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Confessions from an American newbie (eagles)


DarkStacker

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Fellow stackers. 

I am new to the game. But I must confess, I do not like the Eagles at all. I received my first one in the mail today, all sealed and graded. Didn’t like it.

Again, I know I am new. I want to stack for weight mostly as a foundation. A way to preserve what little money I have. With that in mind here is my logic. 

I can’t do anything about the price or silver on any given day. So an ounce is what it’s worth. I have to try to buy and sell at the right time and pay under (if at all possible), at, or as little over spot as I can. 

Well, eagles have the same amount of silver as every other 1 oz coin or round (and a fraction less than the .9999’s), the design is bland. It never changes, and they print over a million every year. I do not understand how this coin could be worth more than spot when you look to sell. Meanwhile you have more artistic, severely limited mintages, with the same amount of silver going for the same price. 

If one is investing in silver as a hedge to fiat currency, couldn’t one hedge their hedge with many other coins for the same price at release with the added chance of them being worth more in future?

Please show me the error of my thinking. Everyone stateside is pushing them and I just don’t like them.

 

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I don't like eagles also. I very much prefer Canadian and Australian coins. I have a advantage over younger  collectors as I use to go to shows all over the U.S. and I got to know dealers from other areas. They call me when they get good deals          for me. I suggest you attend major coin shows and get to know dealers from different areas of the country. Let them know what you want and are willing to pay. A friend of mine uses facebook to find dealers also. Just bought 500 silver dimes at 10 times face. Just keep stacking!

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I like ASE have a tube of them and 30 coloured silver eagles but don't stack them. As you are in the US have you come across the following

Silver Shield collection https://www.goldenstatemint.com/Silver-shield-collection/

Intaglio Mint https://intagliomint.com/

Provident Metals https://www.providentmetals.com/

In the US so much more choice what to stack/collect often a lot closer to spot than outside of the US.

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I remember a quote that broke down stacking into 4 basic laws:

1. You like it.

2. You don't like it.

3. It makes money.

4. It loses money.

If you like what you stack it makes it more enjoyable but the downside can be you become attached to it which can make selling it emotionally problematic.

My mate Scotty is in this dilemma right now...he needs to sell some gold but can't bring himself to part with it.

I think it is better to try put your likes / dislikes aside when designing a stacking strategy purely for investment purposes rather than collecting.

I would recommend getting used to the idea of holding PM's for at least 5 years to expect an upside as inflation eats away at the value of "money".

Silver is notoriously slow to move in any direction so maybe Gold would be a better choice?

I know the US is a different scene than the UK as you can still find circulating coins containing silver.

 

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I love Americana 🇺🇸 as you can see from the novelty silver Star Trek coin on my profile. I prefer the ASEs showing Lady Liberty draped in an American flag to the rather theatrical British silver Britannia. The only thing which puzzles me is why for the gold Eagle 🦅 the US Mint has chosen completely different designs for the obverse and reverse.

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4 hours ago, Serendipity said:

I love Americana 🇺🇸 as you can see from the novelty silver Star Trek coin on my profile. I prefer the ASEs showing Lady Liberty draped in an American flag to the rather theatrical British silver Britannia. The only thing which puzzles me is why for the gold Eagle 🦅 the US Mint has chosen completely different designs for the obverse and reverse.

I think they chose to give the gold Eagles a different design so that there would be at least SOME variety, lol.  I think the only thing I don't like about the newer gold Eagles is that they're not denominationally tied to the legally defined Eagles.  By definition, an Eagle (90% pure) is a $10 approximately half ounce of gold coin.  The new half-ounce Eagle (91.6% pure) is denominated $25.  Not a big deal, just would've been nice to keep consistency.  

As for the silver Eagles, they're very beautiful coins.  The matte, frosty finish they tend to have is the best kind of finish for a coin, in my opinion.  And they're recognized everywhere, so that's one of the reasons why they're preferred. 

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5 hours ago, Norskgeld said:

I remember a quote that broke down stacking into 4 basic laws:

1. You like it.

2. You don't like it.

3. It makes money.

4. It loses money.

If you like what you stack it makes it more enjoyable but the downside can be you become attached to it which can make selling it emotionally problematic.

My mate Scotty is in this dilemma right now...he needs to sell some gold but can't bring himself to part with it.

I think it is better to try put your likes / dislikes aside when designing a stacking strategy purely for investment purposes rather than collecting.

I would recommend getting used to the idea of holding PM's for at least 5 years to expect an upside as inflation eats away at the value of "money".

Silver is notoriously slow to move in any direction so maybe Gold would be a better choice?

I know the US is a different scene than the UK as you can still find circulating coins containing silver.

 

Ha ha, that quote is exactly right.  

I think it can be tough to let go of any part of the stack.  The gold coins can be even more difficult to let go of, since for the majority of us, a gold coin is a bigger investment, and takes a lot more to acquire.  And when we do buy one, we've likely put a bit more thought into our choice.  So yeah, letting go can be tough.

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17 hours ago, DarkStacker said:

Fellow stackers. 

I am new to the game. But I must confess, I do not like the Eagles at all. I received my first one in the mail today, all sealed and graded. Didn’t like it.

Again, I know I am new. I want to stack for weight mostly as a foundation. A way to preserve what little money I have. With that in mind here is my logic. 

I can’t do anything about the price or silver on any given day. So an ounce is what it’s worth. I have to try to buy and sell at the right time and pay under (if at all possible), at, or as little over spot as I can. 

Well, eagles have the same amount of silver as every other 1 oz coin or round (and a fraction less than the .9999’s), the design is bland. It never changes, and they print over a million every year. I do not understand how this coin could be worth more than spot when you look to sell. Meanwhile you have more artistic, severely limited mintages, with the same amount of silver going for the same price. 

If one is investing in silver as a hedge to fiat currency, couldn’t one hedge their hedge with many other coins for the same price at release with the added chance of them being worth more in future?

Please show me the error of my thinking. Everyone stateside is pushing them and I just don’t like them.

 

I'm American and they do absolutely nothing for me either.  I like Perth Mint first and foremost, the Royal Mint a close second and the Royal Canadian Mint a respectable third. Korean silver is fun for its cool designs and limited mintages.

 

 US Mint and Eagles don't even factor into the equation. I've never understood the appeal.

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8 hours ago, Serendipity said:

I love Americana 🇺🇸 as you can see from the novelty silver Star Trek coin on my profile. I prefer the ASEs showing Lady Liberty draped in an American flag to the rather theatrical British silver Britannia. The only thing which puzzles me is why for the gold Eagle 🦅 the US Mint has chosen completely different designs for the obverse and reverse.

It is so funny to hear you say Britannias are dramatic when I like them and the Libertards for the same reason!

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If you're trying to maximize value why are you buying graded, slabbed coins? It must have cost many dollars over spot.

TheUS Mint charges its distributors a fixed $2.00 per ASE over spot. This sets the floor for their price.

Whatever you do, whatever you buy, it's critical that you don't overpay. If you overpay, you kill your margins and you might as well light your money on fire. The key to not overpaying is to buy from the lowest price dealers, like Silver.com, SD Bullion, and occasionally Gainesville Coins or BGASC. Provident will very rarely have the lowest prices, and APMEX never does unless there's a big sale or something.

Lots of people overpay. If you can avoid overpaying you've got a shot at preserving value and even making a profit.

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29 minutes ago, Bimetallic said:

If you're trying to maximize value why are you buying graded, slabbed coins? It must have cost many dollars over spot.

TheUS Mint charges its distributors a fixed $2.00 per ASE over spot. This sets the floor for their price.

Whatever you do, whatever you buy, it's critical that you don't overpay. If you overpay, you kill your margins and you might as well light your money on fire. The key to not overpaying is to buy from the lowest price dealers, like Silver.com, SD Bullion, and occasionally Gainesville Coins or BGASC. Provident will very rarely have the lowest prices, and APMEX never does unless there's a big sale or something.

Lots of people overpay. If you can avoid overpaying you've got a shot at preserving value and even making a profit.

Thank you very much for the new silver sites to look at. The slab was a one time thing, first strike and good price. I had not heard of Silver.com, it looks great but getting up 3000 on an order is a LOT harder than getting 99 dollars, and that all goes to eating at margins as well. It's great to have 7 plus places to look to when it's time to buy. It's like a scavenger hunt every time.

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From what I have gathered, (and it has already been mentioned here) Silver Eagles are perhaps the most recognizable minted bullion coins that exist on the planet.  While they do hold some semi-numismatic value, the fact that they all have had the exact same design for over 30 years works in the owner's favor. 

If you're in it to collect coins, than you're much better off sticking with the plethora of other options available.  If you're a stacker, and one of the reasons why you accumulate metals is in the event of a possible SHTF scenario, you simply can't go wrong with ASEs.  

I personally only stack Eagles, constitutional, and the occasional generic bar.  I have no care for fancy designs nor numismatics, since I want to be able to move my silver fast and/or reliably.

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On 23/06/2019 at 03:48, DarkStacker said:

Meanwhile you have more artistic, severely limited mintages, with the same amount of silver going for the same price. 

Limited mintage coins come and go and you may find that in a short amount of time that they are not popular or desired any more. Meaning that it is hard to sell. With an American silver eagle you will find a buyer anywhere and at anytime they are trusted and liquid. 

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There's nothing wrong with ASEs, but if you are new to stacking, the for God's sake, do what it says on the tin and Stack For Weight and don't go collecting slabbed coins.

Slabs are the high margin products where mints and dealers make the vast bulk of their profits.. from mugs people who buy them.

The majority of your stack should be low premium and highly liquid. When you have accumulated 500-1000 oz then it is more appropriate to think about higher premium coins, but you build anything from the base up.

 

 

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16 hours ago, DarkStacker said:

Thank you very much for the new silver sites to look at. The slab was a one time thing, first strike and good price. I had not heard of Silver.com, it looks great but getting up 3000 on an order is a LOT harder than getting 99 dollars, and that all goes to eating at margins as well. It's great to have 7 plus places to look to when it's time to buy. It's like a scavenger hunt every time.

You're talking about the free shipping thresholds? Silver.com will still be cheaper much of the time – you just have to do the quick math. I think they only charge five bucks or less for shipping.

It's also worth checking BOLD Precious Metals and JM Bullion. I forgot to mention those. JMB owns Silver.com and has free shipping on orders over $99.

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7 hours ago, Bimetallic said:

You're talking about the free shipping thresholds? Silver.com will still be cheaper much of the time – you just have to do the quick math. I think they only charge five bucks or less for shipping.

It's also worth checking BOLD Precious Metals and JM Bullion. I forgot to mention those. JMB owns Silver.com and has free shipping on orders over $99.

For US 90% "junk" silver, Provident Metals has more recently proven to be the best when you buy $99 or more.  They often have sales for like 29 cents above spot.  And if you buy $10 face value, you're not far over the $99 mark, which is a sweet purchasing spot for me.

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17 hours ago, vand said:

There's nothing wrong with ASEs, but if you are new to stacking, the for God's sake, do what it says on the tin and Stack For Weight and don't go collecting slabbed coins.

Slabs are the high margin products where mints and dealers make the vast bulk of their profits.. from mugs people who buy them.

The majority of your stack should be low premium and highly liquid. When you have accumulated 500-1000 oz then it is more appropriate to think about higher premium coins, but you build anything from the base up.

 

 

Thank you very much. I have been trying to just do weight as i start. I lean to generic bars for lower mintages but EVERYONE does go on about ASE's. I think when it comes to single ounce coins i will go with Mexico and Canada. 

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1 hour ago, DarkStacker said:

Thank you very much. I have been trying to just do weight as i start. I lean to generic bars for lower mintages but EVERYONE does go on about ASE's. I think when it comes to single ounce coins i will go with Mexico and Canada. 

The reason why a lot of hardcore US Stackers buy ASEs is the secondary market premiums hold unlike most others. Libs hold too in the US, but not at LCS LEVEL. Local coin shops will often pay you $2 over spot for ASEs. So it’s a resale strategy more than anything else. I suggest you also look into Reddit silverbugs pmsforsale sextions. As a US buyer you will get deals there that are hard to match retailwise.

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Hi @DarkStacker!
Buying generics is also a good strategy - silver is silver anyway. As you're a newbie you probably haven't taken silver at spot deals (thought I may be mistaken) but that's a good way for newcomers to obtain 40+ oz of silver at spot price.

If you don't like eagles, well there are many other bullion coins that change their designs yearly (e.g. Perth Mint Kookaburras, Koalas, Chinese Pandas, Queens Beasts from The Royal Mint etc) or maples ( 2018 and 2019 claim to be covered with mintshield anti milk spots surface )

Anyway you decide, I can just recommend to search thoroughly for low prices, here https://findcoinonline.com  you'll find price comparisons, just type your request.

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40 minutes ago, DarkStacker said:

It also seems like it a good use for ASE would be to buy a tube and sell them on eBay 1 at a time (try to minimize loss) just to build up my reputation in the community. 

Good idea!

Also, like that other person said, Eagles tend to hold their value, their premium, so even though they cost more than Maples and Britannias they sell for more too. (And lots of people think they're gorgeous.)

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On 24/06/2019 at 07:26, Wackattak924 said:

Limited mintage coins come and go and you may find that in a short amount of time that they are not popular or desired any more. Meaning that it is hard to sell. With an American silver eagle you will find a buyer anywhere and at anytime they are trusted and liquid. 

You are absolutely right which is why I try as best as possible to stick to bullion coins. You just have to check out eBay to see collectors trying desperately to offload their monster box of silver Star Wars coins once the enthusiasm wanes. It’s always best to stick to bullion coins if you’re an investor however enticing limited mintage coins might seem. You’re also paying a significantly higher premium for limited mintage coins which you don’t always get back when it comes to selling. I know I’m stating the patently obvious here but it’s shocking how many investors make the same mistake by buying what proof or limited mintage coin takes their fancy.

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ASEs are stellar, and are always great to have a bunch of in the stack.

I like how Britannias have a variety of designs over the years, so those are interesting to collect, if you have an itch to collect. 

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