Help sought on authenticating 2021 1oz Australian Kangaroo Silver Dollar

[Degaree]

Hi all,

I'm new to these forums, so please forgive any potential newb faux pas.

I have just taken ownership of a 2021 Australian kangaroo silver dollar; however, I have some concerns over its authenticity.

I have conducted some tests; however, the results appear to be contradictory, so if any seasoned experts could provide their thoughts it would be much appreciated.

All details as follows:

• Bought from eBay, along with 2 x 2021 Canadian maples that appear to be real (micro-engraved maple leaf, weight, dimensions etc. all check out) from a seller with perfect feedback history
• Coin received in an Atkinsons Bullion & Coins sleeve
• Diameter = 40.54mm
• Width = 2.86mm
• Weight = 31.45g
• Specific gravity = 10.483
• Micro-engraved "A" = not present
• Sound when dinged is duller than I'd expect from silver

What really confuses me here is that the specific gravity is spot on and I was under the impression that this couldn't be faked. I believe the dimensions are also within the tolerable limits. I've emailed the Perth Mint to see if it's possible that any coins could have been released without the micro-engraved "A".

My immediate thought was to contact the eBay seller and request a refund; however, again, the specific gravity made me pause to take stock...

Any guidance here will be much appreciated.

Many thanks in advance!

[SilverStorm]

I know you are asking about the kangaroo, but I thought I would chime in on the Canadian maple leafs first.   As you may already know, the silver maples have enhanced security features such as the Royal Canadian Mint's patented bullion DNA.  This means that each 1 oz coin contains a unique privy mark with a micro-engraving of the year it was released, which is only visible under magnification.    So if you get a powerful magnifying glass, you will see a "21" inside the micro-engraving (as your maples are 2021).   That should help determine the authencity of the maples.

For the 2021 Australian Kangaroo silver dollar, the description is as follows:

 

Description:

As the silver counterpart to the immensely popular Kangaroo gold coin, the Kangaroo silver rendition enjoys a highly liquid market due to its upgraded, 9999 purity, lower premiums, and design. The unique feature of the Silver kangaroo series is that it follows a consistent design every year. The classic design allows investors to enjoy lower premiums without sacrificing design and quality. With the Kangaroo, the mint has upheld its excellent minting standards in the process of creating an immensely popular bullion coin, which has gone on to sell over 26 million ounces. The coin has upgraded security features, such as micro-engraved letters that are only visible under magnification, ensuring quick authenticity when the need arises. The 2021 edition of the Australian Kangaroo is now available from us at the lowest price online!

The reverse side features the adapted design of the Australian copper penny, minted from 1938 until 1946. A red kangaroo is illustrated, centered hopping across the Australian horizon with skillful texturing applied to the marsupial, allowing for excellent detail. The field is made specular, complete with a field of light refracting radial lines in a wave pattern that mimics the sun, the waves extending to the coin's rim, encapsulating the image. The coin's title serves as the legend, with the year of issue, metal weight, and purity all contained in the lower half.

The obverse displays Jody Clarke's modernized effigy of Queen Elizabeth II. The coin's observer can appreciate subtle details, such as the tasteful texturing to the Queen's blouse hair and Royal Crown, in addition to the contrast in the frosted and matte parts of the coin. The tasteful wave-patterned outer rim is applied to the obverse, with the coin field left blank. The subtle detailing of this coin is what makes it a staple of any stack!

In the relatively short minting span that the Kangaroo silver coin has enjoyed, it has gone on to establish itself as a recognized, respected, and liquid investment, Add this 1 oz 2021 Australian Kangaroo Silver Coin to your holdings today!

 

The specifications are as follows:

Country	Australia
Manufacturer	Perth Mint
Condition	Brilliant uncirculated
Purity	9999
Obverse	Jody Clark's latest effigy of Queen Elizabeth II and the words "Elizabeth II Australia 2021 1 Dollar" and the artist's initials
Reverse	A red Kangaroo leaping through the Australian outback.
First Released	2016
Diameter (mm)	40.6
Average Thickness (mm)	3.2
Legal Tender	AUD 1
Designer	Jody Clark (obverse)
Metal Weight (ozt)	1.0000

 

My thoughts:

Your measurements of 31.45 g is equal to 1.0111 troy ounce.   This is acceptable IMHO, which is very close to 1 ozt.  Variance could be due to scale sensitivity or not adjusted properly.   Actual diameter of the coin should be 40.6 mm, you have 40.54 mm.  Again very close, I would recommend you re-measure to confirm with a digital caliper.   The fact that the diameter is slightly under actual is surprising.   Actual thickness of coin is 3.2 mm, you measured 2.86 mm.   That is a red flag to me, it's off more than I would have liked.   

I would recommend you do additional testing, such as the magnetic slide test and the ice melt test.   If either of these tests fail, then you may have a fake.  Alternatively, bring your Roo coin to a reputable coin dealer and have them test it to confirm authenticity.   

My gut feeling based on the information you've provided (and my quick analysis), I feel it might be a fake.   I don't like the fact that the thickness of the coin is off.  But I could be wrong, so don't take my word as gospel.  Ideally, I would like to use my Sigma Metalytics PMV to test your coin before I offer any definitive conclusion.

On a side note, it is said that specific gravity can be faked.   For pure silver, the way they would fake this is by mixing lead and tin.  For gold, they would use tungsten.  So the fact that your silver's specific gravity is bang on at 10.49, it doesn't mean it truly is pure silver.   You can't accept specific gravity at face value, you need to include other testing measures to validate.

Hopefully other members here will chime in and offer their thoughts on what they think.   

Link to info on specific gravity can be faked: A Guide to Testing Gold, Silver and Fakes - Ultrasound Gold and Silver Testing (testyourgold.com)

Link to various silver testing methods: 16 Tests to Spot Fake Silver Coins - Silver Monthly

 

Edited June 3, 2021 by SilverStorm

[Degaree]

Thank you @SilverStorm for your carefully considered response... Very informative and helpful indeed!

I actually didn't know about the micro-engraved year within the maple leaf, so I'll take a look at that also.

Thanks again!

[SilverStorm]

3 hours ago, Degaree said:

Thank you @SilverStorm for your carefully considered response... Very informative and helpful indeed!

I actually didn't know about the micro-engraved year within the maple leaf, so I'll take a look at that also.

Thanks again!

You're welcome!   Let us know if you got any other questions.

[HawkHybrid]

On 02/06/2021 at 10:30, Degaree said:

Micro-engraved "A" = not present

 

I'd be tempted to say that it is more likely to be real if it wasn't for the above.

most fakes make money on the melt value. as such they substitute a cheaper metal to replace the silver.

this metal is usually less dense eg copper. this means fake coins usually require more volume to obtain

the correct weight. your measurements are of a smaller and thinner coin, whilst maintaining just above

the correct weight. this should be unusual for a fake?

I usually put more weighting in the specific gravity test than simple measurements.

 

high res photos of your exact coin might help.

 

HH

Edited June 3, 2021 by HawkHybrid

[LawrenceChard]

16 hours ago, SilverStorm said:

I would recommend you do additional testing, such as the magnetic slide test and the ice melt test.

 

...ice melt test?

I have only ever used that to detect breast enhancement. 🙂

[Degaree]

I’ve placed an order for a magnetic slide... However, the eBay seller seems genuinely shocked / apologetic and has offered a full refund, so I think on this occasion I’m just going to take her up on her offer...

[SilverStorm]

53 minutes ago, Degaree said:

I’ve placed an order for a magnetic slide... However, the eBay seller seems genuinely shocked / apologetic and has offered a full refund, so I think on this occasion I’m just going to take her up on her offer...

I'm glad you are able to get a refund.  It's better to have peace of mind than having a nagging doubt whether or not you have a fake.

My personal recommendation...buy from trusted and reputable precious metal dealers.  In general, any reliable precious metal dealer wants to be known for their honesty and reputation.  It's good for business.  If they start to scam people, they won't be in business for long.   Yes, the premiums they charge maybe higher, but you get the peace of mind it's not fake.   And for brick and mortar dealers, they would be willing to test the PM in front of you before you buy to confirm authenticity. 

Secondly, buy from reputable precious metal dealers that get their source directly from the mint or authorized wholesaler of the mint.   This way you know the metals you buy are authentic.   

Good luck!

Edited June 3, 2021 by SilverStorm

[Bondojoe]

I've had the same problem with a 2021 Australian Silver Dollar. If you look in the word KANGAROO, in the last A, in the very top, you will see an A. Could the mark have been moved...and no one has reported it? 

[LawrenceChard]

On 03/06/2021 at 02:33, SilverStorm said:

I know you are asking about the kangaroo, but I thought I would chime in on the Canadian maple leafs first.   As you may already know, the silver maples have enhanced security features such as the Royal Canadian Mint's patented bullion DNA.  This means that each 1 oz coin contains a unique privy mark with a micro-engraving of the year it was released, which is only visible under magnification.    So if you get a powerful magnifying glass, you will see a "21" inside the micro-engraving (as your maples are 2021).   That should help determine the authencity of the maples.

For the 2021 Australian Kangaroo silver dollar, the description is as follows:

 

Description:

As the silver counterpart to the immensely popular Kangaroo gold coin, the Kangaroo silver rendition enjoys a highly liquid market due to its upgraded, 9999 purity, lower premiums, and design. The unique feature of the Silver kangaroo series is that it follows a consistent design every year. The classic design allows investors to enjoy lower premiums without sacrificing design and quality. With the Kangaroo, the mint has upheld its excellent minting standards in the process of creating an immensely popular bullion coin, which has gone on to sell over 26 million ounces. The coin has upgraded security features, such as micro-engraved letters that are only visible under magnification, ensuring quick authenticity when the need arises. The 2021 edition of the Australian Kangaroo is now available from us at the lowest price online!

The reverse side features the adapted design of the Australian copper penny, minted from 1938 until 1946. A red kangaroo is illustrated, centered hopping across the Australian horizon with skillful texturing applied to the marsupial, allowing for excellent detail. The field is made specular, complete with a field of light refracting radial lines in a wave pattern that mimics the sun, the waves extending to the coin's rim, encapsulating the image. The coin's title serves as the legend, with the year of issue, metal weight, and purity all contained in the lower half.

The obverse displays Jody Clarke's modernized effigy of Queen Elizabeth II. The coin's observer can appreciate subtle details, such as the tasteful texturing to the Queen's blouse hair and Royal Crown, in addition to the contrast in the frosted and matte parts of the coin. The tasteful wave-patterned outer rim is applied to the obverse, with the coin field left blank. The subtle detailing of this coin is what makes it a staple of any stack!

In the relatively short minting span that the Kangaroo silver coin has enjoyed, it has gone on to establish itself as a recognized, respected, and liquid investment, Add this 1 oz 2021 Australian Kangaroo Silver Coin to your holdings today!

 

The specifications are as follows:

Country	Australia
Manufacturer	Perth Mint
Condition	Brilliant uncirculated
Purity	9999
Obverse	Jody Clark's latest effigy of Queen Elizabeth II and the words "Elizabeth II Australia 2021 1 Dollar" and the artist's initials
Reverse	A red Kangaroo leaping through the Australian outback.
First Released	2016
Diameter (mm)	40.6
Average Thickness (mm)	3.2
Legal Tender	AUD 1
Designer	Jody Clark (obverse)
Metal Weight (ozt)	1.0000

 

My thoughts:

Your measurements of 31.45 g is equal to 1.0111 troy ounce.   This is acceptable IMHO, which is very close to 1 ozt.  Variance could be due to scale sensitivity or not adjusted properly.   Actual diameter of the coin should be 40.6 mm, you have 40.54 mm.  Again very close, I would recommend you re-measure to confirm with a digital caliper.   The fact that the diameter is slightly under actual is surprising.   Actual thickness of coin is 3.2 mm, you measured 2.86 mm.   That is a red flag to me, it's off more than I would have liked.   

I would recommend you do additional testing, such as the magnetic slide test and the ice melt test.   If either of these tests fail, then you may have a fake.  Alternatively, bring your Roo coin to a reputable coin dealer and have them test it to confirm authenticity.   

My gut feeling based on the information you've provided (and my quick analysis), I feel it might be a fake.   I don't like the fact that the thickness of the coin is off.  But I could be wrong, so don't take my word as gospel.  Ideally, I would like to use my Sigma Metalytics PMV to test your coin before I offer any definitive conclusion.

On a side note, it is said that specific gravity can be faked.   For pure silver, the way they would fake this is by mixing lead and tin.  For gold, they would use tungsten.  So the fact that your silver's specific gravity is bang on at 10.49, it doesn't mean it truly is pure silver.   You can't accept specific gravity at face value, you need to include other testing measures to validate.

Hopefully other members here will chime in and offer their thoughts on what they think.   

Link to info on specific gravity can be faked: A Guide to Testing Gold, Silver and Fakes - Ultrasound Gold and Silver Testing (testyourgold.com)

Link to various silver testing methods: 16 Tests to Spot Fake Silver Coins - Silver Monthly

 

Very nice photos!

Could they be courtesy of @ChardsCoinandBullionDealer?

🙂

[CollectorNo1]

The fact that there is an abscence of a micro "A" under the Captial "A" in Australia..is a Red flag to me..

[SilverStorm]

On 04/08/2021 at 14:23, LawrenceChard said:

Very nice photos!

Could they be courtesy of @ChardsCoinandBullionDealer?

🙂

I downloaded those pics from SilverGoldBull.  Maybe SGB got them from you?  😵

[Fishface220]

On 04/08/2021 at 22:55, CollectorNo1 said:

The fact that there is an abscence of a micro "A" under the Captial "A" in Australia..is a Red flag to me..

the “A” has moved around thru the different years of release.

(Had me worried the first time I looked)

 

Edited August 7, 2021 by Fishface220

[LawrenceChard]

13 hours ago, SilverStorm said:

I downloaded those pics from SilverGoldBull.  Maybe SGB got them from you?  😵

Thanks. I didn't get round to checking yet, but many dealers do use our copyright images without our consent.

I just looked, and our photos were even better!

https://www.chards.co.uk/2021-silver-kangaroo-1-ounce-australian-bullion-coin/13079

🙂

Edited August 7, 2021 by LawrenceChard

[CollectorNo1]

Going back to @Degaree You stated those photos you put on the site are not of the actual Roo you have purchased? Can you upload an actual photo of your coin? I looked at Chards Roo on their website and you can see under zoom the security micro feature of the small "A" on the second A in "Kangaroo" I know the position of the security feature does change and can appear on any of the 5 A's...if that is missing on yours I would assume its a fake... Have you had it tested yet??