The collapse of the coin collector market

[goldsilverdash]

I’m a stacker, not a collector, so the main thing for me is always the precious metal content of the coin, not its design. That said, some coin designs appeal to me more so than others, and generally I dislike the more overtly political symbols. Faces of rulers are obviously political symbols, and so is a lot of other motifs on coins. The Brittania too is a political symbol, being a personification of a nation, glorifying rule, power, empire, dominion, subjugation, war…

 

One of the least political coin designs must be the Wiener Philharmoniker, having musical instruments on both sides. It is hard to see how that glorifies the state, political authority, and violence.

[Xander]

On 15/07/2022 at 01:51, Foster88 said:

That’s a very good point. It probably was a lie that got out of hand.

The coin that really stands out for me as ‘hypocrite’ and I know many people love it, but it’s the 1oz gold USA Buffallo.

It depicts a Native American surrounded by the words ‘liberty’. 😬

It’s a beautiful design, well designed and executed, but the word ‘liberty’.
It’s a big insult to Native Americans, liberty is the last thing they got.

Awkward or what.

They should change " Liberty " to, taking a Liberty.

[pricha]

1 hour ago, goldsilverdash said:

I’m a stacker, not a collector, so the main thing for me is always the precious metal content of the coin, not its design. That said, some coin designs appeal to me more so than others, and generally I dislike the more overtly political symbols. Faces of rulers are obviously political symbols, and so is a lot of other motifs on coins. The Brittania too is a political symbol, being a personification of a nation, glorifying rule, power, empire, dominion, subjugation, war…

 

One of the least political coin designs must be the Wiener Philharmoniker, having musical instruments on both sides. It is hard to see how that glorifies the state, political authority, and violence.

If you're worried about the ethics of a design of a coin surely you shouldn't be collecting gold at all given where most of it came from and how it was mined ? Maybe the Wiener Philharmoniker coin is ethical gold ???? I very much doubt it.  Still nice to signal your virtue... cough 

Edited July 23, 2022 by pricha

[Xander]

55 minutes ago, pricha said:

If you're worried about the ethics of a design of a coin surely you shouldn't be collecting gold at all given where most of it came from and how it was mined ? Maybe the Wiener Philharmoniker coin is ethical gold ???? I very much doubt it.  Still nice to signal your virtue... cough 

I wonder if, ethical Gold is the same as ethical diamonds, ethical cobalt? etc. 👀

[Britannia47]

10 hours ago, pricha said:

If you're worried about the ethics of a design of a coin surely you shouldn't be collecting gold at all given where most of it came from and how it was mined ? Maybe the Wiener Philharmoniker coin is ethical gold ???? I very much doubt it.  Still nice to signal your virtue... cough 

https://www.lebrusanstudio.com/pages/the-trouble-with-gold-mining#:~:text=For over a century%2C cyanide,in the gold-mining process.

I certainly agree. All mining and extraction of minerals from the ground comes at a price. Comparing different designs on a gold coin is no argument at all ethically. I wonder how they made all those brass instruments in the orchestra?!!! Also being a 'stacker' or a 'collector' is irrelevant.

When admiring any gold coin, its worth reflecting on its provenance ie the 'toil and trouble' it took to bring 4 tons of ore up from a deep mine for example......not withstanding the refining and minting!

 

 

[goldsilverdash]

16 hours ago, pricha said:

If you're worried about the ethics of a design of a coin surely you shouldn't be collecting gold at all given where most of it came from and how it was mined ? Maybe the Wiener Philharmoniker coin is ethical gold ???? I very much doubt it.  Still nice to signal your virtue... cough 

Ethical concerns about gold mining is a topic for another time, I never said anything about that. For a stacker, the design of a coin is not of major importance, but it does influence my choice of bullion coins to some degree. There are several options on the market, with very little difference apart from the design, so why should I not let the design impact what I buy? I'm not telling anybody else what they should be buying, just that I personally perfer less politically loaded coin designs.

[goldsilverdash]

6 hours ago, Britannia47 said:

https://www.lebrusanstudio.com/pages/the-trouble-with-gold-mining#:~:text=For over a century%2C cyanide,in the gold-mining process.

I certainly agree. All mining and extraction of minerals from the ground comes at a price. Comparing different designs on a gold coin is no argument at all ethically. I wonder how they made all those brass instruments in the orchestra?!!! Also being a 'stacker' or a 'collector' is irrelevant.

When admiring any gold coin, its worth reflecting on its provenance ie the 'toil and trouble' it took to bring 4 tons of ore up from a deep mine for example......not withstanding the refining and minting!

Whether you are a stacker or a collector is relevant, I would have thought. Because a collector is often willing to pay a large premium to get a particular coin, whilst a stacker just wants to buy as much gold or silver as they can get for the lowest cost per ounce.

[Petra]

Whatever people believe, at auction today all the coins that collectors go for seemed to make very good money… gold, silver and cupronickel.

[SidS]

My thoughts on it are these. As a collector you are playing two markets, the numismatic and the bullion (with emphasis on the numismatic regarding premiums). As a stacker you are simply playing the bullion market, that's not to say that a bullion piece may not attract a numismatic market as time goes by.

Should the gold (or silver) price fall then as a stacker your wealth depreciates and you are very much exposed to the current market price. As a collector, whilst the spot price may fall and reduce the value of what you hold, it can be buoyed up by the numismatic value (and vice versa should a collectable go out of favour).

I see the numismatic flavour of my holdings as insurance against the spot price collapsing and conversely the precious metal content bring the insurance against the collector market collapsing.

It's only if both completely collapse that I'm ****ed.

[RDHC]

On 24/07/2022 at 19:23, SidS said:

My thoughts on it are these. As a collector you are playing two markets, the numismatic and the bullion (with emphasis on the numismatic regarding premiums). As a stacker you are simply playing the bullion market, that's not to say that a bullion piece may not attract a numismatic market as time goes by.

Should the gold (or silver) price fall then as a stacker your wealth depreciates and you are very much exposed to the current market price. As a collector, whilst the spot price may fall and reduce the value of what you hold, it can be buoyed up by the numismatic value (and vice versa should a collectable go out of favour).

I see the numismatic flavour of my holdings as insurance against the spot price collapsing and conversely the precious metal content bring the insurance against the collector market collapsing.

It's only if both completely collapse that I'm ****ed.

Very well put.