Ordered gold from UK to Ireland and was hit with VAT!

[Gildeon]

I haven't been active in the last few years, as my attention had moved to other things. Now I am getting back into the coins world and one of my first stops was to get back here. The forum has always been a good source of information for me, and I have bought and sold a lot of stuff in here. But that was in the pre-Brexit time... 🙄

I was interested in a couple of silver bars but other members informed me that silver would be charged with VAT when going through customs. So I gave up on that and looked at gold. I ordered a half sovereign from the Royal Mint and today I got notification from the post that I was charged with 23% VAT and they had also valued the item about 30% more than I had paid! My impression was that investment gold shouldn't be charged with VAT. I just sent an email to Royal Mint to ask about all this.

If this is the case, it makes purchasing or selling anything to and from UK untenable, at least for me. I would like to hear other opinions and see if I am missing something. 🤔

 

[BackyardBullion]

3 minutes ago, Gildeon said:

I haven't been active in the last few years, as my attention had moved to other things. Now I am getting back into the coins world and one of my first stops was to get back here. The forum has always been a good source of information for me, and I have bought and sold a lot of stuff in here. But that was in the pre-Brexit time... 🙄

I was interested in a couple of silver bars but other members informed me that silver would be charged with VAT when going through customs. So I gave up on that and looked at gold. I ordered a half sovereign from the Royal Mint and today I got notification from the post that I was charged with 23% VAT and they had also valued the item about 30% more than I had paid! My impression was that investment gold shouldn't be charged with VAT. I just sent an email to Royal Mint to ask about all this.

If this is the case, it makes purchasing or selling anything to and from UK untenable, at least for me. I would like to hear other opinions and see if I am missing something. 🤔

 

I think you will be able to sucessfully challenge this.

You might have a lengthy battle with the ROI customs department, but it is possible. 

[Cornishfarmer]

Do you have the option of not excepting it then will get sent back to the royal mint and you’ll get money back

[Darr3nG]

https://www.revenue.ie/en/vat/vat-rates/search-vat-rates/I/investment-gold-coin-bar-or-wafer-supply-of-investment-gold-.aspx

 

I suppose it's down to what the Irish Revenue class as "investment gold", but you can request a refund/repayment here:

https://www.revenue.ie/en/vat/repayments-to-unregistered-persons/investment-gold/index.aspx

[BackyardBullion]

I would not be surprised if the Royal Mint have made a boo boo and put the incorrect customs code on the package. Seems like a very Them thing to do. 

[AOB]

Just now, BackyardBullion said:

I would not be surprised if the Royal Mint have made a boo boo and put the incorrect customs code on the package. Seems like a very Them thing to do. 

I would suspect your right there BYB..

@Gildeon if you don’t get anywhere on the VAT issues. Your best bet would be to use a northern address or a UK-ROI courier service and you won’t be hit with any VAT/Custom charges.

I hope you get it sorted 👍🏽 

[Gildeon]

Thank you for all your replies and suggestions. I will try to reply to everything in one go:

1. For some strange reason my order does not appear in the purchases in my Royal Mint account. I have only found it in the Transactions marked as "delivered". When I sent a message through their form, it was also asking for customer number, which I couldn't locate. Not very happy with how the whole site works so far, but let's see if and what they reply...
2. If I can just send it back and get a refund I would be fine. But I had read that they don't accept returns in bullion, is this the case?
3. From the Irish post they gave me an email address to send all the details for my dispute. One issue is that I don't even have an invoice, I can't retrieve anything from my Royal Mont account! So I have to wait for their reply first.
4. However this finishes, I think that UK is out of reach for me, under the present circumstances. Which is a pity, because there is a very alive community over there and plenty of good deals. 😕

I will keep updating here with any news.

[BackyardBullion]

5 minutes ago, Gildeon said:

Thank you for all your replies and suggestions. I will try to reply to everything in one go:

1. For some strange reason my order does not appear in the purchases in my Royal Mint account. I have only found it in the Transactions marked as "delivered". When I sent a message through their form, it was also asking for customer number, which I couldn't locate. Not very happy with how the whole site works so far, but let's see if and what they reply...
2. If I can just send it back and get a refund I would be fine. But I had read that they don't accept returns in bullion, is this the case?
3. From the Irish post they gave me an email address to send all the details for my dispute. One issue is that I don't even have an invoice, I can't retrieve anything from my Royal Mont account! So I have to wait for their reply first.
4. However this finishes, I think that UK is out of reach for me, under the present circumstances. Which is a pity, because there is a very alive community over there and plenty of good deals. 😕

I will keep updating here with any news.

Point 1: The Royal Mint's Website is absolutely usless. However, when you placed the order hopefully you had an order confirmation email?

Point 2: You are correct, they wont accept a return for bullion products

Point 3: If you need a formal invoice to help your claim then get in touch with customer services and they should give you one, by law they have to. 

Point 4: I have shipped gold to Ireland without issue. When declared correctly with the right customs codes it works smoothly. Don't give up hope!

[Agaupl]

Another customs overstep.. becoming more common. 

[Gildeon]

Royal Mint just replied on how I can see my transaction history, so practically the only thing I could do already!

No response about the invoice I need or why I was charged VAT etc. I replied all this and waiting.. Now I just want to cancel the order and get my money back if possible. This hassle isn't worth it really...

 

[Gildeon]

https://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/2010/act/31/section/90/enacted/en/html

I found this describing "investment gold" and my sovereign definitely falls under this description.

(ii) gold coins which—
		(I) are of a purity equal to or greater than 900 parts per 1,000 parts,
		(II) are minted after 1800,
		(III) are or have been legal tender in their country of origin, and
		(IV) are normally sold at a price which does not exceed the open market value of the gold contained in the coins by more than 80 per cent.

[jultorsk]

Sovereigns and halfs are on the EU list of VAT exempt investment gold under HTS code 71189000.

https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=CELEX%3A52022XC1125(02)

If your parcel has not been released to you yet, do not pay the VAT, instead send the Irish post customer service a message outlining the above. They can sort it out with the customs. That's how it's done on the mainland at least. Good luck.

Edited March 20 by jultorsk

[MBTPSilver]

Unfortunately even with the correct codes customs and various couriers will get it wrong (either in honest error, or perhaps on purpose for additional fees). You will be better off where possible ordering from an EU-based dealer, and might get a better price than from RM anyway.

[SiCole]

I would check the commodity code they put on the export docs and reference it against what it needs to be. Hopefully you can rectify it with the importer.

[stackspot]

Why go to the Royal Mint for bullion gold? Surely Chards would be better for all that

[Gildeon]

4 minutes ago, stackspot said:

Why go to the Royal Mint for bullion gold? Surely Chards would be better for all that

I wanted the version in the card, I couldn't find it any dealer. And the problem with ordering from UK would probably remain.

[sixgun]

On 20/03/2024 at 14:10, SiCole said:

I would check the commodity code they put on the export docs and reference it against what it needs to be. Hopefully you can rectify it with the importer.

Royal Mint just exports gold and silver coins - surely they couldn't get the commodity code wrong - i mean how many of these codes are they using?

[DisplayName]

On 20/03/2024 at 12:47, Gildeon said:

https://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/2010/act/31/section/90/enacted/en/html

I found this describing "investment gold" and my sovereign definitely falls under this description.

(ii) gold coins which—
		(I) are of a purity equal to or greater than 900 parts per 1,000 parts,
		(II) are minted after 1800,
		(III) are or have been legal tender in their country of origin, and
		(IV) are normally sold at a price which does not exceed the open market value of the gold contained in the coins by more than 80 per cent.

Any updates on this perhaps? I was wondering this myself and it seemed logical that UK-IRL would be fine, yet stories like this make me quite anxious. Irish customs, in my experience, is extremely greedy and pretend to be quite slow in the mind when factually wrong. Very curious what they'll come up with in your case. Just pay man, Leo really needs these funds to go to the Mighty Hoopla Festival, he really does.

[Gildeon]

I sent an email (very detailed) about a week ago, to an address they gave me from customer service. Still waiting for response, but to be fair, there were many holidays this period.

[DisplayName]

Thanks for the update Gildeon. Fingers crossed that its solved soon. Surely is an off-putting story though and it makes me think twice before buying from the UK again.

[Gildeon]

Finally got a reply and the charges were removed! They kept 3.5€ for admin fee, but I am not complaining 😁

However I don't think I will be going through this again. For the moment UK is out of my reach for purchases... 😕

 

[DisplayName]

Very glad to hear the scam was mostly dropped! Should be €0 to pay with everything dropped right? Can't admin if there's nothing to admin.

[Gildeon]

1 minute ago, DisplayName said:

Very glad to hear the scam was mostly dropped! Should be €0 to pay with everything dropped right? Can't admin if there's nothing to admin.

At this point I am not even questioning the 3.5€! 😅

And to be fair it was the An Post support that did all the communication with Revenue, so I am fine with that.

[KitchenCollector]

Glad to hear you got this resolved.

[Gildeon]

And here is my first (and probably last...) order from the Royal mint.

On another note, do you know any European dealer that sells the carded versions of the RM products?