Info about gold medal

[Gildeon]

Just won this in an auction. It says 3.26 gr and it's probably a modern restrike of an old Sicilian coin. Don't know much more yet, so any info would be appreciated.

 

[CollectForFun]

I can just tell you that this seems to be the original coin based on which yours was designed.

[Gildeon]

One more try to get more information about this. I want to put it for sale but not sure about the gold percentage. I got it from a big auction house, so I feel quite confident about its authenticity, but not easy to sell without knowing the grade. 🙄

[KevinFlynn]

Look down this page for another example of an original coin.

 

[Gildeon]

5 minutes ago, KevinFlynn said:

Look down this page for another example of an original coin.

 

Thanks but I am mostly looking for info about the restrikes. 🧐

[Arganto]

"Charles the Emperor"

"King of Sicily"

Charles V Holy Roman Emperor, which matches with the 1 Tari silver coin linked to above. Finding this particular coin/medal is proving extremely difficult though 👀

What's the 1967 about I wonder? Have you tested it to ascertain the metal @Gildeon?

[Arganto]

I wonder if @LawrenceChard may have an idea where to look?

 

[Gildeon]

10 hours ago, Liam84 said:

"Charles the Emperor"

"King of Sicily"

Charles V Holy Roman Emperor, which matches with the 1 Tari silver coin linked to above. Finding this particular coin/medal is proving extremely difficult though 👀

What's the 1967 about I wonder? Have you tested it to ascertain the metal @Gildeon?

The 1967 is the year of the restrike I suppose. Haven't tested it, since it was bought for around 200€, and I don't have any cheap way to do it here. And the fact it was bought from a big auction house makes me not to worry really. But before I sell it, I would like to provide the potential buyers with as much info as possible.

[CollectForFun]

I wouldn't call it a restrike, but rather replica. And just bear in mind that many replica coins like this are produced from 14k or 22k gold, rather than pure gold. What info did you get from the auction listing? Did it just say a "gold coin"?

BTW did you check this source for potential info?

Edited August 21, 2021 by CollectForFun

[Arganto]

2 minutes ago, CollectForFun said:

I wouldn't call it a restrike, but rather replica. And just bear in mind that many replica coins like this are produced from 14k or 22k gold, rather than pure gold. What info did you get from the auction listing? Did it just say a "gold coin"?

Good point, as the coin it was based on was likely hammered. If it is based on the Tari the design is different, so maybe it's a commemorative/tribute coin.

I've been trying to find companies that create such things but not had much success.

[Gildeon]

This is the page from the auction:

 

[Gildeon]

9 minutes ago, CollectForFun said:

I wouldn't call it a restrike, but rather replica. And just bear in mind that many replica coins like this are produced from 14k or 22k gold, rather than pure gold. What info did you get from the auction listing? Did it just say a "gold coin"?

BTW did you check this source for potential info?

Yes, that's the one, thank you. Page has a subscription though... 🤔

[Arganto]

I've burned a hole in Duckduckgo looking for another or a manufacturer but no joy. Not sure why I had a bug in the butt for this but once I started looking I just kept going 🤣

If it is pure gold and it was bought for a ~24% premium over spot (based on today's spot, it may have been different when you bought the coin) I'd would hazard a guess that would be about the limit for profitability. Assuming it is a modern replica and provenance is hard to come by of course. Then again it could be part of a series that someone really wants to complete and they may be willing to pay a premium to do so?

Good luck with the sale, and if you do find out more about it let us know. It will provide some closure for me 🤣

[LawrenceChard]

On 12/05/2021 at 08:41, Gildeon said:

Just won this in an auction. It says 3.26 gr and it's probably a modern restrike of an old Sicilian coin. Don't know much more yet, so any info would be appreciated.

 

Having been tagged into this by @Liam84:

First to the OP @Gildeon When requesting information, it is always best to include as much information as you already know, and also to phrase your question more exactly, rather than have to clarify and correct it later.

Like most of the other TSF members who have responded, I too started with a Google search.

In my case I searched for:

REX SICILIE CAROLVS IMPERAT 1967

The first result I found was: https://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/imperat-carolvs-coin-rex-sicilie-1967-464035933

which @CollectForFun also found.

WorthPoint quotes: Source eBay UK

So I looked on ebay, but failed to find your auction.

Later in the thread, I noticed you said "And the fact it was bought from a big auction house..." I thought, WTF didn't you mention that to start with, name the auction house, and include a like to it, so that anybody trying to help you could quickly see and know as much as you already do or did.

While I am at it, and being my usual, slightly pedantic self, you started off with "Just won this in an auction". I would say you bought it in an auction, rather than you won it. "Win/won is a bit of soft but pervasive and insidious propaganda that ebay like to promote. Psychologically everyone likes to win, but not everybody wants to be reminded that they spent money. It is another example of the mind games which big multinational corporations like use to manipulate and enslave the plebs.

@CollectForFun also found the link to the Silver 1 Tari - Carlo V on Numista, which was a good start, but of course, I was looking for a gold coin, which @KevinFlynn also found, a Mezzo trionfo d'oro, on CoinGallery.de. That coin weighs 1.72 grams, yours "says 3.26 gr", so it sounds like yours is a (full) trionfo d'oro.

After this, I noticed that your original post was back in August, and you only got 1 answer, then 3 months later, you posted "One more try to get more information about this." which made it sound like you were irritated, annoyed, or disppointed that your question had not been answered to your complete satisfaction. If TSF featured on any feedbacl sites like TrustPilot, you could have given it a 1 star rating, and said 3 months later and I have still not found out what I wanted to know!

Having got a second link, you then said "Thanks but I am mostly looking for info about the restrikes.", which you could and should of course have stated in the first place. Another point, which @CollectForFun correctly pointed out, is that it is not a restrike, but would be better described as a replica. See this page I published probably over 20 years ago: https://24carat.co.uk/frame.php?url=restrikes.html .

Eventually, you posted a partial screenshot from the auction catalogue, from which we can see it was lot # 942, and the item was described as "moderne goldmed..." (German for gold medal or medallion), but still failed to name the auction house, or to post a link to the actual result. I did manage to find what looks your auction on lot-art.com, but by this time, was losing the will to live, so gave up, apart from noting that it seemed to be from a Hamburg auction site, but this may be wrong. I'm almost past caring.

I also noted that Liam84 used DuckDuckGo.com, which I also use occasionally, but only when I am looking for ways to assassinate Rob Halliday-Stein, or tunnel into the Royal Mint. (I am joking).

Really!

I note that the WorthPoint link says "in mint condition comes with attractive blue case". I know you said this site requires a subscription, but there is a big button which inites you to "START FREE TRIAL"  Have you thought about doin that? I have not checked, but I guess you can cancel before the one month free trial period ends. If you looked whose blue box it was, that might tell you who marketed it.

I also note you are in Ireland. If you are anywhere near GoldCore in Dublin, you could try asking them for an opinion, but I suspect they know F.A. about coins. If not, there are seom actual real coin dealers in Ireland you could try.

One of yout posts says " but not easy to sell without knowing the grade."

I have some very clever, high tech, technology when it comes to assessing the grade of a coin. The main input devices are called eyes, and I have two of them. This passes data to the main processing unit, called a brain. I only have one of these, but have found it very effective when in use. Looking at the images on your auction catalogue screenshot, it looks to be in more or less mint condition, which is what I would expect from a modern replica, which will not ever have been in circulation. 

The thought occurs to me, and probably to others, that you could have checked with your source what the gold alloy fineness was, or the grade, but I also used my clever, high tech, technology, and scanning the auction catalogue screenshot, I saw "vz-st".

During my many years, I have learnt a tiny smatteriing of German, so I Googled "vz-st german coin auction grade", and found an Emporium Hamburg page https://www.emporium-numismatics.com/PCGS-NGC/Grading-Scale which includes: "

AU                                50, 53, 55, 58                About Uncirculated

german: Vorzüglich bis Stempelglanz (vz-st)"

Achim Becker founded Emporium Hamburg a long time ago, so it may be EH who originally marketed this replica, but ultimately it is probably not highly relevant.

The information you are probably hoping for is how much it is worth. The makers or promoters of gold replica coins uusually ask at least double their intrinsic value, but on the secondary market, most jewellers would offer you scrap value for it, after filing the edge and acid testing it (this would probably be between 50% to 75% of its intrinsic value). A coin dealer might pay you more, perhaps 70% to 90% of intrinsic. If we owned it, we would probably ask 10% premium for it, and if it had not sold in a few years time, then we might scrap it. The cost to photograph it, describe it, and market it, would probably be more than our profit on it, but we take a long term view of many things.

I guess there will be some, most, or all, of the above which you didn't want to hear, but you got it all anyway, free of charge. 🙂

 

 

 

[Arganto]

4 minutes ago, LawrenceChard said:

but only when I am looking for ways to assassinate Rob Halliday-Stein, or tunnel into the Royal Mint. (I am joking).

Ensure your VPN has you located somewhere unusual and scary and is peeking at the world via TOR. Ahem.

Excellent eyes picking up the German grading note and subsequent information. I totally missed that 😁

[Gildeon]

@LawrenceChardthank you for the wealth of information. 🧐 Some great points in your post, that I will try to keep in mind in the future.

The medal was bought from Emporium Hamburg auction and the link is here https://www.biddr.com/auctions/emporiumhamburg/browse?a=1699&l=1838753

I hope that helps. I would mainly like to have some more info about gold %, so I can create a pretty accurate sales description.

[LawrenceChard]

20 minutes ago, Gildeon said:

@LawrenceChardthank you for the wealth of information. 🧐 Some great points in your post, that I will try to keep in mind in the future.

The medal was bought from Emporium Hamburg auction and the link is here https://www.biddr.com/auctions/emporiumhamburg/browse?a=1699&l=1838753

I hope that helps. I would mainly like to have some more info about gold %, so I can create a pretty accurate sales description.

Thanks for taking my points positively.

As I think I already said, try Emporium Hamburg, to see if they can or will tell you the gold fineness. Of course, they may nor know, otherwise they may have included it in the item description, but you never know, it's worth asking them.