**JANUARY 2019** Group Order from The European Mint

[NikolaAnne]

1 hour ago, litecoins said:

hi sorry if I missed this question but am I able to add anything to my order next week if I've already placed my order this week?

Yes, he said a while back, no hassles - note that the price simply may be different, as BYB is paying "now" for everything. 
So, you would pay for this week's bit this week, and next weeks bit next week.

[litecoins]

ahh ok thank you thats kool I did scroll through but couldn't seem to see it anywhere , im going to have to get some extra hours in now=]

[BackyardBullion]

OK all - the clock is ticking!!

If you want to order this weekend I need to have that order sent to me before 4pm today please. 

Payment no later than 5pm. 

Those of you who have had quotes from me an not paid, you have been warned and reminded! If you plan not to go ahead, a quick reply to let me know would help me greatly!

[NikolaAnne]

What's the scores on the doors @BackyardBullion ?? 🙂

[BackyardBullion]

UPDATE TIME - Week 1 is CLOSED

OK - this has been a record breaking weekend!

€16,500 and some change is the total in Fiat

998+ oz's

You all like silver apparently - who knew!

The total may have been even higher, but there were a few members who did not pay me on time!

Here is the breakdown. This is the same list ordered by number of individual coins and by OZ's

Enjoy!

*******There is a mistake on this spreadsheet!*********

Should say 100 oz worth of 10 oz Queen's Beast Unicorns, not 20. 

So total oz's are 998.9!!

[OllieClem]

Curious how many people have joined in so far. With the give away, is it all going to 1 person or splitting it so theres a couple winners. Planning to join next weekend when ive decided what to get

[5huggy]

998.9 - OH so close!!!  0.1 more you could have got the "services" out to reduce the postage further

RNLI - to bring across channel 

ambulance to ship to you

Police to escort the ambulance

Firebrigade to put out tyres that would  be on fire!!

NOW lets see what the total can get to - with next weeks addition - - Im still feeling it for the poor old table ! 🤣

[BackyardBullion]

19 minutes ago, OllieClem said:

Curious how many people have joined in so far. With the give away, is it all going to 1 person or splitting it so theres a couple winners. Planning to join next weekend when ive decided what to get

38 people have joined. 

1 winner takes the pot. 

[TheProspector]

1 hour ago, BackyardBullion said:

UPDATE TIME - Week 1 is CLOSED

OK - this has been a record breaking weekend!

€16,500 and some change is the total in Fiat

998+ oz's

You all like silver apparently - who knew!

The total may have been even higher, but there were a few members who did not pay me on time!

Here is the breakdown. This is the same list ordered by number of individual coins and by OZ's

Enjoy!

*******There is a mistake on this spreadsheet!*********

Should say 100 oz worth of 10 oz Queen's Beast Unicorns, not 20. 

So total oz's are 998.9!!

Just noted that a number of items are marked pre-sale. I didn’t think we could order these?

[BackyardBullion]

12 minutes ago, TheProspector said:

Just noted that a number of items are marked pre-sale. I didn’t think we could order these?

They are marked presale, but the manager of the EU mint said they can get to us in time (fast to order and deliver to the EU mint).

Ask me next weekend if there is something you are interested in and we can see what we can do case by case.

[TheProspector]

I was interested in the 2019 Philimonics, Eagles and Maples however I can wait and was not wanting any real bulk so probably not worth your trouble unless they actually were planning to have them in stock by next weekend.

[Zamiel]

On 05/01/2019 at 17:46, Csaba said:

I just sent a coin to Sweden for £6.50. This is a price up to 100g (3oz).  Over 3oz it is probably cheaper if  you order directly.

Thanks for the input

[Seasider]

The 2019 Koala shows up as Out of Stock on European Mint's site.  Do you know if they will get it in in time for this order next weekend?  GS.be show it as available from 21 January so I guess the answer will be No.

[BackyardBullion]

8 minutes ago, Seasider said:

The 2019 Koala shows up as Out of Stock on European Mint's site.  Do you know if they will get it in in time for this order next weekend?  GS.be show it as available from 21 January so I guess the answer will be No.

Unlikely, but we will be doing an order in February

[Johan]

May I ask if anybody has ever had a problem ordering from European Mint? I just placed my first order from 25 x silver Brittania coins, and was excited to get a confirmation today to say they have sent out my order - but looking at the address given, they seem to have half pasted somebody else's address into mine - ending with their postcode. I will of course ring them tomorrow morning, but I'm worried as I've never dealt with them before that my money may be lost. I'm aware I paid by bank transfer, which I fear bypasses a lot of my protection. I realise this isn't really the place to ask this BYB, but am seeking some assurance I've not given a bag of silver coins to a lucky random in East London. I realise mistakes happen, but I've never had any online company do this before, and none of them were sending me precious metals! I was planning on joining the group order this weekend you are kindly organising, but have my doubts now 😕

[BackyardBullion]

34 minutes ago, Johan said:

May I ask if anybody has ever had a problem ordering from European Mint? I just placed my first order from 25 x silver Brittania coins, and was excited to get a confirmation today to say they have sent out my order - but looking at the address given, they seem to have half pasted somebody else's address into mine - ending with their postcode. I will of course ring them tomorrow morning, but I'm worried as I've never dealt with them before that my money may be lost. I'm aware I paid by bank transfer, which I fear bypasses a lot of my protection. I realise this isn't really the place to ask this BYB, but am seeking some assurance I've not given a bag of silver coins to a lucky random in East London. I realise mistakes happen, but I've never had any online company do this before, and none of them were sending me precious metals! I was planning on joining the group order this weekend you are kindly organising, but have my doubts now 😕

Sounds like something you need to check with them I'm afraid, hopefully all will be OK if the address you gave does not match the shipment.

[cravethatcoin]

On 05/01/2019 at 18:23, BackyardBullion said:

Part of the issue is that I am acting as an agent on your behalf, so for me to be above board when it comes to my business, turnover etc. I need to be able to demonstrate that I was making the purchase as if you were doing so.

In my opinion you're not being completely honest about the fact that the European Mint are unwilling to allow group orders to benefit from the only reason why group ordering exists and that is bulk discounts. Please read back your reply above and ask yourself truly if that is accurate and even makes sense, It just seems like you are saying anything to avoid the question.  The fact the European Mint do not allow bulk discounts with this group order service makes the service itself completely pointless. The reality is that there are many negatives to someone purchasing via this group order and only a single possible benefit which is a "slightly" cheaper shipping cost (I would really like to see an actual example of a saving someone could expect on shipping vs simply ordering directly. I bet on average it would be tiny).

I know we spoke about this before on YouTube and things got heated but I just can't leave this alone without venting my concerns. It's almost like people are in a trace and not thinking this through. If everyone was getting a bulk price or even just free delivery from the mint as a thanks for everyone choosing them I would praise what you're doing beyond belief but as it stands now I see no benefit and many negatives:

Negatives of group order

    - no doubt you communicate with people over email to confirm their address details - this is a huge risk as if your email account gets hacked the hacker now has the address details of 500 people in the UK who own silver. Email is NOT secure. By ordering directly with the european mint their address is sent over SSL encryption used by their website
    - long delays between order and receiving bullion
    - a lot more time involved between sending you payment and communicating with you about shipping etc
    - higher risk in terms of logistics, open to human error on all sides (harder for goldsilver.be to process, postage now occurs 2 times increasing the risk by 50%)
    - less ability to time buys - the price of silver could drop between making payment to you and you making the order

Positives of group order

   - slightly cheaper shipping costs

 

---------------------------------

I decided to work out the real savings myself:

So if I go directly to European Mint and order 32 Silver Britannia's it comes to €508. Insured delivery directly to my house is €30. In pounds shipping is £26.89.

If I order the same via group order the price will be the same so €508 for 32 Britannia's. You mention shipping is capped by the European Mint at 1.2% so €6. So now I need to arrange shipping from you BYB to me once you receive the package. Going by your prices and to match the insurance that I would get in my first example that would come to £11. So shipping is £11 + €6 = £16.38.

So the group order has a saving of £10.51 if making a €508 (£455) order. I wouldn't consider that a good deal when taking into account the negatives of this service that I mentioned above.

---

It's also worth noting that goldsilver.be only charge €12 shipping (insured) for the same order and it works out cheaper in total at €523,68 vs €538 ordering directly via European Mint and €526.27 doing the group order.

[HelpingHands]

38 minutes ago, cravethatcoin said:

 

Positives of group order

   - slightly cheaper shipping costs

 

---------------------------------

I decided to work out the real savings myself:

 

How about if somebody just wanted a couple of coins?

Also remember BYB is offering this service as a choice.  It's not compulsory.

[cravethatcoin]

5 minutes ago, HelpingHands said:

How about if somebody just wanted a couple of coins?

Also remember BYB is offering this service as a choice.  It's not compulsory.

Once again it would be a situation of small savings on shipping VS many negatives of going through with this service.

Compulsory or not it has flaws and people who are considering this as a way of buying silver should be aware of them, they should also understand that they don't need a middle man to buy cheap silver from Europe.

 

[blackadder]

7 minutes ago, HelpingHands said:

How about if somebody just wanted a couple of coins?

Also remember BYB is offering this service as a choice.  It's not compulsory.

Wouldn't that be more expensive,could pickup afew coins here for not much more plus most offer free shipping etc.

 

45 minutes ago, cravethatcoin said:

- no doubt you communicate with people over email to confirm their address details - this is a huge risk as if your email account gets hacked the hacker now has the address details of 500 people in the UK who own silver. Email is NOT secure. By ordering directly with the european mint their address is sent over SSL encryption used by their website
    - long delays between order and receiving bullion
    - a lot more time involved between sending you payment and communicating with you about shipping etc
    - higher risk in terms of logistics, open to human error on all sides (harder for goldsilver.be to process, postage now occurs 2 times increasing the risk by 50%)
    - less ability to time buys - the price of silver could drop between making payment to you and you making the order

If you didn't want that long delay,it wouldn't be a great idea to join If you compare say ten queens beasts from a uk main dealer and this group order the savings are much higher.

Or someplace like silvertogo ordering direct its like £20,or if you order yourself from goldsilver.be etc then it don't matter to you

I think overall people use the group order as the order process on european mint puts them off,They find it much easier to just order through the group order regardless of the savings.

[HelpingHands]

1 hour ago, blackadder said:

Wouldn't that be more expensive,could pickup afew coins here for not much more plus most offer free shipping etc.

Maybe if what you want is on the forum.  If not, I imagine that UK to UK post is cheaper than Europe to UK for 2 coins. 

[FlorinCollector]

3 hours ago, cravethatcoin said:

In my opinion you're not being completely honest about the fact that the European Mint are unwilling to allow group orders to benefit from the only reason why group ordering exists and that is bulk discounts. Please read back your reply above and ask yourself truly if that is accurate and even makes sense, It just seems like you are saying anything to avoid the question.  The fact the European Mint do not allow bulk discounts with this group order service makes the service itself completely pointless. The reality is that there are many negatives to someone purchasing via this group order and only a single possible benefit which is a "slightly" cheaper shipping cost (I would really like to see an actual example of a saving someone could expect on shipping vs simply ordering directly. I bet on average it would be tiny).

I know we spoke about this before on YouTube and things got heated but I just can't leave this alone without venting my concerns. It's almost like people are in a trace and not thinking this through. If everyone was getting a bulk price or even just free delivery from the mint as a thanks for everyone choosing them I would praise what you're doing beyond belief but as it stands now I see no benefit and many negatives:

Negatives of group order

    - no doubt you communicate with people over email to confirm their address details - this is a huge risk as if your email account gets hacked the hacker now has the address details of 500 people in the UK who own silver. Email is NOT secure. By ordering directly with the european mint their address is sent over SSL encryption used by their website
    - long delays between order and receiving bullion
    - a lot more time involved between sending you payment and communicating with you about shipping etc
    - higher risk in terms of logistics, open to human error on all sides (harder for goldsilver.be to process, postage now occurs 2 times increasing the risk by 50%)
    - less ability to time buys - the price of silver could drop between making payment to you and you making the order

Positives of group order

   - slightly cheaper shipping costs

 

---------------------------------

I decided to work out the real savings myself:

So if I go directly to European Mint and order 32 Silver Britannia's it comes to €508. Insured delivery directly to my house is €30. In pounds shipping is £26.89.

If I order the same via group order the price will be the same so €508 for 32 Britannia's. You mention shipping is capped by the European Mint at 1.2% so €6. So now I need to arrange shipping from you BYB to me once you receive the package. Going by your prices and to match the insurance that I would get in my first example that would come to £11. So shipping is £11 + €6 = £16.38.

So the group order has a saving of £10.51 if making a €508 (£455) order. I wouldn't consider that a good deal when taking into account the negatives of this service that I mentioned above.

---

It's also worth noting that goldsilver.be only charge €12 shipping (insured) for the same order and it works out cheaper in total at €523,68 vs €538 ordering directly via European Mint and €526.27 doing the group order.

What a waste of your own time 😂😂and some of your info is completly wrong. 

1. Ive joined most group orders and never had an email from byb.

2. Long delay between receiving order. Duhh stoopid thats an obvious.

3. Time invloved sending payment is minutes. I send link. Byb sends price. I send payment. Complete.

4. Price of silver cant drop its a weekend when the order is done. 

[BackyardBullion]

@cravethatcoin

Here we ago again. I really should not gratify you with a response, but seeing as you have called out my honesty and integrity I am going to. 

Let's address it point by point so that maybe you can better understand just how wrong you are. 

First up.

Quote

In my opinion you're not being completely honest about the fact that the European Mint are unwilling to allow group orders to benefit from the only reason why group ordering exists and that is bulk discounts. Please read back your reply above and ask yourself truly if that is accurate and even makes sense, It just seems like you are saying anything to avoid the question.  The fact the European Mint do not allow bulk discounts with this group order service makes the service itself completely pointless. 

What exactly are you insinuating here? These orders have never been about getting a bulk discount on the prices of coins. It has always been about the collective sharing of international shipping costs. So, you are making assertions that are a) not true & b) not even applicable!

At the same time you are challenging my honesty and integrity about the situation - accusing me of hiding and avoiding the reasons why they aren't offering bulk discounts on coins!

Quote

I know we spoke about this before on YouTube and things got heated but I just can't leave this alone without venting my concerns.

Perhaps this kind of attitude that you demonstrate is the reason why.....and probably why you were subsequently blocked and banned from commenting on my channel for your obtuse and rude assertions and personal attacks against me and the users of the group order. Now you are here!

Quote

It's almost like people are in a trace and not thinking this through. If everyone was getting a bulk price or even just free delivery from the mint as a thanks for everyone choosing them I would praise what you're doing beyond belief but as it stands now I see no benefit and many negatives:

Now you are calling out the 400+ different individual people that have joined the group orders in all the time I have been doing them as being "in a trance" (I assume this is what you meant as you typed "trace").

Well, group order members, are you all in a "trance" or "trace"???? Have I beguiled you with lies and wit to join this group order? 

Now let's move onto the negatives you so kindly laid out for us all. 

Quote

 - no doubt you communicate with people over email to confirm their address details - this is a huge risk as if your email account gets hacked the hacker now has the address details of 500 people in the UK who own silver. Email is NOT secure. By ordering directly with the european mint their address is sent over SSL encryption used by their website

I communicate via the forum messaging system. The Silver Forum is SSL encrypted. In addition to that my own website and associated email is SSL encrypted. In addition to that I have 2 step verification. Nothing is ever fully hack proof of course, but come on, this is a big stretch and in my (and I would imagine many others) not a valid negative about the group order.

But to give due respect, if you have a better idea for communication (other than using Gumtree like you mentioned in another post you put up last night, which by the way is probably one of the least secure ways you can go about buying and selling Gold and Silver!!) then I am all ears. 

Quote

 - long delays between order and receiving bullion

OK - this is one of the downsides, I will give you that. But it is also not a big factor for many people. In fact, there are a lot of people who would vault their orders with dealers and have them shipped once every 6 months. So it is a downside, but a full blown negative? Bit of a stretch. 

Quote

 - a lot more time involved between sending you payment and communicating with you about shipping etc

How is this even a point you are making? You seem to be clutching for anything to moan about at this stage.....

I can argue (and you actually back this up yourself for me in this very post) that the costs of shipping are laid out very clearly such that people can calculate them just as you have done later in your post. So your point here is completely invalid. 

And the reason I do the shipping invoices at the end is because there are a lot of people that tag on extra items as the weeks progress. If I did a shipping quote at the start then I would have a huge extra administrative burden of adding additional postage because of different weight brackets. 

Quote

- higher risk in terms of logistics, open to human error on all sides (harder for goldsilver.be to process, postage now occurs 2 times increasing the risk by 50%)

OK, first up it is the EU Mint, not Goldsilver.be but OK....

There is indeed an extra logistical step in that myself and Mrs BYB have to organise peoples orders into individual parcels and ship them out. 

The very few (and I literally mean 2 or 3 times in 400+ orders) that we have made a mistake in sending out the wrong coins, we have contacted and/or corrected as soon as we were informed or realised  the mistakes at our own expense.

I forget the names of those involved, but if you are one of those people reading this please back me up!

So, there is no additional risk to the customer because they will always get their order........

Quote

- less ability to time buys - the price of silver could drop between making payment to you and you making the order

Well, clearly you know nothing about how this order works.

We do things on a weekend when the metal prices are static. 

If you had bothered to read/understand how the order works perhaps your list of negatives would be considerably shorter. 

Quote

Positives of group order

   - slightly cheaper shipping costs

Yes. But you even put your biased opinion when typing this. "slightly". 

You did the maths yourself. You saved £10.51 - if you don't want to save £10 then give it to some of the many people out there that do want to save £10. 

Quote

So if I go directly to European Mint and order 32 Silver Britannia's it comes to €508. Insured delivery directly to my house is €30. In pounds shipping is £26.89.

It's also worth noting that goldsilver.be only charge €12 shipping (insured) for the same order and it works out cheaper in total at €523,68 vs €538 ordering directly via European Mint and €526.27 doing the group order.

A great demonstration of your lack of awareness about how ordering from GS.be and EU Mint works. 

If you bothered to check the shipping when you have logged in you will see that the shipping from GS.be is €22 with a total of €534.32

In addition the cost from the EU mint for 32 Britannias ordering directly is €36, not €30 and the total is €544.48

If you joined the group order your total would be approximately €528 including the special delivery shipping from me to you.

As you can see, significant savings. 

Quote

Once again it would be a situation of small savings on shipping VS many negatives of going through with this service.

Compulsory or not it has flaws and people who are considering this as a way of buying silver should be aware of them, they should also understand that they don't need a middle man to buy cheap silver from Europe.

No, you do not need a middleman to order cheap silver from Europe. But as I have demonstrated it makes that already cheap silver EVEN CHEAPER!!!

In addition there are the added benefits that you chose not to include in your post. 

- You do not have to set up an account with the dealer and physically place the order with them. Simply tell me what you want and I give you a price. 

- You do not have to set up accounts with money transfer services like Transferwise. I have these already done and I am ID verified and have undergone money laundering checks. Saves you a lot of time and hassle. 

- You can plan when to be in to accept delivery. If you choose UK to UK special delivery you know what day you are going to be in to take delivery. 

- You do not have to deal with the dealer directly. Ever tried emailing GS.be with a query about a specific item? Nightmare (and that is often when they actually reply!). In this order, as I have demonstrated, I can ask the EU mint manager a question and get an answer within minutes. 

There are other benefits as well, but to be honest, I am losing the will to live defending myself to you.

So in summary.....

Get your facts straight before making personal attacks on me, the group order and its users. 

I do not force anybody to join the group order. 

I am clear, up front and honest about the way the order works and any insinuation that I am missleading people will be strongly defended. 

You do not have to join the group order. 

 

[Rat]

@BackyardBullion @cravethatcoin

I don't normally get involved in these sorts of debate on t'internet however I feel compelled to share my experience of the group orders and dealing with BYB in general.

Group Orders

• I have been using these group orders for over a year now and as I consider myself a collector first and a stacker second these orders are a great way to ensure I can complete collections in the cheapest way possible. Before I found this forum I was buying silver direct from UK dealers and easily paying 20 - 25% more for coins (including the delivery). 
• I am nervous about buying from overseas dealers. I have had one bad experience (although it was down to the UK courier company that failed to deliver) buying from a well known Belgian dealer that puts me off buying direct. Using the group order means that BYB deals with all of that hassle for me.
• The process put in place by BYB makes it nice and simple for me to place an order. 1 - I choose what I want and PM it (securely) to BYB. 2 - BYB comes back confirming the price and I send him the money. 3 - At the end of the order BYB provides UK shipping costs and I send him the money. 4 - My silver arrives. Now while I acknowledge the turnaround on this is longer than if I ordered direct I don't get any of the stress of ordering from a dealer direct for what is normally a few hundred pounds worth of silver. Patience is after all a virtue 😉.
• I like to participate in the group order as the promotion the forum receives from the BYB unboxing videos drives traffic to this forum and brings more like minded people into our world. Also I get a real kick out of seeing that volume and diversity of silver in one place.

Dealing with BYB

 I have been participating in the Group orders managed by BYB for over a year now and I have also purchased a number of hand poured silver items direct from him.

• I find BYB's communication and support second to none when it comes to these group orders. I had a number of questions when I first participated in a group order and BYB patiently answered each one. I see him continuing to do that on all subsequent orders as new forum members consider joining the order.
• I have had one occasion where a coin I ordered did not arrive on time and BYB was excellent at chasing the European mint and keeping me informed while I waited for restocking and then getting it shipped over to me.
• I commissioned a hand poured silver piece for a family members birthday and despite the fact I left it too late to order for the date I needed it BYB bent over backwards to expedite the pouring, stamping and hallmarking to get it to me on time. I really could not have asked for better service.
• In my opinion BYB is not just a wonderful craftsman but also an excellent businessman. He understands customer service and the concerns of new participants to these group orders and makes very little personally from running these orders other than using them to promote his business. The amount of effort put in to run these on our behalf for a £1 (optional) tip is not very much when you think of all the hassle and stress for Mr & Mrs BYB to operate and deliver these orders.

All of the above are just my honest thoughts and while I appreciate everyone's experiences and opinions may differ from mine I have no hesitation in joining these orders because I save on shipping costs, don't have to deal with dealers direct and based on my previous dealings trust BYB implicitly (well at least with a couple of hundred quid of my silver budget) 😀 . 

Cravethecoin - I am not sure if your post is a genuine concern or your just having a pop at BYB. My suggestion would be that you check your facts and figures before posting and just spend some time reading the content of this forum. You will see a large number of people who deal with BYB on a regular or one off basis and in all of these interactions I have not seen anything that would cause me to question either his integrity or honesty.

Right time for me to go back into my trance like state and watch more of BYB's videos......zzzzzz....must buy more shiny...zzzz...group orders...zzzzz...European mint....zzzzzzzzz.

[AppleZippoandMetronome]

This is the second time now I've read comments in here which seem to question @BackyardBullion's integrity though this time there is the added bonus of insulting everyone who participates in the group orders 🙄

The posts above this do a good job of addressing the points so I'll be short.

I really don't get it. If you don't like the idea of the group orders you don't have to join - it is pretty simple. I have joined in the last two because the cost of the items I wanted worked out cheaper this way and going through the group order frankly saved me a lot of work. BYB has never been anything other than a gentlemen in communications and I have very much appreciated the professional way he goes about what he does. He is deserving of all the praise that comes his way (and same of course for Mrs BYB) and frankly not in any way deserving of these kinds of personal attacks. I could see someone making these sorts of complaints if BYB was hiding something or not being upfront about details but everything is here - nothing is hidden and we can all freely see what it will cost, what we stand to save and how long it might take. If anyone doesn't like it they don't have to participate.