Stolen Coins - Help!

[Paul]

27 minutes ago, CazLikesCoins said:

Safe deposit box insurance. It does get a bit silly safeguarding the safeguards but better than the nicknacks going walkies.  

 

My little gripe with safe deposit box is paying insurance on top.

It's like saying. We are safe  but we ain't that safe.

Each box should be just £100,000 insured by default and factored into your price

Rant over.still happier someone else will have a gun to their head over mine with a break in at home 

Edited May 1, 2023 by Paul

[CazLikesCoins]

3 hours ago, flyingveepixie said:

I do have several crossbows and a multitude of other collectable pointy and extremely sharp edged items of a certain type here at home which any burglars would find most inconvenient to be confronted with..🤔 The whole family is also well practiced in their usage...

You'll be ok if you look like Arnie and have the same kit. Just don't forget to take your PJs off or it'll spoil the image  

 

[CazLikesCoins]

9 minutes ago, Paul said:

My little gripe with safe deposit box is paying insurance on top.

It's like saying. We are safe be be ain't that safe.

Each box should be just £100,000k insured by default and factored into your price

Rant over.still happier someone else will have a gun to their head over mine with a break in at home 

I believe a few places offer built in insurance. Bit more expensive but reasonable. 

[GoodAsGold]

On 30/04/2023 at 19:29, TheShinyStuff said:

Exactly this. I got one a few months ago and sleep much, much better knowing that I don't have much more than a few hundred quid worth of silver at home, all the good stuff is safe and sound. Probably the best £200 I've spent...

Hmm. However if your Safe Deposit Box Facility is located where I used to store my coins in Glasgow then that would be in the constituency of the MSP Nicola Sturgeon.  Should Police Scotland make enquiries regarding her and/or her husband there, then they can instruct that locus to open up whatever boxes they choose (assisted by a locksmith if necessary). I wouldn’t lose too much sleep over it though, unless the Police notice a box belongs to a Mr TheShinyStuff 😁

[GoodAsGold]

On 30/04/2023 at 23:18, DrKarlMoneys said:

Unfortunately safety deposit boxes aren't as fool proof as they should be-there have been cases in the UK of contents going missing and the bank shrugging their shoulders.

Then there's incompetence on the part of the bank.

Simples. Don’t use bank boxes. Banks are becoming more scarce on High Streets all over the UK. Private companies offer safe deposit boxes which require opening by the company key along with your own key. With ample but thorough research it’s not too difficult to source a company that meets your requirements. You may have to be prepared to travel beyond your normal area though, which is a small price to pay for peace of mind.

Just stay alert when approaching and exiting the premises though. You may be being watched. There’s a bus shelter outside my present facility and I just stroll up a few minutes before my appointment and pretend I’m waiting for a bus whilst I scan my surroundings. 14 years in Police surveillance taught me a trick or two and I know a lot of the local scallies 😉

[GoodAsGold]

On 30/04/2023 at 19:42, CazLikesCoins said:

It's also a bit of a day out  Take a flask wait your turn and marvel at your stack big or small. Just don't talk to it. The staff will think you're potty  

At the end of the day, i.e. the end of your appointment, you either have to take your coins home with you, or say goodbye and give them a hug until next time. It removes some of the fun of collecting gold coins when you can’t stroke them or read them bedtime stories every night.

[pricha]

Special delivery if no answer will be returned to the office . And second and third attempt will be made unless requested by customer.  On 2nd and 3rd attempt 1pm delivery is not guaranteed 

[TheShinyStuff]

6 hours ago, GoodAsGold said:

Hmm. However if your Safe Deposit Box Facility is located where I used to store my coins in Glasgow then that would be in the constituency of the MSP Nicola Sturgeon.  Should Police Scotland make enquiries regarding her and/or her husband there, then they can instruct that locus to open up whatever boxes they choose (assisted by a locksmith if necessary). I wouldn’t lose too much sleep over it though, unless the Police notice a box belongs to a Mr TheShinyStuff 😁

True, but the same could be said of any facility. I've nothing to hide from the law...

[timsk]

6 hours ago, GoodAsGold said:

. . . 14 years in Police surveillance taught me a trick or two and I know a lot of the local scallies 😉

Hi GAG,

You sound as if you might be able to offer some insight into the criminal mind, specifically burglars. My assumption is that burglars breaking into my home will fall into one of the following two categories:

A) They don't know that I'm a stacker/collector of PMs and target my house based on other criteria and are speculating that they'll find items of value to pinch such as TV, computer, tablet, and phone etc. They are not going to do a thorough and detailed search of the property because that takes time (which adds to their risk). Besides which, they don't know that they'll find anything anyway.

B)) They do know that I'm a stacker/collector of PMs and assume that I keep them at the property and will be looking for a safe, loose floorboards under carpets, large freezers, concealed bottoms of drawers etc., etc. What they may well find is empty boxes and packaging (no room for all of that in a SD box!) - but no coins. However, they will have confirmation that I have PMs somewhere.

If I'm correct about these two assumptions then, in my eyes, the only reason to have a SD box is to make a third assumption. . .

That criminals are watching my property and are waiting for obvious signs that it is empty, whereupon they'll force entry and ransack the place. Finding only empty boxes and packaging, they'll conclude there aren't any coins on the premises and depart empty handed - never to return again. To me, this seems highly improbable - as there are much better targets than a small bit player like me. If I was a criminal, I'd target someone who is likely to have a lot of PMs, such as the owner of one of the big YouTube channels. If I'm the target, they will be frustrated at finding nothing but boxes and, just as likely IMO, try to force me to hand over the PMs via the use of threats and violence.

To conclude, I'm not convinced that SD boxes are the right way forward. For me, that is: I'm not speaking for anyone else - each to their own!

Edited May 2, 2023 by timsk

[CazLikesCoins]

7 hours ago, GoodAsGold said:

At the end of the day, i.e. the end of your appointment, you either have to take your coins home with you, or say goodbye and give them a hug until next time. It removes some of the fun of collecting gold coins when you can’t stroke them or read them bedtime stories every night.

I suppose like having a pet dog, they're nice to have around but a lot less trouble when you stick them in kennels. Out of sight out of mind and if anyone asks me what I'm doing near a safe dep centre ..

 

[GoodAsGold]

On 02/05/2023 at 08:54, timsk said:

Hi GAG,

You sound as if you might be able to offer some insight into the criminal mind, specifically burglars. My assumption is that burglars breaking into my home will fall into one of the following two categories:

A) They don't know that I'm a stacker/collector of PMs and target my house based on other criteria and are speculating that they'll find items of value to pinch such as TV, computer, tablet, and phone etc. They are not going to do a thorough and detailed search of the property because that takes time (which adds to their risk). Besides which, they don't know that they'll find anything anyway.

B)) They do know that I'm a stacker/collector of PMs and assume that I keep them at the property and will be looking for a safe, loose floorboards under carpets, large freezers, concealed bottoms of drawers etc., etc. What they may well find is empty boxes and packaging (no room for all of that in a SD box!) - but no coins. However, they will have confirmation that I have PMs somewhere.

If I'm correct about these two assumptions then, in my eyes, the only reason to have a SD box is to make a third assumption. . .

That criminals are watching my property and are waiting for obvious signs that it is empty, whereupon they'll force entry and ransack the place. Finding only empty boxes and packaging, they'll conclude there aren't any coins on the premises and depart empty handed - never to return again. To me, this seems highly improbable - as there are much better targets than a small bit player like me. If I was a criminal, I'd target someone who is likely to have a lot of PMs, such as the owner of one of the big YouTube channels. If I'm the target, they will be frustrated at finding nothing but boxes and, just as likely IMO, try to force me to hand over the PMs via the use of threats and violence.

To conclude, I'm not convinced that SD boxes are the right way forward. For me, that is: I'm not speaking for anyone else - each to their own!

Hi timsk 

Thanks very much for your insight. I completely agree with all of your reasoning and respect why you choose not to use a safe deposit box. Each to their own, as you say. As for insight into the criminal mind I’m no expert. I was a civilian worker for the Police but I obviously amassed a lot of knowledge and intelligence over the years.

Your old fashioned burglar is an opportunist. He sees a key left inside the lock of a back door or a window left partially open and he decides whether to try and quietly force entry there and then, or to return in the small hours. In Scotland a lot of people don’t lock their doors when they’re at home both in the daytime and nighttime believe it or not, so the sneak thief can be in and out in seconds without the occupant realising, until they notice stuff has gone missing. They’ll target purses and wallets for cash and cards, along with mobile phones, cigarettes, alcohol and whatever’s conveniently lying around that takes their fancy. They don’t target properties which look too risky and they’d  rather have an easier target and easier time of it. If the perpetrator has a vehicle then he can operate further afield and hit several properties in one area before driving on to another. Those without transport prefer to burgle nearby properties and even neighbours in order not to be caught still out on the streets if Police resources can permit swift attendance. Properties backing onto parks and other open land are also targeted as the culprit can use paths and other short cuts to make good his escape where Police vehicles cannot go.

You’re probably well aware of modern day burglars. They usually operate in teams of 2,3 or 4 and their objective is to force entry into your property to obtain your car keys and drive off in the high performance vehicle which is parked up outside on show to all. They’ll stop at nothing and will use violence if they want to, in order to steal the vehicle by any means. Never leave your car keys in jacket pockets or ladies handbags downstairs overnight (assuming you live in a house) and don’t go down and open your front door if there’s a knock. Open a top floor window if you want to see who’s there, don’t assume there’s only one person and call the Police if you smell a rat. Better still, tell them that your partner isn’t happy with them being on your property and has just phoned the Police. I’m saying don’t do this and don’t do that but it’s just general advice and not specifically aimed at you of course. 

Suffice to say that the Police have ways and means of how they go about dealing with the above situations, depending on whether they are live incidents or not. As for our coin collections, I don’t believe anyone will specifically target our properties for our coins if nobody knows we collect coins in the first place. Due to the nature of our hobby and investments we can be just as cunning and furtive as your average criminal. Thanks for the chat @timsk 

 

 

 

[GoodAsGold]

On 02/05/2023 at 08:19, TheShinyStuff said:

True, but the same could be said of any facility. I've nothing to hide from the law...

I’m sure you haven’t. My comments were made in jest because you’re on Nicola Sturgeon’s doorstep so to speak. Please don’t take it personally.

[TheShinyStuff]

5 hours ago, GoodAsGold said:

I’m sure you haven’t. My comments were made in jest because you’re on Nicola Sturgeon’s doorstep so to speak. Please don’t take it personally.

Dont be daft, it was obviously a joke and it was taken with the humour it was delivered with. Just pointing out that unlike Ms Sturgeon and her party, I'm not worried about the police knocking on my door!!!

[InfernaRabies]

You can add PM's onto your contents insurance. You need to be accurate in what you have got and their value, but insurance companies will insure them, obviously for a fee. They will also insist on a safe for storage in your home and one that is suitable for what you intend to put in it. They go on the basis that if you can carry the safe into your house then someone can carry it out therefore must be fit for purpose. Found this way is cheaper than safety deposit boxes.

[GoodAsGold]

On 01/05/2023 at 19:41, Paul said:

My little gripe with safe deposit box is paying insurance on top.

It's like saying. We are safe  but we ain't that safe.

How very true Paul. I sometimes struggle with the same gripe.

[Silverlocks]

On 01/05/2023 at 19:41, CazLikesCoins said:

You'll be ok if you look like Arnie and have the same kit. Just don't forget to take your PJs off or it'll spoil the image  

I still say Rae Dawn Chong got the best line in that film -

 

[27carrots]

On 30/04/2023 at 23:18, DrKarlMoneys said:

Unfortunately safety deposit boxes aren't as fool proof as they should be-there have been cases in the UK of contents going missing and the bank shrugging their shoulders.

Then there's incompetence on the part of the bank.

Quote

A bank customer who claimed that Barclays had lost his safety deposit box containing £190,000 of family valuables has been arrested on suspicion of fraud.

Insurance boss Tahir Khan and two women, aged 22 and 30, were questioned.

The first one was trying to scam Barclays, lol.

[MonkeysUncle]

My shiny is scattered around a couple of properties and their grounds. I do not look flash, I do not wear flash clothes, drive flash cars or stand out in any way. I blend into the background so shiny pieces of gold are unlikely to be high on the list of things that could be robbed off of me.

I always have shiny delivered to my office, so if any rogue intercepts package and content they can't link shiny to the locations it's at. Unless they stalk me, but that's unlikely to work due to my past training and background. 

Keep shiny safe good folks.

[CazLikesCoins]

8 hours ago, MonkeysUncle said:

My shiny is scattered around a couple of properties and their grounds. I do not look flash, I do not wear flash clothes, drive flash cars or stand out in any way. I blend into the background so shiny pieces of gold are unlikely to be high on the list of things that could be robbed off of me.

I always have shiny delivered to my office, so if any rogue intercepts package and content they can't link shiny to the locations it's at. Unless they stalk me, but that's unlikely to work due to my past training and background. 

Keep shiny safe good folks.

Cue 19 of your friends metal detecting your garden when you're out 🤣 

[MonkeysUncle]

On 10/05/2023 at 07:57, CazLikesCoins said:

Cue 19 of your friends metal detecting your garden when you're out 🤣 

What friends? 🤣

[timsk]

Thanks everyone for your contributions to the thread!

👍

I thought I'd update you all with what's happened or, rather, what's not happened since I first made Royal Mint (RM) aware that a crime - albeit a small one in the grand scheme of things - has been committed.

In my last e-mail to RM on 15th May, I wrote this:

"Firstly, and most importantly, in both of your last two e-mails, you've made no mention of the result of the 'Postal Loss Investigation' into the theft of the 'Britannia 2023 UK Two-Coin Silver Proof Set'. Given that it's not just a loss, e.g. an 'accident', 'mishap' or 'one-of-those-things' but, rather, an actual crime, I'm keen to know what steps the Royal Mint are taking to investigate it? For example, it's reasonable to assume that the thief isn't a collector and wants to realise the value of the two-coin set asap. Therefore, s/he will almost certainly try and sell it, and the most likely place for them to do that is on eBay and/or social media sites. Assuming you have a record of the CoA number then, potentially, when the two-coin set is offered for sale, you and/or the Police will have the means to track and trace the criminals. Is any action along these lines being taken?" 

RM reply to me yesterday (31st May):

"As for the investigation we actually have received the parcel back from the royal mail and have resent it to yourself re packaged. and you can track it here Delivery Tracker. can you please confirm if you received the The Britannia 2023 UK Two-Coin Silver Proof Set?"

It's pretty clear to me that beyond doing their bit for the environment and recycling the packaging, the RM isn't in the least bit interested in pursuing this matter. The thief will not only get away with it and keep their job at the Royal Mail but, likely as not, know that no one will look into small crimes like this and will be emboldened to do the same thing again. And again.

I have received the replacement set mentioned in RM's reply, which surprised me as in earlier correspondence they told me there wasn't a spare set to be had and would refund me the cost. They also told me right from the time I reported the theft that they'd earmark my account such that all future parcels are sent by their alternative carrier, i.e. not Royal Mail. I've received two deliveries since then and, guess what, both came via Royal Mail! The first one I was away on holiday and filled out the online forms to have the parcel delivered to my neighbor. This didn't happen, they (Royal Mail) signed for the parcel themselves and left it on my front door step. Grrrrr! The second parcel (the replacement two coin set) was again left on the front door step, even though the front door was wide open and a tradesman's van was parked in the driveway. It was very obvious that someone was home - but they didn't ring the doorbell. I accept completely that these are issues with Royal Mail and not RM but, if RM had used their alternative carrier then perhaps they wouldn't have arisen in the first place.

Anyway, to conclude, I'm not out of pocket and I have the coins I wanted. Additionally, as a gesture of goodwill for the inconvenience, RM have offered free shipping on my next order and a free Brilliant Uncirculated coin of my choice. Who knows when that will come; I'm still waiting for the Coronation coins I ordered on 24th April - still no sign of those! 

[JamesH]

47 minutes ago, timsk said:

RM have offered free shipping on my next order and a free Brilliant Uncirculated coin of my choice

I mean, technically, the SOTD sovereign was sold as BU…

[timsk]

1 hour ago, JamesH said:

I mean, technically, the SOTD sovereign was sold as BU…

Doh! - wish I'd thought of that, James!

Instead, I went for The Coronation of His Majesty King Charles III 2023 UK £5 Brilliant Uncirculated Coin which, to be fair to Royal Mint, is a nice gesture of goodwill, IMO.