New Name for New Zealand - Aotearoa

[LawrenceChard]

There has been a petition to change the country's name to its original Māori name Aotearoa

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/sep/14/new-zealand-maori-party-launches-petition-to-change-countrys-name-to-aotearoa

So we came up with a proposed coin design:

Although I can't help thinking Aotearoa sounds like some kind of disease.

 

[Stu]

If we are forever changing place names, how will people know where to go?

[sovereignsteve]

I believe it means something like "Land of the big white cloud", never a more descriptive word in my experience.

[LawrenceChard]

19 hours ago, LawrenceChard said:

There has been a petition to change the country's name to its original Māori name Aotearoa

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/sep/14/new-zealand-maori-party-launches-petition-to-change-countrys-name-to-aotearoa

So we came up with a proposed coin design:

Although I can't help thinking Aotearoa sounds like some kind of disease.

 

19 hours ago, Stu said:

If we are forever changing place names, how will people know where to go?

Perhaps that's the reason, so they don't need to impose Covid travel restrictions. Otherwise use our satnavs, or Google maps. 😎

16 hours ago, sovereignsteve said:

I believe it means something like "Land of the big white cloud", never a more descriptive word in my experience.

According to Wikipedia:

Aotearoa (Māori: [aɔˈtɛaɾɔa]; commonly pronounced by English speakers as /ˌɑːoʊtiːəˈroʊə/ is the current Māori name for New Zealand. Earlier Māori names for New Zealand included Nu Tirani, which was used in Te Tiriti o Waitangi, along with Nu Tirene, used in the He Whakaputanga Declaration of Independence. Aotearoa was originally used by the Māori people in reference to only the North Island but, since the late 19th century, the word has come to refer to the whole archipelago. Several meanings have been proposed for the name; the most popular translation usually given is "long white cloud", or variations thereof. This refers to the cloud formations which helped early Polynesian navigators find the country.

Beginning in the late 20th century, Aotearoa is becoming widespread in the bilingual names of national organisations and institutions. Since the 1990s, it has been customary for particular parties to sing the New Zealand national anthem, "God Defend New Zealand" (or "Aotearoa"), in both Māori and English exposing the name to a wider audience.

Etymology
The original meaning of Aotearoa is not known. The word can be broken up as: ao ('cloud', 'dawn', 'daytime' or 'world'), tea ('white', 'clear' or 'bright') and roa ('long'). It can also be broken up as Aotea, the name of one of the migratory canoes that travelled to New Zealand, and roa ('long'). One literal translation is 'long white cloud', commonly lengthened to 'the land of the long white cloud'. Alternative translations are 'long bright world' or 'land of abiding day', possibly referring to New Zealand having longer summer days in comparison to those further north in the Pacific Ocean.

Mythology
In some traditional stories, Aotearoa was the name of the canoe (waka) of the explorer Kupe, and he named the land after it. Kupe's wife Kuramārōtini (in some versions, his daughter) was watching the horizon and called "He ao! He ao!" ('a cloud! a cloud!'). Other versions say the canoe was guided by a long white cloud in the course of the day and by a long bright cloud at night. On arrival, the sign of land to Kupe's crew was the long cloud hanging over it. The cloud caught Kupe's attention and he said "Surely is a point of land". Due to the cloud which greeted them, Kupe named the land Aotearoa.

 

Edited September 18, 2021 by LawrenceChard

[Gordy]

1 hour ago, LawrenceChard said:

 

Perhaps that's the reason, so they don't need to impose Covid travel restrictions. Otherwise use out satnavs, or Google maps. 😎

According to Wikipedia:

Aotearoa (Māori: [aɔˈtɛaɾɔa]; commonly pronounced by English speakers as /ˌɑːoʊtiːəˈroʊə/ is the current Māori name for New Zealand. Earlier Māori names for New Zealand included Nu Tirani, which was used in Te Tiriti o Waitangi, along with Nu Tirene, used in the He Whakaputanga Declaration of Independence. Aotearoa was originally used by the Māori people in reference to only the North Island but, since the late 19th century, the word has come to refer to the whole archipelago. Several meanings have been proposed for the name; the most popular translation usually given is "long white cloud", or variations thereof. This refers to the cloud formations which helped early Polynesian navigators find the country.

Beginning in the late 20th century, Aotearoa is becoming widespread in the bilingual names of national organisations and institutions. Since the 1990s, it has been customary for particular parties to sing the New Zealand national anthem, "God Defend New Zealand" (or "Aotearoa"), in both Māori and English exposing the name to a wider audience.

Etymology
The original meaning of Aotearoa is not known. The word can be broken up as: ao ('cloud', 'dawn', 'daytime' or 'world'), tea ('white', 'clear' or 'bright') and roa ('long'). It can also be broken up as Aotea, the name of one of the migratory canoes that travelled to New Zealand, and roa ('long'). One literal translation is 'long white cloud', commonly lengthened to 'the land of the long white cloud'. Alternative translations are 'long bright world' or 'land of abiding day', possibly referring to New Zealand having longer summer days in comparison to those further north in the Pacific Ocean.

Mythology
In some traditional stories, Aotearoa was the name of the canoe (waka) of the explorer Kupe, and he named the land after it. Kupe's wife Kuramārōtini (in some versions, his daughter) was watching the horizon and called "He ao! He ao!" ('a cloud! a cloud!'). Other versions say the canoe was guided by a long white cloud in the course of the day and by a long bright cloud at night. On arrival, the sign of land to Kupe's crew was the long cloud hanging over it. The cloud caught Kupe's attention and he said "Surely is a point of land". Due to the cloud which greeted them, Kupe named the land Aotearoa.

 

commonly pronounced by English speakers as /ˌɑːoʊtiːəˈroʊə/

How the hell do English speakers pronounce this? jeez, even Google and Alexa would struggle

[westminstrel]

1 hour ago, Gordy said:

How the hell do English speakers pronounce this?

In all fairness, we English speaking people learn to pronounce all sorts of crazy made-up fantasy names, like Daenerys Targaryen, so I don’t see why we couldn’t learn to pronounce an actual name like Aotearoa especially when it means something to a certain people. 🙂

[Roy]

Have you ever tried to get your tongue around 'Machynlleth'?

[Gordy]

4 hours ago, Roy said:

Have you ever tried to get your tongue around 'Machynlleth'?

Welsh?

[dicker]

My Indian colleagues (in Delhi) use the old names of their cities out of simplicity when talking to me:

- Madras

- Bombay

- Calcucutta

It takes time for the names to be properly adopted.

[LawrenceChard]

12 hours ago, Gordy said:

commonly pronounced by English speakers as /ˌɑːoʊtiːəˈroʊə/

How the hell do English speakers pronounce this? jeez, even Google and Alexa would struggle

Yes, I thoguht about omitting that. Although I use dictionaries quite often, I never got round to working out how their phonetic pronunciations worked.

I guess now it's easier, because there are websites with pronunciations.

[LawrenceChard]

11 hours ago, westminstrel said:

In all fairness, we English speaking people learn to pronounce all sorts of crazy made-up fantasy names, like Daenerys Targaryen, so I don’t see why we couldn’t learn to pronounce an actual name like Aotearoa especially when it means something to a certain people. 🙂

I believe that authors and other writers have to take some care when selecting names for their characters, and Daenerys Targaryen is unlikely to have been any real person's name previously, although I would not be surprised to find that it has become a popular name now.

I agree about learning to pronounce acrual names, although it seems that Wikipedia is not much help.

9 hours ago, Roy said:

Have you ever tried to get your tongue around 'Machynlleth'?

I have never even met her! 😎

[LawrenceChard]

2 hours ago, dicker said:

My Indian colleagues (in Delhi) use the old names of their cities out of simplicity when talking to me:

- Madras

- Bombay

- Calcucutta

It takes time for the names to be properly adopted.

When you say "old names", do you mean the "old" English names, or the even older Indian names?

One of the worst anglicisations I know is Leghorn for Livorno.

[dicker]

The colonial names, which it would seem are rather unfashionable these days.  
 

Best

Dicker

[sixgun]

14 hours ago, Roy said:

Have you ever tried to get your tongue around 'Machynlleth'?

i am surprised at you Roy, Machynlleth is an easy one. English speakers pronounce it maˈχənɬɛθ 

[westminstrel]

4 hours ago, dicker said:

The colonial names, which it would seem are rather unfashionable these days.  
 

Best

Dicker

I guess people have a right to call the place where they live whichever way they want.

As a person of Indian origin myself, I can understand why the British anglicised the place names when they colonised India (which wasn’t even called India btw!), though whether it was justified or not is a different debate.

The Indians are now just changing their place names back to what they were. 🙂

A similar thing is happening here in Australia, where there’s a push for at least having the original Aboriginal place names alongside the English place names on signboards etc.  Which I personally think is not at all unreasonable.

[CollectorNo1]

15 hours ago, Roy said:

Have you ever tried to get your tongue around 'Machynlleth'?

No...but if she's fit I'm game....😝

[LawrenceChard]

4 minutes ago, CollectorNo1 said:

No...but if she's fit I'm game....😝

If you are game, someone might shoot you. (Probably @HerefordBullyun.)

[LawrenceChard]

14 minutes ago, westminstrel said:

I guess people have a right to call the place where they live whichever way they want.

As a person of Indian origin myself, I can understand why the British anglicised the place names when they colonised India (which wasn’t even called India btw!), though whether it was justified or not is a different debate.

The Indians are now just changing their place names back to what they were. 🙂

A similar thing is happening here in Australia, where there’s a push for at least having the original Aboriginal place names alongside the English place names on signboards etc.  Which I personally think is not at all unreasonable.

What was India called?

I noted India is from the Sanskrit name 'Sindhu'.

Anyone know what Iceland used to be called?

[sixgun]

6 minutes ago, LawrenceChard said:

Anyone know what Iceland used to be called?

i think it was originally called 'Iceland Foods'.

[sixgun]

The country was originally called Snæland (snowland) as well as Garðarshólmur (‘Isle of Garðar’) after the Swedish Viking Garðar Svavarsson.

I think Iceland is best and New Zealand is good too. Less of these tongue twisters and head scratchers.

[LawrenceChard]

1 minute ago, sixgun said:

The country was originally called Snæland (snowland) as well as Garðarshólmur (‘Isle of Garðar’) after the Swedish Viking Garðar Svavarsson.

I think Iceland is best and New Zealand is good too. Less of these tongue twisters and head scratchers.

Are you telling me the Swedes got there before the (so-called) Indians.

Oh, and the original name of Iceland was Bejam! 😎

[CollectorNo1]

24 minutes ago, LawrenceChard said:

What was India called?

I noted India is from the Sanskrit name 'Sindhu'.

Anyone know what Iceland used to be called?

Snaeland..or (Snowland)...

[Roy]

1 hour ago, sixgun said:

i am surprised at you Roy, Machynlleth is an easy one. English speakers pronounce it maˈχənɬɛθ 

No problem here, I'm quite the cunning linguist you know!

My first attempt was a seminal moment indeed, made me the man I am today 😊

[sovereignsteve]

21 minutes ago, Roy said:

No problem here, I'm quite the cunning linguist you know!

My first attempt was a seminal moment indeed, made me the man I am today 😊

Oh Roy did you have to?😉

I'm sure like me it was so long ago the main hazard was stray bits of foliage. I remember almost choking 😆

 

[sixgun]

1 hour ago, LawrenceChard said:

Oh, and the original name of Iceland was Bejam! 😎

Iceland Foods was always Iceland Foods. It started in Shropshire in 1970. In 1989 it took over its larger competitor Bejam which was based in the south, to create a national chain of shops.

So many useless facts in one day. Amazing.

There is an Iceland in San Javier and one in Torrevieja i go to sometimes - good for some UK brands which are hard to find.

Edited September 18, 2021 by sixgun