How popular are 1/2 oz gold coins?

[Foster88]

1 hour ago, modofantasma said:

0.025 Oz as it's a tenth of a 1/4 🤔

That’s what I mean’t. 😆

[pricha]

I agree with most that 1/2 oz is the no man's land between the well off 1oz stackers  and us peasants the 1/4 oz or 1/10 oz / sovereign stackers.  Having said that I purchased my first ever double sovereign this year and I absolutely love it. 

[Stuntman]

As someone who mostly collects rather than stacks, I just have the one 1/2 oz gold coin (a 2020 bullion Britannia) for completeness.  

But I agree that it's kind-of in no-mans-land.  To stack, you would probably buy sovereigns, or 1 oz bullion, or perhaps double sovereigns.  And the 1/4 oz bullion coins make a nice alternative to sovereigns if you are able to buy and sell the same coin at similar percentage premiums over spot.

I'm not looking to buy any more 1/2 oz coins.  The only exception to this would be if (say) the RM released a series of bullion coins where the largest format was 1/2 oz, and I decided to collect these coins. 

Perhaps if the gold price rises to a level that would make a 1 oz bullion coin prohibitively expensive for all but the deepest pockets, the 1/2 oz coins might gain more favour.

[CANV]

I agree,  in the UK the double sov fills the gap 

[goldsilverdash]

On 27/07/2022 at 21:18, Stuntman said:

Perhaps if the gold price rises to a level that would make a 1 oz bullion coin prohibitively expensive for all but the deepest pockets, the 1/2 oz coins might gain more favour.

As far as I'm concerned, this already happened. At least for me, the price of a full ounce is a lot of money to put into gold at any one time. A 1/2 is at the upper limit for me personally of what I'm willing to buy gold for at a time. Also, I think it is good to have a range of sizes, it gives you more flexibility when the time comes to sell.

[Oliman]

To me its an odd inbetween size, would sooner have sovs, or 1/4 oz coins, as they similar size/ weight. So much more liquid to sell quickly if you need quick funds. 

Or go full hog and occassionally treat myself to 1oz. 

Also 1/10 to me are such an awkward coin. Only have one eagle and wont get anymore as i know i wont enjoy stacking them. 

 

[Aran]

The Indian Eagle $10 contains 0.483 Troy ounces of gold so qualifies for this discussion. An immensely popular coin on both sides of the big pond. Not too big or small, easy to liquidate and a lovely series to collect. I was delighted to add this 1914-S (MS64 in an old NGC holder) to my collection of Indian Eagles. Just 31 grade higher with NGC. In Mike Fuljenz’s book ‘Indian Gold Coins of the 20th Century’ the 1914-S is described thus:

’The luster is generally very brilliant and superior to that seen on most other issues in the series.’

I would concur. The lustre and golden richness of this Indian Eagle is quite scrumptious! The 1914-S joins my 1913-S and 1915-S (both semi-key dates and both MS63).

In addition common date examples in AU always command a good premium over spot.

If anyone is interested you can view my set ‘Aran Indian Head Eagles’ (Indian Head Eagles 1907-1933) on the NGC Registry. My set is ranked 73 worldwide!

[Britannia47]

2 hours ago, Aran said:

The Indian Eagle $10 contains 0.483 Troy ounces of gold so qualifies for this discussion. An immensely popular coin on both sides of the big pond. Not too big or small, easy to liquidate and a lovely series to collect. I was delighted to add this 1914-S (MS64 in an old NGC holder) to my collection of Indian Eagles. Just 31 grade higher with NGC. In Mike Fuljenz’s book ‘Indian Gold Coins of the 20th Century’ the 1914-S is described thus:

’The luster is generally very brilliant and superior to that seen on most other issues in the series.’

I would concur. The lustre and golden richness of this Indian Eagle is quite scrumptious! The 1914-S joins my 1913-S and 1915-S (both semi-key dates and both MS63).

In addition common date examples in AU always command a good premium over spot.

If anyone is interested you can view my set ‘Aran Indian Head Eagles’ (Indian Head Eagles 1907-1933) on the NGC Registry. My set is ranked 73 worldwide!

Whilst I don't collect these coins I do have signed copies of 'Indian Gold Coins' and  'Double Eagles' 1877 - 1907 by Mike Fuljenz.   I met him  in Beaumont TEXAS a few years ago where he runs 'Universal Coin' and consider him an expert in this field. Occasionally I refer to  these books to give more information to TSF members if needed. Minted in San Francisco. Yes, you are correct about the weight =  16.718g in 900 gold, although I suspect you would have paid more for this 1914 than a 1/2oz Brit! - Superb collectors coin.

[Centauri167]

On 26/07/2022 at 02:56, Foster88 said:

Something that I can’t quite understand is the dismissal for 1/2 oz gold coins.

We’ve all seen sale posts on the forum and the healthy discussions about 1/10th, 1/4oz and 1oz gold coins.

But, why are there so few posts about 1/2oz gold coins and even fewer sale posts.

I don’t understand the dismissal, is that the right word, maybe not, maybe the lack of the existence of the 1/2oz in any denomination or mint is almost non existent so we’re not used to seeing them.

I don’t see any reason why. Is it that the gold content is similar to the double sovereign? 

Is it the psychology of it being a ‘half’ of something? You’re not getting something full. But then we buy half sovereigns.

Which I suppose doesn’t make sense because the 1/10oz and 1/4oz gold coins on the forum are discussed often and sell very well.

I don’t understand why the 1/2 oz gold coins are, I suppose, mostly ignored.

I’d be interested to hear what you all think.

Do they deserve more appreciation?

Half of me is undecided.

I think that the premium on them is still way to high for the amount needed to buy one so I think that people with a small budget buy the 1/10 or 1/4 coins and when you have a bigger budget you just buy ounces or wait a bit longer and than buy an ounce for a much mower premium.

I think that if the premiums would only be a little bit higher than the one ounce coins, they would be much more wanted.

I remember I bought golden 50ECU ( not Euro's ) coins that are 15 gr. for only 2% premium every time my dealer had them in stock.

[goldsilverdash]

15 hours ago, Centauri167 said:

I think that if the premiums would only be a little bit higher than the one ounce coins, they would be much more wanted.

I think that is very true, and it is most probably the case that 1/2 coins sell very quickly whenever they are offered with a reasonable premium. It is possible to find such deals sometimes.

Still, people still buy silver at a 20% to 50% premium 🤪

Edited July 31, 2022 by goldsilverdash

[RDHC]

One point in favour of the half ounce coins if they are proof gold Britannias with a distinctive, one-off design, is that they are often quite reasonably priced compared to the one ounce or quarter ounce variants. I'm not well versed in the other species of half ouncers.

[LawrenceChard]

On 26/07/2022 at 01:56, Foster88 said:

Something that I can’t quite understand is the dismissal for 1/2 oz gold coins.

We’ve all seen sale posts on the forum and the healthy discussions about 1/10th, 1/4oz and 1oz gold coins.

But, why are there so few posts about 1/2oz gold coins and even fewer sale posts.

I don’t understand the dismissal, is that the right word, maybe not, maybe the lack of the existence of the 1/2oz in any denomination or mint is almost non existent so we’re not used to seeing them.

I don’t see any reason why. Is it that the gold content is similar to the double sovereign? 

Is it the psychology of it being a ‘half’ of something? You’re not getting something full. But then we buy half sovereigns.

Which I suppose doesn’t make sense because the 1/10oz and 1/4oz gold coins on the forum are discussed often and sell very well.

I don’t understand why the 1/2 oz gold coins are, I suppose, mostly ignored.

I’d be interested to hear what you all think.

Do they deserve more appreciation?

Half of me is undecided.

 

On 27/07/2022 at 00:30, Foster88 said:

I don’t suppose I nor anyone else here on the forum know how unpopular they are which is the whole point of my post.

I created this post after being here a few years and seeing the lack of sale posts for 1/2 oz gold coins. It was a post out of curiosity really. Intended as a conversation starter at the very least.

I suppose the bullion companies will know much more than we do by how many sales for 1/2 oz gold coins they have.

I much prefer sovereigns myself and don’t own any 1/2 oz gold coins so I can see the preference for a double sovereign over a 1/2 oz of gold coin.

What do you think @LawrenceChard?

I saw the topic on Tuesday, and thought I should give my thoughts on it, then got tagged in to it on Wednesday, thanks.

Quite a few of the other members have already said "Premium", which is undoubtedly a major part ot the explanation.

Most readers of this thread will probably have seen my recent "Advice Guide for UK Bullion Investors"

https://www.chards.co.uk/blog/advice-guide-for-uk-bullion-investors/1041

An early paragraph on this page says:

Gold Buying Advice
Investment gold is exempt from VAT in the UK (& also EU). 
You should aim to buy at the lowest percentage premium within reason. It is important to compare percentage premiums, not prices to ensure you are getting the best deal.  
Does size matter? Yes! 
One ounce gold bullion coins are usually available at low premiums. We dedicate a page to comparing one ounce coins to fractional sizes. 
Gold sovereigns are often available at only slightly higher premiums, and are more affordable because they are smaller, containing just less than a quarter ounce (0.2354 tr oz) of fine gold. 
Gold bars are usually available at premiums similar to, or slightly less than, equivalent gold coins. 
Most coins and bars smaller than one ounce usually cost a relatively high premium, and therefore are not such good value. 

One of the links from it is "One Ounce Gold Coins vs Other Fractional Sizes", but it is too general, and needs an improved version, which I will work on.

An very old page on our first website:

https://24carat.co.uk/frame.php?url=krugers.html

It includes this:

Low Premium over Gold
According to the publicity at the time, the Kruger was to be made available to world bullion dealers at a 3% premium over the current gold fix, so that after distribution costs, the coins would be available to investors in quantity at about 4% to 5% over intrinsic gold values, and possibly 10% premium for single pieces.

Smaller Sizes
The fractional sizes were issued at higher premiums to bullion dealers of 5%, 7%, and 9% respectively. The fractional coins have never been as popular as the full one ounce coins, usually only being purchased as singles, so that in practice, it would usually cost 10% to 15% premium for the half and quarter ounce, and from 20% to 50% premium for the tenth ounce, most of which seem to have been used in jewellery. Most bullion houses do not want the bother of handling small quantities of low value coins.
As an example of this, in the 1970's we, as a small provincial dealer, would frequently handle 500 Krugerrands in a single day, but a purchase of 100 tenth Krugerrands was a major event, yet it was only 1/50th the size of deal!

Lots of things have changed since then, but the basic fact remains that smaller size coins cost more in percentage terms to produce, therefore they are rarely bought by serious investors. It follows that there are not big volumes of them around on the secondary market.

Smaller sizes are bought in small quantities as gifts, by collectors, and some stackers, but this demand is not enough to make stocking them worthwhile for bullion dealers without making a higher margin on them to compensate for them being slower moving stock.

There are some exceptions. Most of the above applies primarily to new coins, and mainly to modern one ounce coins.

If you can buy fractional sizes at low % premiums similar to ounce coins, then you should consider doing so.

Also, older coins, which were previously used in circulation, are mainly smaller than one coins, and can often be bought at competitive premiums, although in heavy demand times, the supply tends to dry up.

British gold sovereigns are a prime example of this. They are "usually" available secondary market at modest premiums, but again in the past few years, the "pool" of available secondary market ones has been very shallow.

Fortunately, the Royal Mint do produce brand new gold sovereigns, and these are readily available at lower premiums than half ounce, quarter ounce, or tenth ounce coins. They are not much higher premium than most new one ounce coins, which is why we include them in our gold coin best buys.

Just recently we have also been able to offer new 2022 bullion double sovereigns at premiums similar to sovereigns. As these are close to being half ounce coins, they are a sensible choice right now, although this is not likely to last long. I think when existng stocks of them run out, there may be no more minted this year.

I hope that sums up most of what I know, but if I have missed anything out, or these are more questions, please go ahead and ask.

😎

[Foster88]

@LawrenceChard thanks for your input and sharing your knowledge. 😊

[goldsilverdash]

13 hours ago, LawrenceChard said:

If you can buy fractional sizes at low % premiums similar to ounce coins, then you should consider doing so.

Indeed, that's excellent advice, and that's precisely what I and I guess many others try to do. This is why I doubted the very premise of this discussion; fractional gold coins are probably not that unpopular - they are very attractive whenever they are offered at a lower premium. So no need to worry about getting them sold, right?

[LawrenceChard]

3 hours ago, goldsilverdash said:

Indeed, that's excellent advice, and that's precisely what I and I guess many others try to do. This is why I doubted the very premise of this discussion; fractional gold coins are probably not that unpopular - they are very attractive whenever they are offered at a lower premium. So no need to worry about getting them sold, right?

Spot on!

😎