Gold for Stacking

[JamesH]

3 hours ago, Tav said:

I find this thread helpful as I have not long started stacking. I am glad I joined TSF as there seem s to be plenty of sound advice from members. I have gone of silver and more onto gold as the premiums look better sovereigns and 1/4,s for me am I doing the right thing or should you just go on your own tastes. 

You’re definitely not doing the wrong thing. It’s whatever works best for the individual. As many here have said, seems you can’t go far wrong with sovereigns (I stack Sovs, half Sovs and 1/4 Tudor Beasts) as they’re real easy to move on when needed. Hopefully they become long holds but if not, should be easy to shift as required

[Silverlocks]

My stack is predominantly fractional gold, and that's the primary strategy.  The trick to stacking fractional gold is knowing how to get it at low premiums, and in most cases the best bang for buck in this is old circulated gold coins.  Because of the nature of UK tax legislation, sovereigns sit in a nice sweet spot of being small enough to be liquid, low premium due to the large numbers manufactured and still out in the wild, and being exempt from capital gains tax as they are still technically legal tender.  For stacking in the UK, sovereigns are a no brainer, although I think you do have to do your homework on the numismatics to some extent, as it's quite easy to overpay.

• Sovereigns are doing the heavy lifting in the UK stack.  I also put some effort into learning to grade sovs and understand a bit about the numismatics.  IMO, this is well worth doing if you plan on buying sovs in quantity.
• I've bought some other small gold, for various reasons - some European and world gold and other odds and sods (mostly at low premiums), and some 1/10oz coins, mainly to take photos of them.  I think I'll get the money back out of the 1/10ths, but the primary reason has been the photos.  These have been a bit of a sideline, and I will probably buy a few here and there.
• I've also got a bit of silver (about 100 oz in total), mostly collectibles such as Germania or Perth Mint.  I think these will sell for more or less what I paid for them, but they're mainly for the photos and having something nice and shiny.
• I may get some silver bars in the 10oz to 1kg range at some point.  These are really only worth buying on the secondary market if you can get them at the right price.  At this size they're small enough to be liquid, so one could largely sell them at what you paid for them if you needed to liquidate.  However, I think it's easy to overpay for silver, and VAT in the mix makes silver quite inefficient for stacking in the UK.  In other countries such as the US, premiums are lower, which makes silver a better deal.
• I may get 1oz gold coins if I have money at the time and they come up at the right price.  Some I might get just to have the nice shiny - I'd quite like to get some 1oz dollaridoos at some point, and there are a few others like Royal Arms or Maples that are also quite nice and photogenic.  Buffalos get a lot of love as well.  However, I think 1oz coins are expensive enough that most folks can't afford them so they're not so liquid unless you're selling at low premiums.  Therefore, I think one would have take care not to overpay.

In Indonesia, stacking is mostly about small fractional bars in the 1-10g range, and (as most folks don't have a lot of money there) I think the sweet spot is about 3g-10g.  Mostly we're buying 5g bars there.  Certain bars are regulated there, so you can get a 5g bar at roughly the same premium as a bullion sov here, so the spreads are relatively tame.

 

 

 

Edited October 1, 2023 by Silverlocks

[Britannia47]

21 hours ago, Dalriada83 said:

Sovereigns every time - not only for the history and liquidity but also the sheer grace and beauty of this most Imperial of Coins which flowed through the economic veins of the Empire upon which the sun never set! Some of the older examples in your collective possession may have been present at Hanwella, Waterloo, Trafalger, Rourke's Drift, Khartoum and countless other mysterious and exotic (admittedly mainly purloined) corners of the world. Am I rambling again?

Just a bit, but very poetic!  Possibly Lieutenants Chard & Bromhead at Rourkes Drift in 1879 had a few Sovereigns in their purses, as some officers did in the Ist W.W.

”Sentry on the hill reports Zulus to the South-West, thousands of ‘em!……..

Actually been there  and Isandlwana…🇿🇦

 

[ZRPMs]

2 minutes ago, Britannia47 said:

Amazing film. Brings back so many memories from when I was a kid. The film not 1879, just in case anyone thought I meant the year.

[Gruff]

15 minutes ago, Britannia47 said:

Just a bit, but very poetic!  Possibly Lieutenants Chard & Bromhead at Rourkes Drift in 1879 had a few Sovereigns in their purses, as some officers did in the Ist W.W.

”Sentry on the hill reports Zulus to the South-West, thousands of ‘em!……..

Actually been there  and Isandlwana…🇿🇦

 

 

11 minutes ago, ZRPMs said:

Amazing film. Brings back so many memories from when I was a kid. The film not 1879, just in case anyone thought I meant the year.

Routes Drift and Isandlwana were about an hour and half's drive from where I grew up. History was on site..

[Foster88]

If you’re in UK, sovereigns and half sovereigns make the most sense as of today.

[Roy]

I will add an article that I published on the forum in 2020 to inspire newbie stackers and those with a smaller budget. Perhaps a 'gateway' for the silver stacker 😎

 

Gold on a budget.

Want to get into gold but are scared to take the plunge because of its high price?
What about £50 gold? 

In this article I’m going to suggest that gold is for everyone and show an inexpensive way to stack gold and build a collection at the same time.
Fractional gold (a fraction of a troy ounce) is often frowned upon by stackers because it carries a cost premium.  For example: four quarters of an ounce coins or ten tenths of an ounce coins cost more to manufacture/seal/wrap and deliver than one full ounce coin.  

Generally, an ounce coin will cost less than four or ten of its parts. 
For this reason, hardcore stackers will champion the purchase of ounce coins because they want the most weight for their money. This all makes sense, of course, but in the real world most folk do not have the luxury of putting their hands on £1300+, at least not too often and the novelty soon wears off.

If you decide that you want to save in gold, it’s more likely that you’ll be looking at fractional weight coins like the 1/4oz or 1/10oz or the more traditional weights of the sovereign and half sovereign. These can be bought for the fractional cost of a troy ounce of fine gold plus a premium:
i.e., if an ounce of gold is £1300, a 1/4 oz coin should be approx. £325 plus 2-5%
     if an ounce of gold is £1300, a 1/10 oz coin should be approx £130 plus 5-10%

Don’t be put off by the premium however, you’ll usually get that back if you sell the coin privately. Coin dealers have to make a living and will usually offer you less.

Perhaps the thought of spending this amount is still way out of the budget?
Don’t be put off, there’s more to explore yet.

Welcome to the world of 1/25oz coins!

In the nineties and noughties, a plethora of independent ‘mints’ and coin ‘specialists’ offered to the general public, coin collections of various sizes to appeal to the armchair collector. Beware of hyperbole.

An example: 'The coins selected for The Smallest Gold Coins of the World Collection represent a unique realm of numismatics. Officially authorised by governments across the globe and coveted by all knowledgeable collectors, the high quality design and high precious metal content place them among the world's most desirable issues.'

I’m sure you’re aware of the intensive marketing these firms are guilty of, they offer monthly payments and their target customer is the elderly. They suggest you start building a ‘superlative collection’ to leave for your grandkids and use classical topics such as military heroes, great architecture, explorers and emotive modern subjects like Diana, Lennon, Martin Luther King and the Queen Mum.
They are often proof coins, of limited mintages, and are 999 (fine) gold.

Let’s fast forward a few years and most, if not all, of these sets have ended up in auctions and pawn brokers. Ebay is full of them.

If you’re patient and shrewd, it’s possible to pick these coins up for a small percentage over spot.  They often come up cheaply on this forum and are generally unloved.  They are ideal to pick up on a regular basis without breaking the bank and their weight will soon add up. You will see your ‘stack’ grow and it might be fun to try to complete the collection too, if that’s your thing.

Be prepared to be underwhelmed however, at 1/25oz they weigh only 1.244 grams and are as tiny as 13.92mm!
At today’s relatively high spot price, 10/4/20, they would be worth £54.  

Yes, you might have to add a small premium to this and don’t forget postage costs but it’s something to consider for those on a small budget and always remember:

25 x 1/25 coins equals an ounce of gold!

 

Disclosure: The author does not advise this route but simply offers an option for those on a small budget. This writer recommends gold sovereigns.

Further recommended reading:

https://taxfreegold.co.uk/worldsfinestgoldminiaturescollectioncoins.html
https://taxfreegold.co.uk/smallestgoldcoinsofthewroldcollection.php
https://taxfreegold.co.uk/worldssmallestgoldcoins.html

 

[SidS]

When I did have gold it was:

1) Guineas - somewhat above spot, especially anything pre-George III.

My thinking was, why pay £250 for a run of the mill shield sovereign when I could get an ex-mount guinea for £275? I sold every guinea I bought at a profit.

2) US pre-1933 gold - harder to get at a good price, but I love them.

Never had any problems selling them either, even in the UK. The $20 pieces are just epic, gorgeous chunks of gold.

3) Shield sovereigns - a bit mundane but I happily kept a few on hand. Easy to shift.

4) St George sovereigns, utterly boring, but totally dependable and closest to spot. Although that is always a double edged sword. Closest to spot means it's more readily affected by rises and drops in the gold price.

5) Hammered gold - loved this stuff, but no where near the spot price, variable results when selling them. Best avoided but I just like them.

[9x883]

2 minutes ago, SidS said:

When I did have gold it was:

1) Guineas - somewhat above spot, especially anything pre-George III.

My thinking was, why pay £250 for a run of the mill shield sovereign when I could get an ex-mount guinea for £275? I sold every guinea I bought at a profit.

2) US pre-1933 gold - harder to get at a good price, but I love them.

Never had any problems selling them either, even in the UK. The $20 pieces are just epic, gorgeous chunks of gold.

3) Shield sovereigns - a bit mundane but I happily kept a few on hand. Easy to shift.

4) St George sovereigns, utterly boring, but totally dependable and closest to spot. Although that is always a double edged sword. Closest to spot means it's more readily affected by rises and drops in the gold price.

5) Hammered gold - loved this stuff, but no where near the spot price, variable results when selling them. Best avoided but I just like them.

Thank you for sharing your experience of buying and selling gold. Very useful indeed 💖👌

Edited October 2, 2023 by 9x883

[Smiler999]

I tend to only buy half sovereigns now, usually in batches of 5 at a time, I think in future it will be easier moved than the 1oz coins I bought at the start from the RM 😫

Edited October 2, 2023 by Smiler999
Grammar

[Gruff]

7 minutes ago, Smiler999 said:

I tend to only buy half sovereigns now, usually in batches of 5 at a time, I think in furthest will be easier moved than the 1oz coins I bought at the start from the RM 😫

100% agree that fractionals will be easier to shift going forward. Hang onto those 1oz's you might be able to pay off your mortgage with them

[Smiler999]

14 minutes ago, Gruff said:

100% agree that fractionals will be easier to shift going forward. Hang onto those 1oz's you might be able to pay off your mortgage with them

Thankfully my mortgage is very low, but like everyone I bought the wrong stuff at the start but I'm mainly sticking to ½s now as I just like them and more of them makes it look like I have something 😂

[Boruta]

For me as a new starter Sovereigns are the best. They are perfect for stacking as well as for collecting. Today, I received few of them. My first thought, having the oldest one in my hand was: too bad you cannot speak, I wish to listen your story. Maybe bullion coins are the best as the long investment but I am happy to pay that extra contribution towards history 😀.

Edited October 3, 2023 by Boruta
grammar