Authenticity of 1911 £5 Coin

[thanasis]

Hello forum!

I was recently offered a 1911 £5 Sovereign from a private seller, who also sent me the photos.

I am not an expert, but with my limited experience I think it is real, although a bit worn on the highest points.

Can you please offer your knowledge on this piece?

[goldhunter]

It looks fake to me

[dicker]

This looks genuine to me.  I’m afraid I am away from home this evening so can’t do my usual which is compare against a photo from @LawrenceChard’s site in detail. 

The fields look good, as do the letters, numerals and denticles. It looks somewhat “shiny” but that might be the photography.  The strike is not wonderful but the one I have seen before was similar.

Happy to be wrong (as ever) but it looks fine to me, on my iPhone!

(Mr Chard is kind enough to allow the occasional use of his images with attribution this - thank you!)

All the best to you

Dicker

 

 

[goldhunter]

23 minutes ago, dicker said:

This looks genuine to me.  I’m afraid I am away from home this evening so can’t do my usual which is compare against a photo from @LawrenceChard’s site in detail. 

The fields look good, as do the letters, numerals and denticles. It looks somewhat “shiny” but that might be the photography.  The strike is not wonderful but the one I have seen before was similar.

Happy to be wrong (as ever) but it looks fine to me, on my iPhone!

(Mr Chard is kind enough to allow the occasional use of his images with attribution this - thank you!)

All the best to you

Dicker

 

 

Its nearly panto season so here goes...Oh no it isn't

[GoldDiggerDave]

Don't like the angle of these photos, think it's trying to make the most of a weak strike.  Only my opinion. I think if you got some straight on it would not look the best.

[dicker]

https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces13256.html
 

Just for reference.

Best

Dicker

[LawrenceChard]

4 hours ago, thanasis said:

Hello forum!

I was recently offered a 1911 £5 Sovereign from a private seller, who also sent me the photos.

I am not an expert, but with my limited experience I think it is real, although a bit worn on the highest points.

Can you please offer your knowledge on this piece?

 

1 hour ago, dicker said:

This looks genuine to me.  I’m afraid I am away from home this evening so can’t do my usual which is compare against a photo from @LawrenceChard’s site in detail. 

The fields look good, as do the letters, numerals and denticles. It looks somewhat “shiny” but that might be the photography.  The strike is not wonderful but the one I have seen before was similar.

Happy to be wrong (as ever) but it looks fine to me, on my iPhone!

(Mr Chard is kind enough to allow the occasional use of his images with attribution this - thank you!)

All the best to you

Dicker

 

The edge damage on the obverse is surprising for a proof only issue, and the apparent weak striking on the reverse is not exactly auspicious.

You might try asking the seller for provenance, such as who he acquired it from. He probably won't want to tell you unless it is genuine.

I certainly would not buy it on the strength of those photos.

[sovereignsteve]

My first impression was fake, it doesn't look "right".

However, I have never seen one of these and comparing the photos with an original, it doesn't look too bad.

If I had to put my money somewhere, I wouldn't touch it.

[thanasis]

Thank you all for your feedback! Very informative.

@GoldDiggerDave When you say "weak strike" are you referring to the height of the relief in comparison to the fields, thus the overall detail?

 

[GoldDiggerDave]

24 minutes ago, thanasis said:

Thank you all for your feedback! Very informative.

@GoldDiggerDave When you say "weak strike" are you referring to the height of the relief in comparison to the fields, thus the overall detail?

 

I'm no expert or claim to be, the reverse just looks weak, yes low relief, low detail for a proof coin its certainly had a hard life, but theres only so much you can do with photos only.  If you are intending to buy there's nothing wrong at all asking for more photos and do some research into the coin.  The likely price of the coin. (is it too good to be true?) Look at some comparisons online, the left is a 1911 £5 at the London Coin auction yours on the right.  

First time I saw this the dragon looked particularly weak and looks off.   Only my opinion and other will have their own opinions.  Take your time have fun and enjoy the hobby. 

Hope this helps.  

[sovereignsteve]

That comparison clinches it, 99% fake. The 1% doubt is due to the two photos being a slightly different angles.

It is supposed to be a proof but that doesn't look possible. Again slight doubt due to photographic artefacts.

[Simmoleon]

The end of the moustache in the comparison for example is telling in my opinion; one is crisp and clear and the other looks likes a very weak strike/copy or has been polished/rubbed (almost like it’s been heavily handled or circulated if real). Seems to be consistent all over the coin and if I had the option to buy it I wouldn’t off these pictures. Even if this ended up being authentic something isn’t right with the weakness of the detail

[sovereignsteve]

I was looking when only the reverse was shown. The head and neck in particular look wrong, but again, could be the angle of the photo

[GoldDiggerDave]

5 hours ago, Simmoleon said:

The end of the moustache in the comparison for example is telling in my opinion; one is crisp and clear and the other looks likes a very weak strike/copy or has been polished/rubbed (almost like it’s been heavily handled or circulated if real). Seems to be consistent all over the coin and if I had the option to buy it I wouldn’t off these pictures. Even if this ended up being authentic something isn’t right with the weakness of the detail

I've seen many, (won't say "raw") circulation sovereigns where they are over graded the moustache is always the goto point along with the hairline above the temple, the ear is also a good indiction of the wear.  It does get more difficult IMO when they are in the mid  VF,gVF,aEF,EF range, and it's not all about wear theres numerous other factors.

 

 

[dicker]

Nice comparison!