Roy

Yes please

Gees mate thats bloody scary.   There's a good strategy to rent your place out down there and move Tup North when it comes to retirement.   Spoke with the Mrs about this and we've always fancied living somewhere out in the sticks either North Wales or Scotland,  will just buy a small place and rent the current house out.

£1500 for a flat, £2500 for a ex council house where I am. All 3 bed and no new builds available. 
Cheapest 2 bed flat to rent is £1250 and there is one of them added yesterday. 

I don't think you were far off Roy with around $4k-£3.1k outgoings per month.  Anyone paying rent or still servicing a mortgage will be easily paying £1k in rent or mortgage the odds are anyone paying rent or a mortgage are likely to have other debt they need to service like personal loans and credit cards.  
I'd say most families or those with dependants  today in the UK will need 2.5k income as an absolute minimum to get by if they are still servicing debt by they retire.    Whats really scary is for those who just rent  ok in your 40-50's while you are still working, what happens to rent 15-20 after you have retired?   in your late 50's early 60's the rent could be come so expensive the pension is not paying the rent.   I know America has already got a handle on this and they have solved it with cardboard box cities under freeway bridges.    
£800 per month to rent an ex council house near me, £1,200 for a small new build house.  
 
 

Ha, I think I qualify for all of these at some point. 
All I am looking for in metals is to supplement part of my pension if and when I need it. My biggest thought lately is if I depart before my time that I need to write some kind of instruction manual as to what to do with all my bits. 

Back to reality, no-one here expects to survive solely on their gold stack 🙂 ( hope!)
If we consider gold as a savings vehicle and a tool to combat inflation, we can use @Darr3nG's super chart above to guide us how much gold we need to supplement our pension/retirement.
Let's assume that you own your property and have at least some income coming in, whether that be from a state pension, a private pension, investments or have income producing assets such as BTL.
The state pension in the UK is £203 p/w, perhaps £812 pcm? I'd call that 'worst-case scenario', although some may not even receive that! I noted mums that took time off etc. https://www.gov.uk/new-state-pension/what-youll-get
You may never need to touch your gold because you've been canny with your savings and investments but, for those who *haven't, it's comforting to know that just 1.35 sovs or 0.33 ozt gold can supplement your pension by £500 every month.
 
* this is not meant to be sarcastic- many people have missed the opportunity to save and invest because of either a lack of financial education, family commitments, lack of family planning, controlling spouses, disability and various addictions.

I chose that figure considering the formula that your rent should be a third of your salary. I believe most folk are paying rents of £1000 pcm, if not more.
Rents are crazy in the US, you guys over the pond don't realize that we are just not able to do the things we want to do!
C'mon, the queues in Starbucks are huge! My boss doesn't understand why I'm late everyday...
Uber and Doordash both expect a 20% tip and God knows how I'm going to finance the iPhone 15
It's not fair!
😭

Back to reality, no-one here expects to survive solely on their gold stack 🙂 ( hope!)
If we consider gold as a savings vehicle and a tool to combat inflation, we can use @Darr3nG's super chart above to guide us how much gold we need to supplement our pension/retirement.
Let's assume that you own your property and have at least some income coming in, whether that be from a state pension, a private pension, investments or have income producing assets such as BTL.
The state pension in the UK is £203 p/w, perhaps £812 pcm? I'd call that 'worst-case scenario', although some may not even receive that! I noted mums that took time off etc. https://www.gov.uk/new-state-pension/what-youll-get
You may never need to touch your gold because you've been canny with your savings and investments but, for those who *haven't, it's comforting to know that just 1.35 sovs or 0.33 ozt gold can supplement your pension by £500 every month.
 
* this is not meant to be sarcastic- many people have missed the opportunity to save and invest because of either a lack of financial education, family commitments, lack of family planning, controlling spouses, disability and various addictions.

Don't be down.
I think you are referring to your wanted post and I would like to offer some suggestions.
The forum operates on a reputation basis. If someone with a good reputation offers advice, and they have been here a while, it's probably good advice.
i.e, state what you are willing to pay, it saves on email ping pong 😊
It's probably not a good idea to offer less than spot price for gold, especially on a fractional piece.
Stick around and enjoy it.

Borrowed from Yankee Stacking 😇


If your monthly expenses were, say, $4000, you'd need 139 ozt. a month to cover them.
Lose your job for six months, 834 ozt.
If you plan to rely on silver to finance your retirement, you'd need 1667 ozt a year to maintain your current lifestyle.
16,670 ozt (518.5 KG) to last you 10 years, assuming the silver price stays constant.
Keep stacking boys!
😎
p.s. @GoldDiggerDave had nothing to do with this post 😇

Philippines actually, but Thailand will do! Yes.
Me too 😎
100% dosser, me 😇

Ooh, the irony 😊

I chose that figure considering the formula that your rent should be a third of your salary. I believe most folk are paying rents of £1000 pcm, if not more.
Rents are crazy in the US, you guys over the pond don't realize that we are just not able to do the things we want to do!
C'mon, the queues in Starbucks are huge! My boss doesn't understand why I'm late everyday...
Uber and Doordash both expect a 20% tip and God knows how I'm going to finance the iPhone 15
It's not fair!
😭

Thought about going back to Thailand Roy?
Fortunately i am a paid off home owner - no rent or mortgage.
Late everyday? i didn't think you were working Roy. i thought you were a dosser like me.

Borrowed from Yankee Stacking 😇


If your monthly expenses were, say, $4000, you'd need 139 ozt. a month to cover them.
Lose your job for six months, 834 ozt.
If you plan to rely on silver to finance your retirement, you'd need 1667 ozt a year to maintain your current lifestyle.
16,670 ozt (518.5 KG) to last you 10 years, assuming the silver price stays constant.
Keep stacking boys!
😎
p.s. @GoldDiggerDave had nothing to do with this post 😇

Yeah absolutely. I particularly enjoyed the crying about ‘not being able to do the stuff I wanna do ‘
😢poor chicken 

On that video there is no actual food. Just c**p. But they are using smart phones and sat in nice cars wearing smart watches etc. 
buy actual ingredients… from a market or even better grow it. . Cook it. Don’t buy shheet. 
 
I also don’t personally don’t listen to anything from WSS based on the alleged past attached to that person. Alleged 

Now do SNP and QQQ. The last shows these are the better option.. but I’m not sure the next 50 years will follow the last 50. 
Compound interest is the key to these ‘long term’ metrics. I’d argue 1971 isn’t long term when looking at PMs (precious metals, Perth mint, private message) but it was obviously a turning point. 
 
As a non yielding asset over the long term pms aren’t a great investment (collectable premium excused). But as a shorter term hedge there’s growth and imvho I see potential in it at the moment. I’ve seen the real estate vs PMs and other collectables before and it works atm on thr trend but obviously not for the majority of the charts and not for real people. Who wanted an inner suburb terrace in londres in 1971? Who wants one now. Same for multiple examples.  For me it’s important to move capital based on circumstances and not stay stuck in one form for ever. 
 
with BTC or ETH there’s not enough history to establish trends imho. For good or bad. 
 
Gold and silver (bullion) are savings not investment 
 
 
You forgot to carry the 1🤣🤣🤣

A lot of assumptions there, @GoldDiggerDave...
 
According to [The Royal Mint], a large monster box (20 tubes) has the following dimensions: L:265 x W:218 x D:86 mm
54 is a nice round (literally rectangular) 6 x 9 configuration, so would cover a floor area comprised of approx. 1.59 x 1.96m
Moving over to [Wikipedia], we can see that this would fit comfortably under a standard King-size bed (in most countries, except the UK where there will be a bit poking out)
And only requiring approx. 90mm of floor clearance would leave some space for other storage. This, or just place the mattress directly on top of the monster boxes for a "solid" night's sleep.
Moving said bed to the ground floor would mitigate against any ceiling damage.
 
Check mate!

$4000 a month - that's £3139 at the moment. That's a lot in my book.
i probably potter along with £400 a month expenses and spend the rest on metals and other trinkets. 
i think when you consider how much silver you would need to live, even my frugal existence, you realise that silver is way under priced - way under priced.
Keep stacking.

Some interesting maths going on here!
The average Fed Funds Rate 1971-2023 = 4.86%. Let's take interest on bank deposits as a smidge below the FFR, say 4.75%. In that case (calculated using yearly compound):
$1000 in 1971 = $1000*(1.0475)^53 = $11,699 or roughly a quarter of the previously derived figure
Freddie Mac has been keeping records since 1971. Between April 1971 and June 2023, 30-year fixed-rate mortgages averaged 7.74%
Let's compare our $1000 earning interest in the bank (or government bonds) with $1000 in mortgage debt between 1971-2023:
$11699 - ($1000*(1.0774)^53)) = $11699 - $51997 = a net position of minus $40K for every $1000
(1971-2023 is 53 years inclusive, not 52)
Compound Interest Calculator [with Formula] (omnicalculator.com) (A better calculator)
So cash went up 11.7x
Debt went up 52x
How does that compare with holding gold and silver? Well:

 

You need roughly the same amount of gold and silver to buy a house in 2023 as you did in 1971 - roughly 200 ounces of gold and very roughly 15,000 ounces of silver. Gold has maintained its value over those roughly 50 years while silver has maintained most of its value over that same period
GBP has lost 99.654% of its value vs gold since 1751
USD has lost 99% of its value vs gold since 1930
JPY has lost 99.98% of its value vs gold in the last 100 years
Neither gold nor silver are yielding assets. It's illogical to promote gold as an investment while claiming silver is not an investment when over the last 50 years they are roughly equivalent. Currently we have an historically high gold/silver ratio so perhaps if we take another 50 years the relative values of gold, silver and real estate will be even closer than today. For reference the Pearson's coefficient between gold and silver is roughly 0.80 and the coefficient between BTC and ETH is roughly 0.89. Saying gold is an investment and silver is not is akin to saying BTC is an investment while ETH is not. They are strongly correlated, indeed, silver and gold naturally occur together in the same deposits the majority of the time. 

If you use @Darr3nG chart, for 2k a month outgoings it’s 1066 oz per year, god willing we all want 25 years retirement so that’s 26,650 oz or almost 54 monster boxes. You can’t stuff that under the bed it would bring the ceiling down 🤣
 
when you look at silver in these terms it very quickly becomes a cartoon.  Factor in the postage charges you would have  shelled out over the years for the stack …..it’s almost 13.5k in capsules🤣
£18,521 in postage if you bought 10 a time with RMSD 

One way to look at it is, roughly two and a half or (five for 20 years ) monster boxes of gold Brits are pretty easy to store. Imagine how many many boxes of silver that would be!!
You could build a garden wall, or better still a bomb shelter with them 🌞

Monthly Expenses Duration of Crisis GBP £ Silver Ozt* 6 months 1 Year 18 Months 2 Years 3 Years £500.00 22.22 133.3 266.7 400.0 533.3 800.0 £1,000.00 44.44 266.7 533.3 800.0 1,066.7 1,600.0 £2,000.00 88.89 533.3 1,066.7 1,600.0 2,133.3 3,200.0 £3,000.00 133.33 800.0 1,600.0 2,400.0 3,200.0 4,800.0 £4,000.00 177.78 1,066.7 2,133.3 3,200.0 4,266.7 6,400.0 £5,000.00 222.22 1,333.3 2,666.7 4,000.0 5,333.3 8,000.0 £6,000.00 266.67 1,600.0 3,200.0 4,800.0 6,400.0 9,600.0 £10,000.00 444.44 2,666.7 5,333.3 8,000.0 10,666.7 16,000.0 £15,000.00 666.67 4,000.0 8,000.0 12,000.0 16,000.0 24,000.0 £20,000.00 888.89 5,333.3 10,666.7 16,000.0 21,333.3 32,000.0 *based on 1ozt silver round from TSF: £22.50                                   Monthly Expenses Duration of Crisis GBP £ Gold Ozt* 6 months 1 Year 18 Months 2 Years 3 Years £500.00 0.33 2.0 3.9 5.9 7.8 11.7 £1,000.00 0.65 3.9 7.8 11.7 15.6 23.5 £2,000.00 1.30 7.8 15.6 23.5 31.3 46.9 £3,000.00 1.95 11.7 23.5 35.2 46.9 70.4 £4,000.00 2.61 15.6 31.3 46.9 62.5 93.8 £5,000.00 3.26 19.5 39.1 58.6 78.2 117.3 £6,000.00 3.91 23.5 46.9 70.4 93.8 140.7 £10,000.00 6.51 39.1 78.2 117.3 156.4 234.5 £15,000.00 9.77 58.6 117.3 175.9 234.5 351.8 £20,000.00 13.03 78.2 156.4 234.5 312.7 469.1 *based on 1ozt gold round from TSF: £1,535.00                                   Monthly Expenses Duration of Crisis GBP £ Sovereign* 6 months 1 Year 18 Months 2 Years 3 Years £500.00 1.35 8.1 16.2 24.3 32.4 48.6 £1,000.00 2.70 16.2 32.4 48.6 64.9 97.3 £2,000.00 5.41 32.4 64.9 97.3 129.7 194.6 £3,000.00 8.11 48.6 97.3 145.9 194.6 291.9 £4,000.00 10.81 64.9 129.7 194.6 259.5 389.2 £5,000.00 13.51 81.1 162.2 243.2 324.3 486.5 £6,000.00 16.22 97.3 194.6 291.9 389.2 583.8 £10,000.00 27.03 162.2 324.3 486.5 648.6 973.0 £15,000.00 40.54 243.2 486.5 729.7 973.0 1,459.5 £20,000.00 54.05 324.3 648.6 973.0 1,297.3 1,945.9 *based on 1 full sovereign from TSF: £370.00      

£1000 in the bank in 1971 with an average of 7.1% interest over time. Turns into  £39,690.85.
£1000 of silver in 1971 would have bought you around 1200oz (being generous)   allowing for vat and dealer premium  £21,348.00 todays price 
£1000 of gold in 1971 would have bought around 60oz gold allowing for dealer premium  today this is worth £89,700. today price 
Not positive nor negative just fact. 
Cash in the bank has gone up 39X in 52 years  from £1000 to £39,690.85  (with interest) 
Silver has gone up 25.5X in price in 52 years, from £0.70p to £17.85  at spot 
Gold has gone up 94.3x in price in 52 years, from £15.84 to £1,495 at spot 
In real terms how much has the pound lost in 52 years?   I would argue around 95% of its real purchasing  power.
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

@modofantasmais spot on.

Food, fuel, utilities and taxes (council or otherwise) amongst everything else only go in one direction.
We're aiming to pay off our debt (mortgage) asap as well as continue with the pension pots, then save/invest harder for the remainder of our careers until we reach our tipping point and we can then utilise our pensions keeping the savings/investments for a rainy day.
When the kids have finally flown the nest we will eventually downsize (then move somewhere they can't find us 😂) for a final pot if needed or in part, gift within our lifetimes.
IMHO I don't see PMs as a way to offset expenses in retirement although it could... to an extent, it's too much a moving target.  For me it's the enjoyment of collecting and holding as well as being physical savings to pass on, unless an emergency arises.