Blehhhh talks about bullion dealer's prices

[Blehhhh]

1 hour ago, LawrenceChard said:

The description on the Flickr page says:

We should have added 100 from our existing stock, and made it a half tonne, which is what we were trying to buy, so we just took what was due to become available.

So, no, they are not all pre-ordered (In normal times, we buy for stock, not to order).

I am not going to tell you what we pay for them, but we do have them for sale on our website, in a few places:

https://www.chards.co.uk/1kg-vat-free-silver-new-bar-metalor/10164 

Although this says out of stock, they can be made available if bought in quantity, but we would need to ship them there.

https://www.chards.co.uk/silver-1-kilo-bar-metalor/796 (singles)

https://www.chards.co.uk/silver-1-kilo-ten-bar-bundle-metalor/11780 (bundles of 10)

Because they are KILO bars, we have priced them in metric rather than troy ounces, but this search page has approximate per ounce prices:

https://www.chards.co.uk/category/buy-bars/a/silver

 

Thanks, I did some maths.

I think Kilo bars work out about 33 percent premium, assuming we are counting VAT as part of premium.

Not bad in todays world, but you guys have to catch up with Bairds who are around 25- 27 percent. Come on Lawrence, sort it out for us 😀

[LawrenceChard]

10 minutes ago, Blehhhh said:

Thanks, I did some maths.

I think Kilo bars work out about 33 percent premium, assuming we are counting VAT as part of premium.

Not bad in todays world, but you guys have to catch up with Bairds who are around 25- 27 percent. Come on Lawrence, sort it out for us 😀

We hardly ever calculate % premium on new silver, firstly because of the VAT, and also because there is a bigger element of manufacturing cost in silver than in gold, so refiners, mints etc, usually work on a semi-fixed "fashion" charge as opposed to percentage, although many also use a mixture, to better reflect their actual costings.

The VAT element screws it all anyway.

We do mention that here: https://www.chards.co.uk/blog/silver-can-be-a-good-investment/434

... but that is a port of an old TFG page which now has a redirect on it (FFS!)

You want us to go and sort Bairds out? Got any mates we can take along?

[Blehhhh]

1 minute ago, LawrenceChard said:

We hardly ever calculate % premium on new silver, firstly because of the VAT, and also because there is a bigger element of manufacturing cost in silver than in gold, so refiners, mints etc, usually work on a semi-fixed "fashion" charge as opposed to percentage, although many also use a mixture, to better reflect their actual costings.

The VAT element screws it all anyway.

We do mention that here: https://www.chards.co.uk/blog/silver-can-be-a-good-investment/434

... but that is a port of an old TFG page which now has a redirect on it (FFS!)

You want us to go and sort Bairds out? Got any mates we can take along?

No, I meant sort yourselves out🤣, so you are at least matching Bairds prices on bars.

Sorry, I can be blunt.

[LawrenceChard]

16 minutes ago, Blehhhh said:

No, I meant sort yourselves out🤣, so you are at least matching Bairds prices on bars.

Sorry, I can be blunt.

Nobody can be the cheapest on everything all the time, unless you are Harvey Ross.

Since we bought that batch, Metalor have increased (double?) its fashion charge.

[Blehhhh]

1 minute ago, LawrenceChard said:

Nobody can be the cheapest on everything all the time, unless you are Harvey Ross.

Since we bought that batch, Metalor have increased (double?) its fashion charge.

Ah I know, just throwing it out there that Bairds are consistently beating you on everything. 

I've been looking to buy something from Chards but cant find anything that you guys win on.

Dont get me wrong, you are still good value compared to most dealers. But you need to match Bairds, no excuses 😜.

[LawrenceChard]

12 minutes ago, Blehhhh said:

Ah I know, just throwing it out there that Bairds are consistently beating you on everything. 

I've been looking to buy something from Chards but cant find anything that you guys win on.

Dont get me wrong, you are still good value compared to most dealers. But you need to match Bairds, no excuses 😜.

We don't try to match Bairds, or anyone else. Beating them yes!

How about honesty, transparency, advice, opinions, professionalism? I think we were well ahead of them while they were closed down recently, so I heard.

Oh, and BTW:

https://taxfreegold.co.uk/bairdgoldline.html

 

[Nick1368]

22 minutes ago, Blehhhh said:

Ah I know, just throwing it out there that Bairds are consistently beating you on everything. 

I've been looking to buy something from Chards but cant find anything that you guys win on.

Dont get me wrong, you are still good value compared to most dealers. But you need to match Bairds, no excuses 😜.

have you ordered from Bairds during the lockdown and have you actually received your items ?

A lot of dealers are still taking orders but they are not dispatching orders until the lockdown is over and that is  not good enough for me in this coronavirus situation, I don't know if Bairds are one of them or not because on their website it says you can place orders and they don't mention anything about Delievery after lockdown, they just say deliveries take longer , but  if you visit their website you see that it was last updated on the 27th of March .

some dealers like chards, Atkinson's and ATS Bullion have started taking orders again and they are actually dispatching these orders and for that reason I placed an order with chards today.

 

[Blehhhh]

1 minute ago, Nick1368 said:

have you ordered from Bairds during the lockdown and have you actually received your items ?

A lot of dealers are still taking orders but they are not dispatching orders until the lockdown is over and that is  not good enough for me in this coronavirus situation, I don't know if Bairds are one of them or not because on their website it says you can place orders and they don't mention anything about Delievery after lockdown, they just say deliveries take longer , but  if you visit their website you see that it was last updated on the 27th of March .

some dealers like chards, Atkinson's and ATS Bullion have started taking orders again and they are actually dispatching these orders and for that reason I placed an order with chards today.

 

 

Yes I have placed orders with Bairds and received. In fact some orders came within 3 days which surprised me!. 

First order was delayed due to payment issues on my side.

I have got order with Europeanmint for ages now, still waiting, so you are not wrong on some dealers taking ages.

I just feel some dealers are taking advantage of the situation to charge more. Which is fair enough, they are a business, but we can highlight were competitors are significantly cheaper to give them a kick. If one dealer can do it they should be following or trying to get closer.

 

[silverdocket]

1 hour ago, LawrenceChard said:

We don't try to match Bairds, or anyone else. Beating them yes!

How about honesty, transparency, advice, opinions, professionalism? I think we were well ahead of them while they were closed down recently, so I heard.

Oh, and BTW:

https://taxfreegold.co.uk/bairdgoldline.html

 

Not nice to see companies talking about other companies. 

I was talking to them today and they're open but You have me slightly worried now. I have what I consider a big order in and paid for.  

 

[SilverPirate007]

38 minutes ago, silverdocket said:

Not nice to see companies talking about other companies. 

I was talking to them today and they're open but You have me slightly worried now. I have what I consider a big order in and paid for.  

 

I have had no issues with Baird they are very professional

[5huggy]

2 hours ago, LawrenceChard said:

You want us to go and sort Bairds out? Got any mates we can take along?

  😉🤣🤣   

[LawrenceChard]

36 minutes ago, SilverPirate007 said:

I have had no issues with Baird they are very professional

 

1 hour ago, silverdocket said:

Not nice to see companies talking about other companies. 

I was talking to them today and they're open but You have me slightly worried now. I have what I consider a big order in and paid for.  

 

There is no reason why one company should not talk about another. Companies, their staff and their owners, have as much right as other people. TSF members regularly talk about companies.

It is important that comments are fair and accurate. I try to select my words with considerable care.

When I said "How about honesty, transparency, advice, opinions, professionalism?", firstly it was a question, not a statement of fact, but we aspire to all those things, and not all of our competitors do, so I would hope we would "win", or score more highly, on most of them. That was talking primarily about ourselves.

Earlier today I made a passing refrence to Harvey Ross, of whom you may never had heard.

 

He was a very high profile dealer in his day, and a P.I.T.A. as a competitor. He often got favourable press comment, until the day he ran off with millions of pounds worth of investors' money and Krugerrands.

I actually quite like him, and still have some respect for his abilities as a dealer, but I do detest his lack of ethics. I would find it interesting to meet up with him again, and think he might be quite open about events around the time. Perhaps one day...

Now, if I or some other dealer had put you wise about H.M.R. before he decamped with your money, would you still think it "not nice" to talk about them.

I happen to believe that everyone in our industry should operate to high standards of integrity, and I am not afraid to express concerns or negative comments when I am aware of matters. I do no intend to actively angage in publishing negative criticism on T.S.F. of our competitors, but if something of relevance comes to mind, then neither do I intend to suppress it, as for example the legal profession do. 

Hopefully, nothing I say on T.S.F. should be too contentious, but I also remain unafraid to publish my thoughts elsewhere, even when they are critical of a competitor, as you may notice if your read any of it, especially on our older websites.

 

[LawrenceChard]

1 hour ago, silverdocket said:

Not nice to see companies talking about other companies. 

I was talking to them today and they're open but You have me slightly worried now. I have what I consider a big order in and paid for.  

 

I have no reason to doubt that they will supply your order to your satisfaction. I don't think there any reason for you to worry.

[LawrenceChard]

1 hour ago, 5huggy said:

  😉🤣🤣   

Psst, got any phone numbers?

[Blehhhh]

@LawrenceChard, I dont get what you are trying to say.

Are you in a round about way saying Bairds are run by unsavory characters by bringing up old articles?. 

Or just that they possibly could be?

[DarkChameleon]

I dont think anyone is slandering anyone else but companies dealwith other companies all thetime and hear about other companies so are they limited to not saying anything?, no.

Can they expressreservations to their custoners?, yes, who doesnt have a LCS that tells them about the goings on localy?....id lime to thinm theydidnt keep their mouths shut, you can say by ways of expressing your benefits without saying someone else is crooked or plays the loopholes of ho,ding onto, dealing without owning or even having a contract in hand to deliver etc...playing the delays by situation when jt might be they are paying lessfor non priority delivery etc.

[LawrenceChard]

14 minutes ago, Blehhhh said:

@LawrenceChard, I dont get what you are trying to say.

Are you in a round about way saying Bairds are run by unsavory characters by bringing up old articles?. 

Or just that they possibly could be?

I said what I was trying to say.

I was not trying to say that "Bairds are run by unsavory characters",  T.S.F. is not the place for it, and I do not believe that to be the case. In fact, I know little about Baird's management since Tony Baird died some years ago, except that I think it is run by his son.

The facts about the copyright infringement are accurately reported in link, which provides evidence to support my case.

Just because that page is "old" does not make it inaccurate, incorrect, or irrelevant.

I believe Baird are probably aware of the existence of the page, but you are welcome to bring it to their attention if you wish, it may catalyse them to "do the decent thing" and offer us some belated compensation for the unauthorised use of our photos.

 

[silverdocket]

37 minutes ago, LawrenceChard said:

 

There is no reason why one company should not talk about another. Companies, their staff and their owners, have as much right as other people. TSF members regularly talk about companies.

It is important that comments are fair and accurate. I try to select my words with considerable care.

When I said "How about honesty, transparency, advice, opinions, professionalism?", firstly it was a question, not a statement of fact, but we aspire to all those things, and not all of our competitors do, so I would hope we would "win", or score more highly, on most of them. That was talking primarily about ourselves.

Earlier today I made a passing refrence to Harvey Ross, of whom you may never had heard.

 

He was a very high profile dealer in his day, and a P.I.T.A. as a competitor. He often got favourable press comment, until the day he ran off with millions of pounds worth of investors' money and Krugerrands.

I actually quite like him, and still have some respect for his abilities as a dealer, but I do detest his lack of ethics. I would find it interesting to meet up with him again, and think he might be quite open about events around the time. Perhaps one day...

Now, if I or some other dealer had put you wise about H.M.R. before he decamped with your money, would you still think it "not nice" to talk about them.

I happen to believe that everyone in our industry should operate to high standards of integrity, and I am not afraid to express concerns or negative comments when I am aware of matters. I do no intend to actively angage in publishing negative criticism on T.S.F. of our competitors, but if something of relevance comes to mind, then neither do I intend to suppress it, as for example the legal profession do. 

Hopefully, nothing I say on T.S.F. should be too contentious, but I also remain unafraid to publish my thoughts elsewhere, even when they are critical of a competitor, as you may notice if your read any of it, especially on our older websites.

Thanks for the reply I appreciate it,  well written. 

[Blehhhh]

47 minutes ago, LawrenceChard said:

I said what I was trying to say.

I was not trying to say that "Bairds are run by unsavory characters",  T.S.F. is not the place for it, and I do not believe that to be the case. In fact, I know little about Baird's management since Tony Baird died some years ago, except that I think it is run by his son.

The facts about the copyright infringement are accurately reported in link, which provides evidence to support my case.

Just because that page is "old" does not make it inaccurate, incorrect, or irrelevant.

I believe Baird are probably aware of the existence of the page, but you are welcome to bring it to their attention if you wish, it may catalyse them to "do the decent thing" and offer us some belated compensation for the unauthorised use of our photos.

 

Thanks for honesty, it is appreciated. 

I was just confused as you linked the Baird copyright infringement thing and also an article about Bullion guy who robbed millions.

To be honest, I dont think the average purchaser will pay any heed to the infringement article you linked....Its the prices that matter and Bairds are beating Chards on just about everything. As a noob I thought you guys would try to at least match.

[Booky586]

5 hours ago, Blehhhh said:

Ah I know, just throwing it out there that Bairds are consistently beating you on everything. 

I've been looking to buy something from Chards but cant find anything that you guys win on.

 

40 minutes ago, Blehhhh said:

Its the prices that matter and Bairds are beating Chards on just about everything. As a noob I thought you guys would try to at least match.

Looks like Chards are very competetive to Bairds when you look at http://goldprice.eu5.net/#

[Blehhhh]

20 minutes ago, Booky586 said:

 

Looks like Chards are very competetive to Bairds when you look at http://goldprice.eu5.net/#

I really dont know how this image is produced but it doesnt appear to be accurate. A quick look at sovereigns for example, I found for 331 on Bairds. Its listed as 343 above.

If I actually go to the websites, I cant find anything I was buying that they have beaten them on.

I bought gold bars, silver bars, cheapest 1oz gold coins I could find and some sovereigns. In each case Bairds significantly beat them.

 

[Kman]

8 minutes ago, Blehhhh said:

I bought gold bars, silver bars, cheapest 1oz gold coins I could find and some sovereigns. In each case Bairds significantly beat them.

Well just be thankful you can buy from them then and stop complaining 😛 

[ChrisSilver]

I have moved the recent posts in the other topic to here, as to not let that topic go off rail.

The cheapest in stock 1KG Silver Metalor bars in the UK, I can currently find is at Chards.

@Blehhhh if you can see a current cheaper UK or EU dealer (with delivery) who have 1KG Silver Metalor Bars in stock, please let us know as everyone is always looking for good deals.
 

[LawrenceChard]

23 minutes ago, Blehhhh said:

Thanks for honesty, it is appreciated. 

I was just confused as you linked the Baird copyright infringement thing and also an article about Bullion guy who robbed millions.

To be honest, I dont think the average purchaser will pay any heed to the infringement article you linked....Its the prices that matter and Bairds are beating Chards on just about everything. As a noob I thought you guys would try to at least match.

For the last month or more, we have not been able to keep up with demand. 

It is common knowledge that there has been panic-level buying mainly of gold, but also of silver. 

This was at a time when we were having to make decisions and changes daily, about safe working for our staff, for our customers, and for ourselves. 

I have mentioned much of this elsewhere on TSF, and it is also detailed on our website. 

Some of our staff have childcare priorities, but are managing to work around this, at home; this includes almost all of our customer service team. 

We have installed a new telephone system, equipped newly home-based staff with company computers, provided safe distance working for the small core who pick, check, pack, receive deliveries. We even bought very expensive masks for all staff. Some staff have vulnerable family members at home, and not all our staff can contribute fully from home, but we are quite pleased that we have been able to cope with some of the increased demand. 

To give a perspective, one day we were getting 300 incoming telephone calls per hour, and each answered call was probably taking 2 to 3 times longer to answer than normal. That day we only managed to answer about 2% of the incoming calls. However, I think we did manage to pack and ship almost everything where we had stock. 

Our "small" sales increased by about 50% in that period, while one of our biggest sales value ranges increased by a factor of 7. If we could have fielded twice the number of trained staff, we might have coped with 10 times the normal demand, but not 50 times. 

Most of our sales are of gold, but we also sell silver bullion, and numismatic coins. 

Whether some dealers were cheaper than us on some products was not at the top of our priority list. Trying to source competitively priced bullion products was at or near the top of our priorities. From experience, I know that some hysterical buyers will go elsewhere and pay rip-off prices from other dealers just because they happen to have physical stock, and this is frustrating for us, as we try very hard to achieve a fair and sensible balance between price and availability. 

Now that demand has eased back to only about 4 times normal levels, we should be able to comparison-check our silver bars, and some of our other secondary bullion products. If you want silver bars in a hurry, you might choose to buy them from Baird, (it will make our packing staff happy), but if you are not desperate, then I expect you will start to see better deals soon, including from us. I did copy your comments to our management team. 

In our silver blog page, we state our preference for silver coins rather than silver bars, and we explain why, including CGT on British ones. We also offer VAT free silver, for storage in Guernsey. Although I was happy to be able to source physical stock of kilo silver bars, I would be more excited to get a big delivery of silver Britannias (two tonnes would be a good start), but the Royal Mint are on reduced production, and are concentrating on gold and collector coins, plus producing some face masks, so we are all having to wait for our silver coins. Foreign mints are in similar positions, and most, if not all, have increased their prices. 

I understand that, as an investor or consumer, you want the lowest possible price. So do I, but I also prefer to use products from ethical sources and honest companies. If you will excuse me for talking about other companies for a moment, I would never happily buy anything from Currys , Halfords, Dixons, or P.C. World, because I strongly dislike their whole business ethics, and because you can always find better value elsewhere. You are, of course, always at liberty to make your own choices. 

I had probably best stop here, because I could quite easily write a book or two, if I have not done so already! 

 

[Darr3nG]

46 minutes ago, Blehhhh said:

I really dont know how this image is produced but it doesnt appear to be accurate. A quick look at sovereigns for example, I found for 331 on Bairds. Its listed as 343 above.

Always interested in feedback for the site and try to keep the most up-to-date prices. If you find any errors, please send on the links and I can quickly update, where valid.

I have also found a cheaper-than-listed price for a sovereign on Bairds [https://www.bairdmint.com/products/king-george-v-gold-sovereign] but feel this may be a mistake, as they do not have the usual price breaks listed - if not, this is indeed the cheapest sovereign currently available. I'll leave it until tomorrow, and if still valid I'll update.

Note: the default option for the Compare Gold Prices (UK) is to display prices, including postage. There is a button to remove this and re-order the listings, if preferred, for a raw comparison.