Fake slabbed gold

[Tangomachine]

Hi all, 

Getting more and more into gold and been looking on ebay at 2017 proof soverigns, half sov and quarter sov because I really like the design of that one. Also quite fancy a matching set of PF70 because why not

My question is are the NGC slabs known to be commonly faked or anything? I've heard plenty of horror stories and dont want to get caught out. 

 

Thanks

 

[Melon]

If they can fake the coin, you better believe they can fake the plastic box! 

[Ranks1970]

Hi mate I am new to coin collecting and what I can see so far is that you need to do your home work before buying from people as there are fakes all over “Trust No One” LOL 

[Guest]

I'm not a fan of slabbed coins at all for this very reason. Spoke to a coin dealer in the UK recently, about to build up a long-term relationship with him I hope, he said the following when I asked about slabbing, " if I wanted to fake sovereigns I would slab them, you can't feel them, can't see the edges, edge knocks etc, hard to verify it is the real thing". Seems to be all the rage and a fad at the moment but an excellent looking coin or rare coin will always sell. Consigning coins to a reputable coin dealer to sell on your behalf will also save you money on auction costs and disappointing bids. There will however be a multitude of mugs who will overpay hugely for slabbed coins so the counterfeiters know there is plenty of money to be made, personally I would not go near a slabbed coin...

[Tangomachine]

4 hours ago, bullionbob said:

I'm not a fan of slabbed coins at all for this very reason. Spoke to a coin dealer in the UK recently, about to build up a long-term relationship with him I hope, he said the following when I asked about slabbing, " if I wanted to fake sovereigns I would slab them, you can't feel them, can't see the edges, edge knocks etc, hard to verify it is the real thing". Seems to be all the rage and a fad at the moment but an excellent looking coin or rare coin will always sell. Consigning coins to a reputable coin dealer to sell on your behalf will also save you money on auction costs and disappointing bids. There will however be a multitude of mugs who will overpay hugely for slabbed coins so the counterfeiters know there is plenty of money to be made, personally I would not go near a slabbed coin...

Very good points mate. Sad thing is they're even harder to find ungraded

[Xander]

If you send the coin to NGC yourself, they won't slab it if it's fake. I have had them return fake coins to me refusing to slab them. Otherwise I would never have known, as I took it for granted they were genuine.

[ChrisF]

If it was an expensive nice or special coin, for what it costs I would get it re-slabbed for sure I couldn't sleep at night without knowing for sure.

[kimchi]

Resubmitting is possibly the only thing you can do directly personally do alas

Doesn't an XRF work though if you can get it tested somewhere that has one?

Doesn't the old Sigma PM Verifier (still available I believe) work through slabs (and the new one does not)? Maybe one of (off the top of my head) @jonrms @arshimo2012 or the kind person who I seem to remember helped @Tn21 could kindly advise there?

2 hours ago, Tangomachine said:

Very good points mate. Sad thing is they're even harder to find ungraded

If you're patient a 2017 set or individual coins will show up eventually, do you already have a 'wanted' thread in the sales section here?

Another unfortunate aspect of the growth of grading is that raw coins may be ones that have already been submitted and failed to hit 70 or at least 69 (unless there is a very obvious slight flaw you always have the chance of resubmitting and trying again). The modern 'special year' proof Sovs are an obvious example here - a 1989 at a 68 grade is presently probably worth less than the coin de-slabbed and repackaged and sold to someone who (unknowingly) hopes the potential is there for a high grade (with the huge price uplift that would attract). Perhaps @richatthecroft among many others can offer thoughts there.

So, alas, over the last few years I am increasingly wary of modern coins without knowing the full history of them, with provenance required where it's from a dealer or individual I don't know well.

There are very many good members here though who know their stuff and would not get tricked (certainly on modern coins) and there have been many such threads where members have received superb advice and informed opinion after providing good pics.

 

 

 

 

[Seasider]

Atkinsons have a 2017 proof sovereign (cheaper than the Chards one).  But it has a mark on the Queen's head.  You could buy that and get it conserved by NCS and who knows you may get lucky and score a 70.  You would then get a lot of pleasure telling everyone how you spotted a diamond in the rough.

PS if you are worried about fakes you should stick to buying from somewhere like Chards

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Seasider said:

Atkinsons have a 2017 proof sovereign (cheaper than the Chards one).  But it has a mark on the Queen's head.  You could buy that and get it conserved by NCS and who knows you may get lucky and score a 70.  You would then get a lot of pleasure telling everyone how you spotted a diamond in the rough.

PS if you are worried about fakes you should stick to buying from somewhere like Chards

True, it is the balance between getting a bargain and paying very high prices, the eternal problem for coin collectors, bullion weight hoarding is much easier 

[Tn21]

Hi Kimchi,

Thanks for tagging me in. The bar in question for me was a pamp bar 2.5g Au and in the end with the kind help of Vicammy he managed to test it through the plastic packaging to find out it is real. 

 

On a seperate note I bought a 1/10 gold coin of eBay however the guy with 100% feedback will not issue me a refund. Coin was listed here on the forum but with thanks to Arshimo2012 and  lmehufc I have since withdrawn the post as the gold content is not 1/10 Oz's worth. 

It is a sting to purchase a coin or PM's that are not up the required standards but it is what it is and I only have my self to blame.

I nearly got stung the first time with the pamp bar on eBay but now I have been stung with the 1/10 coin from eBay. I'm not an expert so for 2020 I will be avoiding eBay when it comes to PM's.

 

 

[Melon]

30 minutes ago, Tn21 said:

Hi Kimchi,

Thanks for tagging me in. The bar in question for me was a pamp bar 2.5g Au and in the end with the kind help of Vicammy he managed to test it through the plastic packaging to find out it is real. 

 

On a seperate note I bought a 1/10 gold coin of eBay however the guy with 100% feedback will not issue me a refund. Coin was listed here on the forum but with thanks to Arshimo2012 and  lmehufc I have since withdrawn the post as the gold content is not 1/10 Oz's worth. 

It is a sting to purchase a coin or PM's that are not up the required standards but it is what it is and I only have my self to blame.

I nearly got stung the first time with the pamp bar on eBay but now I have been stung with the 1/10 coin from eBay. I'm not an expert so for 2020 I will be avoiding eBay when it comes to PM's.

What was wrong with the 1/10 oz? Wrong size / weight? I'm surprised you can't get your money back through PayPal if that's the case. 

[JunkBond]

2 minutes ago, Melon said:

What was wrong with the 1/10 oz? Wrong size / weight? I'm surprised you can't get your money back through PayPal if that's the case. 

http://about.ag/FakeCookIslands24Gold.htm

[Melon]

5 minutes ago, JunkBond said:

http://about.ag/FakeCookIslands24Gold.htm

Ouch, that's one sneaky move by the mint. Unlucky 😥

[Tn21]

School boy error, not sure if I will get the refund but the seller won't be refunding my money he has stated. 

 

[goldmember44]

45 minutes ago, JunkBond said:

http://about.ag/FakeCookIslands24Gold.htm

Wow, that's Cook Islands' reputation down the drains IMO...

[goldmember44]

29 minutes ago, Tn21 said:

School boy error, not sure if I will get the refund but the seller won't be refunding my money he has stated. 

 

You should ensure his feedback is no longer 100%...

[goldmember44]

12 hours ago, bullionbob said:

 personally I would not go near a slabbed coin...

Most slabbed coins are not fakes, if they're from reputable companies like NGC and PCGS, you can also check the website for verification. And, get it from someone you know, someone reputable, perhaps who has graded the coin personally. I have all my proof sovereigns graded. I wouldn't buy an expensive proof sovereign that is raw, unless the price is very good -- because I want to ensure I have a 70 grade.

[JunkBond]

I have not seen the ebay listing but if it was cleverly worded @Tn21 may well be stuffed. 🤨

[Tn21]

It was indeed cleverly worded and it is looking increasingly likely that I have been stuffed. 

Ebayer is probably on a cruise ship as we speak. I will be locking myself in a cupboard for a minimum of two weeks before resurfacing holding my head in shame. 

eBay purchases for gold and silver for me are going to be off for a while. Lesson learnt. I will just stick to buying of the main dealers and forum members when the time comes.

 

I don't want to take over the original post of slabbed coins. Over and out 

[kimchi]

1 minute ago, Tn21 said:

I don't want to take over the original post of slabbed coins. Over and out 

So sorry to hear all of that mate

Perhaps you could start a new thread here so that everyone who can can assist you (if poss)?

[Tn21]

Yh sure thanks @kimchi

Yh I think a post about it can potentially stop others from making the same mistake. 

Just about to do some overtime at work so I shall I put up a post later on tonight. 

 

[kimchi]

1 minute ago, Tn21 said:

Yh sure thanks @kimchi

Yh I think a post about it can potentially stop others from making the same mistake. 

Just about to do some overtime at work so I shall I put up a post later on tonight. 

 

You're a good and trusted member so gutted for you pal

Please do throw a thread up if there's anything at all any of us can do to help,  that is what we are here for bud

[Tangomachine]

Thanks for all the replies guys. I didnt realise you could check each coin with NGC etc.only started looking into proof stuff last few days so far I've just got bullion. Just eventually wanting a few nice pieces in proof such as 1989 Tudor 2005 and 2017

Will put wanted ads up as and when I'm ready

 

Cheers

[jonrms]

If it's the same beater, I emailed them and reported the listing as fake