2022 Sovereign design revealed?

[LawrenceChard]

11 minutes ago, Mtaybar said:

The 2002 sovereign seems like a pretty high mintage to me. I've seen a few about for sale here and there and although a nice looking coin they seem pretty common. I'll guess at 20k because a few people reckon there should be enough to go around. Just a guess though. Personally I'd like to see it capped somewhere between 10k to 15k

I assume you are talking about the proofs.

Issue limits, prices, and actual designs are all still officially under embargo, but this has been really leaky.

I / we have only used information which has been in the public domain, so for example, our half dozen design interpretations, all base on the Privy Council notice combined with existing knowledge and memory.

Since the RM announced the release date, we can freely comment on that, because that is also in the public domain now.

Interestingly, what started much of this, the 1989 proof sovereign 500th anniversary issue, failed to sell its full issue limit. If you look, you will see the actual mintage was less thatn the issue limit. Perhaps I should have offered to take the unsold ones off the Royal Mint's hands! 

 

21 minutes ago, SidS said:

Not anytime soon then! 😁

Who knows?

[Mtaybar]

5 minutes ago, LawrenceChard said:

I assume you are talking about the proofs.

Issue limits, prices, and actual designs are all still officially under embargo, but this has been really leaky.

I / we have only used information which has been in the public domain, so for example, our half dozen design interpretations, all base on the Privy Council notice combined with existing knowledge and memory.

Since the RM announced the release date, we can freely comment on that, because that is also in the public domain now.

Interestingly, what started much of this, the 1989 proof sovereign 500th anniversary issue, failed to sell its full issue limit. If you look, you will see the actual mintage was less thatn the issue limit. Perhaps I should have offered to take the unsold ones off the Royal Mint's hands! 

Yes I'm only talking about the proofs. There's a big buzz over them for obvious reasons. Maybe the "enough to go around" would mean the bullion version will suit many people and be more affordable too.

I'm still on the fence about the proofs as the mintage could be quite high but then again... It's a pretty significant coin so will be much sought after by some in other countries where it's not as easy to obtain. (Not that I think it's going to be easy here either I hasten to add lol)

A BU bullion version would probably suit me more then a proof but having one of a small mintage proof would be something else! 

[LawrenceChard]

10 minutes ago, Mtaybar said:

Yes I'm only talking about the proofs. There's a big buzz over them for obvious reasons. Maybe the "enough to go around" would mean the bullion version will suit many people and be more affordable too.

I'm still on the fence about the proofs as the mintage could be quite high but then again... It's a pretty significant coin so will be much sought after by some in other countries where it's not as easy to obtain. (Not that I think it's going to be easy here either I hasten to add lol)

A BU bullion version would probably suit me more then a proof but having one of a small mintage proof would be something else! 

One thing we do know is the 2022s will be red rather than yellow!

I am sure someone out there will have already leaked the issue limits, otherwise all will be revealed on Monday.

[Mtaybar]

1 minute ago, LawrenceChard said:

One thing we do know is the 2022s will be red rather than yellow!

I am sure someone out there will have already leaked the issue limits, otherwise all will be revealed on Monday.

Monday will be interesting lol. 

[sovereignsteve]

7 minutes ago, LawrenceChard said:

I am sure someone out there will have already leaked the issue limits

I've not heard any if so

[Au79]

Make merry this weekend and be sober on monday for the unveiling. Hush hush the monkey mind 😆

[sovereignsteve]

1 hour ago, SilverJacks said:

Maybe the mintage will be higher this year? We all hope not but hope we get what we're after at the same time 😂

2002 sovereign 20,500

2005 - 15,458

2012 - 8,158

2017 10,500

Are you sure about these?  Sometimes it can be difficult to decipher the exact mintages as some sources are not so good at including those in sets etc

I have them on my list as follows;

2002    12,500

2005    12,500   although perhaps this one doesn't have that much relevance to this year's offering

2012     5,501

2017    13,500   not so much either

 

The two interesting ones are obviously the previous Jubilee issues of 2002 and 2012 and why their mintages differ so much. A quick look at the gold spot price at those times tells us that 2002 came at the end of a long period of sustained low spot price, before it rose. The 2012 was issued pretty much at the height of the first big rise.

I would be interested to hear what @LawrenceChardwould have to say as to the relative market conditions for proof sovereigns at those times.

 

[Altitudes]

How is the quality control on proof sovereigns? Are there nearly as many issues as a silver proof?

[SilverJacks]

2 minutes ago, sovereignsteve said:

Are you sure about these?  Sometimes it can be difficult to decipher the exact mintages as some sources are not so good at including those in sets etc

I have them on my list as follows;

2002    12,500

2005    12,500   although perhaps this one doesn't have that much relevance to this year's offering

2012     5,501

2017    13,500   not so much either

 

The two interesting ones are obviously the previous Jubilee issues of 2002 and 2012 and why their mintages differ so much. A quick look at the gold spot price at those times tells us that 2002 came at the end of a long period of sustained low spot price, before it rose. The 2012 was issued pretty much at the height of the first big rise.

I would be interested to hear what @LawrenceChardwould have to say as to the relative market conditions for proof sovereigns at those times.

 

I'm not certain of the figures but I can show you where I got them from. If anyone can confirm would be most appreciated

https://www.bullionbypost.co.uk/info/sovereign-mintages

[LawrenceChard]

12 minutes ago, sovereignsteve said:

I've not heard any if so

You been using E.S.P. again? 😎

 

3 minutes ago, sovereignsteve said:

Are you sure about these?  Sometimes it can be difficult to decipher the exact mintages as some sources are not so good at including those in sets etc

I have them on my list as follows;

2002    12,500

2005    12,500   although perhaps this one doesn't have that much relevance to this year's offering

2012     5,501

2017    13,500   not so much either

 

The two interesting ones are obviously the previous Jubilee issues of 2002 and 2012 and why their mintages differ so much. A quick look at the gold spot price at those times tells us that 2002 came at the end of a long period of sustained low spot price, before it rose. The 2012 was issued pretty much at the height of the first big rise.

I would be interested to hear what @LawrenceChardwould have to say as to the relative market conditions for proof sovereigns at those times.

 

I regret that we have often omitted including the issue limits and actual mintages on many coins, although it does involve considerable investment in human resources (that's my excuse).

"Relative market conditions" - Most of that is lost in the mists of time (or was it wine?).😎

[LawrenceChard]

1 minute ago, Altitudes said:

How is the quality control on proof sovereigns? Are there nearly as many issues as a silver proof?

So far, the Royal Mint has not introduced milk spotting on gold coins, (but they may have a secret department working on it).

Now, it they would just add a little silver to the sovereign alloy... 😎

[sovereignsteve]

1 minute ago, LawrenceChard said:

"Relative market conditions" - Most of that is lost in the mists of time (or was it wine?).😎

I suffer the same😉 In fact I have just put in my order for Christmas wine.

I don't know why the 2012 is such a low mintage, maybe the high gold price had stopped people buying?

[LawrenceChard]

3 minutes ago, SilverJacks said:

I'm not certain of the figures but I can show you where I got them from. If anyone can confirm would be most appreciated

https://www.bullionbypost.co.uk/info/sovereign-mintages

Bullion by Post?

Are they the people who are advertising a 1928 UK Silver Proof Crown?

https://www.bullionbypost.co.uk/collectible-coins/milled-coins/george-v-1928-proof-crown/

Spot the Boob.

(But I doubt they give free beer) 😎

[LawrenceChard]

Just now, sovereignsteve said:

I suffer the same😉 In fact I have just put in my order for Christmas wine.

I don't know why the 2012 is such a low mintage, maybe the high gold price had stopped people buying?

We bought 650, not bad out of 5501 (5000 in boxes).

Some day we might qualify for a direct supply. 😎

[sovereignsteve]

2 minutes ago, LawrenceChard said:

We bought 650, not bad out of 5501 (5000 in boxes).

Some day we might qualify for a direct supply. 😎

shame you didn't tuck some away under the counter for a few years

[LawrenceChard]

1 minute ago, sovereignsteve said:

shame you didn't tuck some away under the counter for a few years

You mean we didn't tell you? 😎

[SilverJacks]

6 minutes ago, LawrenceChard said:

Bullion by Post?

Are they the people who are advertising a 1928 UK Silver Proof Crown?

https://www.bullionbypost.co.uk/collectible-coins/milled-coins/george-v-1928-proof-crown/

Spot the Boob.

(But I doubt they give free beer) 😎

Their coin is very much like their free beer.

[Arganto]

9 minutes ago, LawrenceChard said:

Spot the Boob

1) Looks like a bullion issue to me but could be worn?

2) 28.28 not 28g, and the fineness is 50% or 14.4. Saying the fineness varies could be a way of saying it may be underweight I suppose but doesn't sound strictly accurate.

* 3) The mintage they quote is for all crown issued that year, not the proof issues.

Edited November 12, 2021 by Liam84
*

[LawrenceChard]

16 minutes ago, LawrenceChard said:

Bullion by Post?

Are they the people who are advertising a 1928 UK Silver Proof Crown?

https://www.bullionbypost.co.uk/collectible-coins/milled-coins/george-v-1928-proof-crown/

Spot the Boob.

(But I doubt they give free beer) 😎

 

9 minutes ago, SilverJacks said:

Their coin is very much like their free beer.

 

7 minutes ago, Liam84 said:

1) Looks like a bullion issue to me but could be worn?

2) 28.28 not 28g, and the fineness is 50% or 14.4. Saying the fineness varies could be a way of saying it may be underweight I suppose but doesn't sound strictly accurate.

* 3) The mintage they quote is for all crown issued that year, not the proof issues.

To the best of my 55+ years knowledge, there were no proof crowns that year, still what do I know?

😎

[sovereignsteve]

10 minutes ago, LawrenceChard said:

You mean we didn't tell you? 😎

That reminds me of a couple of occasions when your organisation has said "we were cleaning behind the xxxx in the strongroom and came upon some yyyyy that we had forgotten we had....😂

[LawrenceChard]

12 minutes ago, SilverJacks said:

Their coin is very much like their free beer.

You mean there is no such thing?

I missed that point on my first reading of your post.

[LawrenceChard]

1 minute ago, sovereignsteve said:

That reminds me of a couple of occasions when your organisation has said "we were cleaning behind the xxxx in the strongroom and came upon some yyyyy that we had forgotten we had....😂

That is more or less true.

I'd forgotteh where they were, and everyone else had forgotten we had them.

[danmc82]

Here are the mintages for the halfs if anyones interested. I've checked a couple of sources but If any are inaccurate let me know and I'll edit them.

1989 - 8,888

2002 - 10,000

2005 - 7,500

2012 - 2,303

2017 - 4,648

[sovereignsteve]

55 minutes ago, danmc82 said:

Here are the mintages for the halfs if anyones interested. I've checked a couple of sources but If any are inaccurate let me know and I'll edit them.

1989 - 8,888

2002 - 10,000

2005 - 7,500

2012 - 2,303

2017 - 4,648

I'm not saying they are inaccurate, it could be me.

I have the same for 1989, 2002 and 2012 but for the others;

2005   5011

2017   5150

 

so who knows?

[CollectorNo1]

I know we are all counting the hours down til Monday morning....just interested if anyone has any thoughts on the Platinum Jubilee silver 50p? Will it have the same reverse design as the gold sovreign?

Regards