone to).  
 

It’s the everyday chappie that’s being swindled that annoys me. Having said that .. if it’s mis sold as some sort of pension scheme (not that I think this is happening) then that’s worse. 

Edited March 7 by Agaupl

[AndrewSL76]

4 minutes ago, BackyardBullion said:

I would guess that for £200k you can get better value buying directly. 

Difficult one for me to make a video about showing some reference sales though, do you have any?

References for the 1660 broad will be difficult give how rare it is, but there have been plenty of the others sold. You could get the Crown for less than £10k. The 1656 Broad would be about £50k. Need to check Heritage for results but that’s a ball park. I would say with some time you could get Alun to make a box, source the coins and grade them for (probably) a lot less than £140k.

[AndrewSL76]

3 minutes ago, Agaupl said:

I find these super premium sets less objectionable than the lower value carded ‘horrific value sets’. If you have £200k to mis spend with them, then good luck to you and I don’t really care if you don’t have the time to research (or pay someone to).  
 

It’s the everyday chappie that’s being swindled that annoys me. Having said that .. if it’s mis sold as some sort of pension scheme (not that I think this is happening) then that’s worse. 

I agree with all of this. And my inner communist would say to the Royal Mint to continue fleecing the rich and reduce the premiums on the affordable coins, but that would just result in the rich buying everything. It’s only because they charge such ridiculous premiums that everything is still for sale. 

[Petra]

Surprised more people don’t put two or three coins together and charge a premium 🤔 obviously the cheap one recently was the Elizabeth and Charles Britannias being put in those twin capsules… seemed very popular 🤔Pity the mint seems to take the mickey.

[Agaupl]

On 06/03/2024 at 22:29, BackyardBullion said:

Well, I had the call. 

I will be sharing much more in due course. To quickly summarise for those following. 

Some good things and some good feedback to share.

But, also a little bit of "everthing is fine" in some areas. 

I don't quite know what/how to think about everthing right now, I am still digesting it all. 

Do their marketing people really believe this? And live in a cave seeing the world through spreadsheets?  I think so. 
 

PS Royal Mint. Your ‘data’ is a lagging indicator. Wake up!

 

but I suppose no upper manager wants to hear this. 

Edited March 7 by Agaupl

[Taikonaut]

They make Arthur Daley look like a honest broker!

I bet they hire people to go on on ebay and buys up a lot of low end stuff and then flog them off at 10 times the price on their website.

Edited March 10 by Taikonaut