200 Anniversary "Strike on the day" Sovereign

[sovereignsteve]

59 minutes ago, MikeSol said:

I think he meant a half with the 1817 shield design like this.

 

I hope not, I never did like that shield.

[westminstrel]

1 hour ago, MikeSol said:

I think he meant a half with the 1817 shield design like this.

 

Yup, that is exactly what I meant

1 hour ago, Oldun said:

You are absolutely not going to believe this but I had a dream about this last night and hurrying to make the purchase...I think I need a holiday

Haha! The mania has taken over your subconscious

[Guest]

I might be up for a Piedfort proof 5 Sovereign that would be a great coin. 10 Sovs in one coin!

Most pundits favor the Piedfort sovereign as being the biggest potential investment winner of the three new coins. They say that it is a proof and that it will be the winner. I am not so certain… What do you think?

[shawy2510]

I bought the piedfort only but do wish I had gone for the strike on the day also [emoji20] not willing to pay silly prices though

 

 

[Guest]

Pundits or dealers? 

I haven't really seen dealers express a preference. Maybe Adrian? But CPM, Westminster, Chard? They just push what they are allocated in the best way.

Pundits )) not sure who they are ... me you shadow forum members? All the voices said Piedfort Piedfort Piedfort... I said BU )) maybe I was wrong only time will say..

[augur]

9 minutes ago, Numistacker said:

I might be up for a Piedfort proof 5 Sovereign that would be a great coin. 10 Sovs in one coin!

Most pundits favor the Piedfort sovereign as being the biggest potential investment winner of the three new coins. They say that it is a proof and that it will be the winner. I am not so certain… What do you think?
 

 

 

Just having started collecting coins and mostly being drawn in by Jodi Clark's work, the 200th anniversary reverse has grabbed my attention. Large coins seem to be a better canvas for grand designs to let the sculptures come alive.

Now, by the time I realised, firstly all the proofs were gone and secondly the BU quintuple sovereign also comes much cheaper than the 5 coin proof set. The largest coin allows best to appreciate the artwork and a nice and unexpected icing on the coin is the semi frosted finish.

This is obviously not from an investment perspective but from a keeper point of view. 

[westminstrel]

14 minutes ago, Numistacker said:

I might be up for a Piedfort proof 5 Sovereign that would be a great coin. 10 Sovs in one coin!
 

 

 

Most pundits favor the Piedfort sovereign as being the biggest potential investment winner of the three new coins. They say that it is a proof and that it will be the winner. I am not so certain… What do you think?
 

 

 

There's really no end to it. They could just as well go really big and do a kilo Sovereign.

I think for me personally, it comes down to whether the "common man" can afford these coins, and in special years like this one, indulge a little bit.

While a Piedfort Quintuple Sovereign would be an amazing coin, I feel the price would be so prohibitive to common folks it would mostly be glossed over. That's not to say they wouldn't sell out - I'm sure there are folks out there who can afford stuff like this. I've seen the Perth Mint's 5oz gold coins studded with diamonds sell out.

Anyway, long story short, not for me

[Kman]

36 minutes ago, Numistacker said:

. me you shadow forum members? All the voices said Piedfort Piedfort Piedfort... .

 

This is at least the second time you've said this

I said BU, my exact words (when I posted about it before anyone else had) were "I like it more as an option than the piedfort"

I said it after looking at the RM site and it was my instant, uninfluenced reaction 

 

34 minutes ago, shortstack68 said:

all 3 coins will make gains, we're only discussing amounts, 

You've changed your tune  

[Kman]

Just now, shortstack68 said:

 there was never a doubt the coins would make a gain

I looked in and reread the sovereign thread, you said "I think the only 2 winners will be COA 1817 and the RM"

It's ok to be mistaken 

 

[augur]

3 minutes ago, shortstack68 said:

Look at the proof, it's doubled but also cost £100 less than the BU

It's still hard to believe a BU costs more than a proof, limited edition or not. 

[sovereignsteve]

When these things first saw light of day on the RM website, my initial reaction was; gimmick, gimmick, gimmick.

Do I like them? Would I want to keep them long term? Can I make money flipping one or two? Do I need to own one just in case they go exponential and I can't get one in the future for love nor money.

All these questions and emotions went through my head and tbh still do to a degree.

I decided not to bother getting any of them. None of them grabbed me enough to want to have one in my collection. I couldn't be bothered buying any to flip short term; The longer term? I have enough exposure to sovereigns and PMs as it is and don't want to sell any of my current coins in order to buy these.

My opinion, having seen the pics and vids of these:

Piedfort: Looks like a proof, was always going to, don't see the point and don't think they'll do well long term. Short term, OK though.

BU: Nice mintage, lovely finish but am I the only one who thinks the thick rim surround and plain, shiny edge is just bloody awful?
To me, it's not a sovereign. However, I still might have to get one just in case I learn to love it

5 Pounds: I actually like this one, the finish is great and to have the original Pistrucci G&D design in that size is awsome. I would prefer to have the proof but this is a cheaper alternative. The double sov is probably adequate in this respect though and to have 5 sovs worth of gold and money tied up is probably excessive. Don't think it will do so well long term as not many people collect £5 sovs.

Conclusion: I agree with @Numistacker, the BU is probably the best option for all the reasons he states. I will be interested to see how it does longer term when all the hype has died down and it becomes simply a collectable coin, or not

In the end, as others have said, it's all personal taste and opinion and don't buy anything you wouldn't want to keep long term, just in case. However, those who bought to flip or to keep their options open should do ok.
 

 

 

[Kman]

9 minutes ago, sovereignsteve said:

Conclusion: I agree with @Numistacker

:| you bastard lol

 

[Kman]

5 minutes ago, shortstack68 said:

The 5 Sovereign will be the longer term better coin IMO

If I had to guess, id guess £5 will do the the worst, pound for pound 

The price is so high already with the gold content it doesn't feel like it leave much room for a big premium on top

What was the issue price, close to £2000?

It's more realistic to think BU £525 might rich £1000ish or £800 piedfort might reach £1600 than £5 get to £4000

 

 

[sovereignsteve]

2 minutes ago, Kman said:

:| you bastard lol

 

why? i often do

I don't think I ever said he was wrong, just that I didn't like it.

[Kman]

Just now, sovereignsteve said:

why? i often do

I don't think I ever said he was wrong, just that I didn't like it.

You said you agree with Numistacker, should have said Numistacker & Kman  

Numistacker said a minute ago he was the only one to say the BU was the best

I linked to a post where I was the first on the forum to say I preferred the BU to the piedfort

It's irking me this narrative that Numi was the only one to pick it out 

 

[sovereignsteve]

3 minutes ago, Kman said:

If I had to guess, id guess £5 will the the worst, pound for pound 

The price is so high already with the gold content it doesn't feel like it leave much room for a big premium on top

What was the issue price, close to £2000?

It's more realistic to think BU £525 might rich £1000ish or £800 piedfort might reach £1600 than £5 get to £4000

 

yes if you're looking to make money, 3 or 4 bu's should be better than 1 £5, or 2 piedforts, who knows?

[sovereignsteve]

Just now, Kman said:

You said you agree with Numistacker, should have said Numistacker & Kman  

Numistacker said a minute ago he was the only one to say the BU was the best

I linked to a post where I was the first on the forum to say I preferred the BU to the piedfort

It's irking me this narrative that Numi was the only one to pick it out 

 

sorry mate, didn't mean to leave you out. only that I'd just finished watching his vid

hadn't been following the minutiae of the thread.

@Numistacker, you're wrong!

[Kman]

1 minute ago, sovereignsteve said:

sorry mate, didn't mean to leave you out. only that I'd just finished watching his vid

hadn't been following the minutiae of the thread.

@Numistacker, you're wrong!

Damn right  thank you 

[Guest]

sorry mate, didn't mean to leave you out. only that I'd just finished watching his vid[emoji3]

hadn't been following the minutiae of the thread.

[mention=378]Numistacker[/mention], you're wrong![emoji3]

 

My apologies[mention=144]kman[/mention] you were certainly there with the BU camp and I should have said a minority were going for BU as it was certainly more than just me ))

[Kman]

Just now, Numistacker said:

 

My apologies[mention=144]kman[/mention] you were certainly there with the BU camp and I should have said a minority were going for BU as it was certainly more than just me ))

Yes thank you

To be fair you had a lot more conviction buying 3 straight away

I waited to see what everyone else thought and how fast it would sell out at the mint knowing I could buy from Chards should it go quickly

Those were the green light signals that made me buy even with being unhappy with the price. 

 

[Kman]

1 minute ago, shortstack68 said:

The price is high for all 3 coins however you look at it, NONE are forced to be winners, everything is just speculation, but haven't see any BU sales yet, only the piedfort.

Still a long way to go..........

Two today@ BIN

£795 - http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2017-Anniversary-Strike-On-The-Day-Plain-Edge-Gold-Pistrucci-Sovereign-/162584291644?hash=item25dac7693c:g:4wcAAOSwi1tZYdSs

£765 - http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/The-Sovereign-2017-Strike-on-the-Day-Anniversary-Piece-Gold-UK-Boxed-COA-/263076432858?hash=item3d4093cbda:g:ZE4AAOSwhgJZX18n

[KDave]

Take what I say here with a pinch of salt given my tendency to miss the boat frequently, having poor market timing generally and not knowing much about numismatics compared to the rest of the fine members of this forum.

I saw these early thanks to numistacker and a couple of others on here and had similar thoughts as you Steve; gimmick, RM milking the design (it is a great design though there should be more of it around), oh yes and the BU label again, here we go I thought; over priced bullion. The BU label to me means bullion, but actually since seeing the BU 'proof like' finishes on a few members videos, they do actually look like proofs which is very positive, and they look like lovely coins. But I am still not sure what to make of where they fit or if they are going to keep the premiums they have gained in a few years. I think it more likely the actual proof version will set the value for these in the years to come, despite its higher mintage, based purely on the fact that if one wants the best of the design why chose second best with BU proof like, odd thickness or unfinished edge milling? Perhaps the tiny mintages and the oddity of them will make them more valuable to collectors? I am not confident. 

I think the small differences of these coins were just the RM's excuse to say 'this one is different from the proof we made last year despite everything else appearing the same', and thus they increase the mintage of the design to cash in - without actually increasing the mintage of the earlier proof. Its good if you bought one just for your own collection, if you missed the original proof these were a god send, but as a speculative buy for the future?

I do not think the missing milling, double thickness and the like have added any value beyond what the original proof had, which was the design. In fact I think the BU label and odd size will be factors that work against these and I can see the price of the proof sovereign version leading the value on these in the future. If you were new to collecting would you really want a BU proof like with unfinished edge milling? Or would you want the proof finished one that is finished like the others in your collection? 

[Kman]

Just now, shortstack68 said:

Price coming down already lol

Down from what  the 765 sold first and they're just BIN prices 

[augur]

3 minutes ago, Kman said:

Down from what  the 765 sold first and they're just BIN prices 

The proof initially sold at this level but now below £800 not to get. While the BU cost more and at the moment sells below the proof.

Well, early days. Starting to live in a sovereign bubble 

[Kman]

3 minutes ago, KDave said:

Or would you want the proof finished one that is finished like the others in your collection? 

Very reasonable points KDave.

I think people want rarity 

Having a special design sovereign only 1817 people are going to have does feel rare and special

I wouldn't be shocked if it went on to do better than the proof, I somewhat expect it to

Worst case scenario it will just hold it's value, but I think that's very unlikely and as a worst case scenario, not so bad hehe