Negative Interest rates and the ban on cash

[garthy]

2 hours ago, Oldun said:

http://www.bbc.com/news/business-36889828

This sort of thing will become more and more common and what it's saying is 'that money we slave so hard for is now actually worthless'

Let's hope the people don't work it out...

 

[SilverPirate]

Taking out your cash and putting it under the mattress has a ccouple of drawer backs,theft obviuosly the first,second when you go to change it when her majesty dies to charles notes then to william, where did you get all that cash sir.third Fire.and maybe fourth if we go a cashless society what do you do with it,take it back to the bank?

Other investment other than cash look a darn sight more atractive, i saw in the news yesterday one actor has his childrens money in a wine investment account. I am not saying do this it is just an example.

[whitesands1]

23 minutes ago, garthy said:

25 minutes ago, garthy said:

Let's hope the people don't work it out...

 

19 minutes ago, SilverPirate said:

Where did you get all that cash sir?

People will work it out, when it is too late.  We have a world economy strangled by debt and the solution that the Banksters and Treasuries come up with is more debt at giveaway prices.  I have to say that it is so obvious that there is a massive hidden problem if Carnage has to constantly make statements that don't really add up.  For example, what difference, really, does an interest rate of 0.5 or 0.25 really make in the real world, and yet it sends out a message that our economy is in a mess.  And then the focus on negative, this psychologically says "We are bust"?

There is no talk of negative rates in the US and their debt bubble is very significant.  So what is really wrong in the UK, what are we not being told.......?

 

[Oldun]

So far this is not  for personal accounts as it says in the article

[Paul]

1 hour ago, Oldun said:

So far this is not  for personal accounts as it says in the article

watch this space - tip toe tip toe , step by step a little at a time. Fees for all bank accounts will be here sooner or later

The seeds have been planted in the UK populous sub-conscious every few months for years now to get them used to it

https://www.google.co.uk/?gws_rd=ssl#q=the+end+of+free+banking+uk

Or of course, there will be a solution, there always is, if you dont wish to be charged for your bank account and its usage try SnakeBanks new offering 'Free account' that can only be used via the web only, no branches, electronic transfers for everything. is a fully cashless account so no ATM withdrawls possible with option to have implantable chip under your skin.

Together with this we have bails ins written into law

Money you think you have as savings in the bank are not in fact yours once deposited, not 100% safe and you are merely a creditor of the bank 

 A joint paper by the US Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation and the Bank of England dated December 10, 2012, shows that these plans have been long in the making; that they originated with the G20 Financial Stability Board in Basel, Switzerland

legally the bank owns the depositor's funds as soon as they are put in the bank. Our money becomes the bank's, and we become unsecured creditors holding IOUs or promises to pay. (See here and here.) But until now the bank has been obligated to pay the money back on demand in the form of cash. Under the FDIC-BOE plan, our IOUs will be converted into "bank equity." The bank will get the money and we will get stock in the bank. With any luck we may be able to sell the stock to someone else, but when and at what price? Most people keep a deposit account so they can have ready cash to pay the bills.

The 15-page FDIC-BOE document is called "Resolving Globally Active, Systemically Important, Financial Institutions."  It begins by explaining that the 2008 banking crisis has made it clear that some other way besides taxpayer bailouts is needed to maintain "financial stability." Evidently anticipating that the next financial collapse will be on a grander scale than either the taxpayers or Congress is willing to underwrite, the authors state:

"An efficient path for returning the sound operations of the G-SIFI to the private sector would be provided by exchanging or converting a sufficient amount of the unsecured debt from the original creditors of the failed company [meaning the depositors] into equity [or stock]. In the U.S ., the new equity would become capital in one or more newly formed operating entities. In the U.K., the same approach could be used, or the equity could be used to recapitalize the failing financial company itself -- thus, the highest layer of surviving bailed-in creditors would become the owners of the resolved firm. In either country , the new equity holders would take on the corresponding risk of being shareholders in a financial institution."

https://www.fdic.gov/about/srac/2012/gsifi.pdf

The iron fist is coming out from the velvet glove folks

Of course our bought and paid for mainstream press have trumpeted this from the rooftops and made the great unwashed aware of all these goings on in the shadows havent they, hang on, No they havent but we do get daily doses of what the Kardashians are doing and a motley crue of Essex dross celebs wannabes

 

[sovereignsteve]

On 13/07/2016 at 21:10, HelpingHands said:

I think the main downside is that people might have pawned their smart phones

 

When I was growing up and also in my early adult years, those families not working and on benefits always had the latest and biggest colour TVs and other gadgets that we couldn't afford. No idea if that's the case now although I can't see them going without their smartphones, they would probably cut back on the fag or booze money first.

[Paul]

8 minutes ago, sovereignsteve said:

When I was growing up and also in my early adult years, those families not working and on benefits always had the latest and biggest colour TVs and other gadgets that we couldn't afford. No idea if that's the case now although I can't see them going without their smartphones, they would probably cut back on the fag or booze money first.

Just look at any high street on a not too affluent town and while you see a shortage of any half decent quality shops you will guarantee to find the likes of Brighthouse/PerfectHomes/CashConvertors/pawnbrokers sort of store in abundance and doing well selling all the must have bells and whistle latest tech.

• Pay weekly
• High APR %
• Higher original RRP to begin with
• Get it today

Just as high mortgage payments, credit cards and fancy cars keep the middle class on the debt treadmill of life, these pay weekly sort of stores keeps the underclass unemployed stocked with their impulse needs

The invisible ties of usary interest keeps the wheels turning and finance/credit/banks industry yearly bonuses paid 

[HawkHybrid]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-36889828

 

' NatWest and Royal Bank of Scotland (RBS) have warned businesses they may have to charge them to accept deposits due to low interest rates. '

 

you have to pay me for the privilege of allowing me to

make a profit from lending out your money.

 

HH

[Pipers]

On 26/07/2016 at 10:44, Paul said:

Just look at any high street on a not too affluent town and while you see a shortage of any half decent quality shops you will guarantee to find the likes of Brighthouse/PerfectHomes/CashConvertors/pawnbrokers sort of store in abundance and doing well selling all the must have bells and whistle latest tech.

• Pay weekly
• High APR %
• Higher original RRP to begin with
• Get it today

Just as high mortgage payments, credit cards and fancy cars keep the middle class on the debt treadmill of life, these pay weekly sort of stores keeps the underclass unemployed stocked with their impulse needs

The invisible ties of usary interest keeps the wheels turning and finance/credit/banks industry yearly bonuses paid 

I was in an unnamed town a few weeks ago, nearly every shop was a payday loan/pawnbroker, bookies, £ shop, phone shop, charity shop, weekly payment shop.  The second hand shops have been pushed out by the charity shops.  There was not one traditional shop just a ASDA and a ALDI. 

 

[Pipers]

Remember for a cash account the government have forced the banks to offer basic bank accounts that are limited but free these were and are intended for bankrupts and people on benefits though in the future I can see more and more having them if the banks start to charge for having accounts.  

[Paul]

17 minutes ago, Pipers said:

I was in an unnamed town a few weeks ago, nearly every shop was a payday loan/pawnbroker, bookies, £ shop, phone shop, charity shop, weekly payment shop.  The second hand shops have been pushed out by the charity shops.  There was not one traditional shop just a ASDA and a ALDI. 

2nd hand shops still had to pay business rates, charities dont pay any business rates in most cases.  They get 80% mandatory relief, which local (billing) authorities can choose to top up by an additional 20% at their discretion.

Business rates are the killer for any shop, they go up regardless of your accounts or business performance. local authority couldn't care less

Couple this with commercial landlords with ridiculous rents, no opportunity to buy freehold commercial property easily

The death of the high street is happening precisely because of this across the country

No business can hope to try and find a footing as the odds are so highly stacked against you from the start

[richo]

25 minutes ago, Pipers said:

I was in an unnamed town a few weeks ago, nearly every shop was a payday loan/pawnbroker, bookies, £ shop, phone shop, charity shop, weekly payment shop.  The second hand shops have been pushed out by the charity shops.  There was not one traditional shop just a ASDA and a ALDI. 

 

Very true. So many areas now are categorised by such a high street. Pawnbrokers, pound shops, gambling shops. And isn't it telling that it's generally the poor areas. 

[richo]

7 minutes ago, Paul said:

2nd hand shops still had to pay business rates, charities dont pay any business rates in most cases.  They get 80% mandatory relief, which local (billing) authorities can choose to top up by an additional 20% at their discretion.

Business rates are the killer for any shop, they go up regardless of your accounts or business performance. local authority couldn't care less

Couple this with commercial landlords with ridiculous rents, no opportunity to buy freehold commercial property easily

The death of the high street is happening precisely because of this across the country

No business can hope to try and find a footing as the odds are so highly stacked against you from the start

It's to do with the area and demographic though. Where I am, rates are probably high, but so are prices, so there are French bakers, butchers, sweet shop, chocolatier etc. I actually don't agree with the charity shop relief, it's turned every high street in to a charity shop every few shops which is actually bad for the communities. 

Generally these charities pay no rates, no tax and want workers to work for free, they call it 'volunteering'. The only winners are the chief executives and higher mgnt who often still draw big salaries.

[Daz147]

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-08-31/deutsche-bank-refuses-delivery-physical-gold-upon-demand

Looks like problems with allocated gold accounts over in Germany, it may be blown out of all proportion, but it is something to think about.

[Oldun]

For your perusal.

 

[Bumble]

I'm not convinced by this dead man's curve chart. It has no x-axis, so I don't see what is the significance of the points lying on the curve: the countries could simply have been listed in a table. Also, it makes a big difference whether a country's debt is denominated in their own currency or another. A lot of Brazil's debt is in USD, and Greece's is in EUR. But the USA, UK and Japan have the benefit of issuing debt in their own currency.

[Oldun]

That is a good point but Ithink the fundamentals are still valid. Clearly, Brazil, Turkey etc are in bigger trouble than those at the bottom of the ten year.

[HelpingHands]

 

India Abolishes 500 and 1,000 Rupee Notes to Fight Corruption

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-11-08/india-abolishes-inr500-1-000-rupee-notes-to-fight-corruption

 

[garthy]

Our good friend Mark Carney's talking about ditching the £50 note, it's all about financial crime, obviously criminals haven't worked out how to use £20's yet.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/06/02/plastic-5-notes-featuring-sir-winston-churchill-that-are-unteara/

[sovereignsteve]

you can't get 50s anyway, the banks always seem to hand out £1k bundles of 20s

[garthy]

2 minutes ago, sovereignsteve said:

you can't get 50s anyway, the banks always seem to hand out £1k bundles of 20s

True, i haven't seen a £50 in a long time 

[HelpingHands]

50s are in bags of £2500

[Oldun]

When I changed into gbp abroad for a trip to The UK, I was given a stack of 50s by request. I paid the hotel bill in them and the receptionist said it was the first time she had ever seen anyone pay that amount in cash, let alone 50s.....my my, times have changed.

[Roy]

Posh git!

The Travelodge love me and my scruffy tenners. I always get enough change for a packet of smoky bacon and a disposable tooth brush too 

[Oldun]

I am not walking around with a couple of grand in tenners in my sky rocket !

Plus, I had to take my family to the only hotel near my very poorly mum who had just got out of intensive care at hospital ! And my cc was maxed out that month, so I had little choice. I was just happy my mum survived and got to see her granddaughter again