Cbdc arrival

[Bigmarc]

https://www.binance.com/en/news/flash/7572788 

This explains how far the digital yuan has got. 

[SidS]

Just a thought I've had for a while.

Let's say CBDCs come in and cash goes and gold and silver are regulated.

What is to stop people bartering other goods. For example in 2001 my parents inherited a mobility scooter from an elderly relative, they didn't need it. They did need a computer. In the ads section of a newspaper was an elderly couple who wished to dispose of a computer as they needed funds to purchase a mobility scooter (of all things). Now there's a coincidence of wants, so the trade was undertaken and both parties were happy.

What's to say other functional items purchased with CBDCs, say furniture or clothing might be wanted by another person who hadn't the credits to purchase those, but incidentally have other items they don't need, washers, fridges etc that another family do need?

Goods purchased can retain value (except electronic c**p which is programmed to have a short shelf life).

In a nutshell I believe barter will happen, maybe without gold or silver.

[danieldorkins]

Just finished watching this, a little long but worth it, some may have already seen this but for those that haven't:

 

[danieldorkins]

Ok, they may be doddering old gits (of which I am almost one of them!) but it's another take on CBCD's , admittedly a bit out of date, that no doubt the government and BofE will conveniently ignore.

https://www.parliament.uk/business/lords/media-centre/house-of-lords-media-notices/2022/january-2022/central-bank-digital-currencies-a-solution-in-search-of-a-problem/

[monkey]

52 minutes ago, danieldorkins said:

Ok, they may be doddering old gits (of which I am almost one of them!) but it's another take on CBCD's , admittedly a bit out of date, that no doubt the government and BofE will conveniently ignore.

https://www.parliament.uk/business/lords/media-centre/house-of-lords-media-notices/2022/january-2022/central-bank-digital-currencies-a-solution-in-search-of-a-problem/

Just makes me think of problem - reaction - solution. In order to roll out the plan you would need the solution before the problem is presented, only this time the solution has made its self known before the problem. Maybe the head management decided to shake things up a bit?

[SeverinDigsSovereigns]

2 minutes ago, monkey said:

Just makes me think of problem - reaction - solution. In order to roll out the plan you would need the solution before the problem is presented, only this time the solution has made its self known before the problem. Maybe the head management decided to shake things up a bit?

I think one of the driving argument is that, if others (the likes of China and EU) have it, we must have it too. The motive of said others having it could sometimes prove ulterior. 

[Bratnia]

CBDC for me will just be relatively little value "current account" money. Otherwise land/stock/gold larger value "notes" (currency units).

I mostly spend using credit card nowadays, and pay off the entire amount each month with a few weeks notice of the amount to be settled, so liquidate enough stock and/or gold into my current account to cover that (and other general monthly cash spending). Land/home along with gold (coins) have no counter-party risk, are literally physical and in-hand. Stocks have T+2 liquidation time, a couple/few days between being sold and the money being available in your account. Similar in some respects to in past times when you might have held a $10,000 dollar bill, along with perhaps three $1000 dollar bills, and a mixed number of smaller $100, $10 and $1 dollar bills.

A luxury cruise ship week holiday price of a combined 1 ounce gold coin, a single SPY ETF share ($420 recent price), and $40 in dollar bills cost each.  ... or 24 $100 dollar bills and 4 $1 bills, or otherwise around $2404 in whatever currency unit values you might otherwise prefer. Current account/CBDC sits at the lower end of that currency units set, more in the loose-change category.

[Bratnia]

On 28/05/2023 at 09:35, danieldorkins said:

Ok, they may be doddering old gits (of which I am almost one of them!) but it's another take on CBCD's , admittedly a bit out of date, that no doubt the government and BofE will conveniently ignore.

https://www.parliament.uk/business/lords/media-centre/house-of-lords-media-notices/2022/january-2022/central-bank-digital-currencies-a-solution-in-search-of-a-problem/

If one CBDC is heavily regulated/controlled then people in general may very well opt to hold/trade using another less regulated CBDC instead. British Pound Digital Currency for instance could see largescale migration over to US Dollar Digital Currency if the Pound Digital Currency was regulated in a manner that was 'inconvenient' compared to US Dollar Digital Currency. That is a additional risk factor for central banks, mass outflows/flight of 'money' due to political policy changes can have significant affects upon national financial stability.

Fundamentally whatever you pay for a item/service or are quoted as a 'price' is just a simple mathematical calculation matter in order to quote/pay in a range of alternative choices of currency units.

I guess that if generally adopted shops may start to add digital price tags to items rather than existing strips of paper hanging on a thread attached to the item with the price in US$, GB£, Euro's ... whatever printed on that tag. Maybe serving as dual purpose anti-theft/security tag attachment that is removed at the check-out, that also shows the price in whatever currency you want/prefer on your phone when you hold your phone next to that tag.

Much of Pounds nowadays is digital anyway already as many prefer to tap-to-pay (card payments) rather than handing over actual bank notes/coins.

[Bratnia]

The US dollar is one of few currencies that never expires. Older versions of Pounds for instance had dates when they no longer remained valid. USD in contrast always remains valid, old or new versions are the same.

There's a large resilience in the US to a total transition over to CBDC, and also a claim that there is no need for such as debit/credit cards are already 'enough' digital currency in themselves. Total CBDC transition is just a privacy invasion thing, that the likes of the EU are progressing. In the absence of a domestic legal (paper) currency, so the tendency would be to adopt/use another currency, such as the USD.

With enough hacking (loss) and enforced controls (privacy invasion) so more will be inclined to reject CBDC in favour of alternatives. The EU's stance for instance is more inclined to lead to a outflow of capital, greater poverty, declining relatively more than others, but will entrap its population more into state controls which is likely the real agenda.

[Bratnia]

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/636557

Quote

We believe it is discriminatory to only accept card payments. The Government should require companies to take cash. Establishments are taking away our right to choose how we pay. Make it illegal to only accept electronic payments.

I've signed it

[EdwardTeach]

On 23/05/2023 at 18:22, monkey said:

If the coming CBDC's do have an expiry date put on them as predicted, then wouldn't that just make people with half a mind just put the purchasing power into precious metals or some other commodity that holds value? which then would push up the price of such items due to higher demand. But then there will be the controls on what you can spend your CBDC's on, probably preventing you from buying precious metals or restricting how much you can buy.

Only time will tell perhaps....

CBDCs are a 'programmable' currency so they can control your spending for certain specific items or services. This means they could allow transactions to work if you try to buy something such as a Netflix subscription but stop the transaction going through if you try to buy precious metals.

The programmable aspect of CBDCs means they will be able to control what you can spend your currency on, where you can spend it, and when you can spend it.

[Nik]

Buy a cup of tea using the digital pound from the smart kettle.  

The digital pound | Bank of England

 

Programmed money.

Johnny's Cash and The Smart Money Nightmare (richplanet.net)

[Skyfiller]

11 hours ago, Nik said:

Buy a cup of tea using the digital pound from the smart kettle.  

The digital pound | Bank of England

 

Programmed money.

Johnny's Cash and The Smart Money Nightmare (richplanet.net)

So it does everything my bank account and card does at the moment except no interest on the account. Am I being dumb here, what am I missing? Why would anyone use it over their current card which is on my phone anyway. ???

[Bratnia]

1 hour ago, Skyfiller said:

So it does everything my bank account and card does at the moment except no interest on the account. Am I being dumb here, what am I missing? Why would anyone use it over their current card which is on my phone anyway. ???

They're worried about the competition, a stable coin (whatever) type digital wallet that can instantly/easily transfer funds from one wallet to another without having to go through banks, being adopted in preference over using domestic currency. If a majority of citizens switch away from using Pounds (Dollars/whatever) to instead using another common alternative currency that the state can't control then the domestic economy priced in Pounds/whatever is exposed to potentially massive downside risk. Bitcoin is too volatile for that, and it can't handle the transactions volumes, but other more constant/stable value alternatives might. By aligning the CBDC to the domestic fiat currency at least its value remains stable, in as much as the fiat currency is stable (they aren't). Classic fiat currency is volatile, that's eroded by taxation and inflation - tends to lose purchase power over time, so anything aligned to that is also a losing stance. Better IMO just to hold stocks and gold in a 'savings' account (brokerage) and sell/transfer some of that value to your regular spending account/phone as-and-when appropriate. Cash, CBDC are just for the funds you anticipate spending in the short term, maybe up to a months worth of spending. Prices in terms of stocks/gold is more volatile - but that does have the tendency to increase in purchase power over time rather than lose purchase power.

A main issue is that whilst they say CBDC wont replace notes/cash whilst there's continued demand/use of cash, they're inclined to make access/use of cash more difficult, kill it off, leaving only CBDC that the state can fully control. Prevent you from making certain transfers such as buying gold or Btc, or set personal/individual taxation rates - you have more than average, aren't spending it quick enough so your personal taxation rate is increased by 5% ...etc. Cash is a form/right of privacy, that they're looking to eliminate. Whatever alternatives there may be are inclined to be regulated out of existence/use, shops prevented from accepting anything other than the states own CBDC. As such, as you say, existing setups already do-the-job. I mostly buy on credit card, transfer funds from my savings account once/month to clear off the amount.

[Nik]

3 hours ago, Skyfiller said:

So it does everything my bank account and card does at the moment except no interest on the account. Am I being dumb here, what am I missing? Why would anyone use it over their current card which is on my phone anyway. ???

When at some point, replacing household items means all that is available is the smart variety, that will only work when connected to a smart wallet, we will have no choice, eventually.

Edited July 7, 2023 by Nik
comma

[Bigmarc]

5 hours ago, Skyfiller said:

So it does everything my bank account and card does at the moment except no interest on the account. Am I being dumb here, what am I missing? Why would anyone use it over their current card which is on my phone anyway. ???

Most only focus on the negatives, loads of tech being tried in south Korea to do with passports and driving licences. In china they have linked the wallet to students on campus and they swipe their wallets to gain access to different parts. 

I can imagine there will be a few incentives involved so wouldn't hurt ruining it along side your bank accounts.

[Nik]

Linked with biometrics it will be easy for financial penalties to be deducted.

[EdwardTeach]

10 hours ago, Skyfiller said:

So it does everything my bank account and card does at the moment except no interest on the account. Am I being dumb here, what am I missing? Why would anyone use it over their current card which is on my phone anyway. ???

No sane person would voluntarily choose to use a CBDC over their current digital currency but the powers that be will try and force you to use it using various incentive and threat methods. This is what they did in China and Nigeria when they introduced their CBDCs. Have some optimism for this situation though. In both China and Nigeria all of the people there are fiercely resisting using CBDCs despite the various incentive and threat methods their governments have used and CBDC adoption in both countries has been is extremely slow and is already stalling badly.

All we have to do to stop CBDCs from happening is for enough people to refuse to use them when buying things and refuse to accept them as payment if people try buy things from you. Just use any form of currency other than a CBDC when making or receiving payments.

 

Edited July 7, 2023 by EdwardTeach

[Bratnia]

18 hours ago, Bigmarc said:

Most only focus on the negatives, loads of tech being tried in south Korea to do with passports and driving licences. In china they have linked the wallet to students on campus and they swipe their wallets to gain access to different parts. 

I can imagine there will be a few incentives involved so wouldn't hurt ruining it along side your bank accounts.

Initial incentives usually come with a subsequent larger cost.

To add to congestion zone charges and toll roads levies ... toll pathways in the making

[Bratnia]

17 hours ago, Nik said:

Linked with biometrics it will be easy for financial penalties to be deducted.

You have not walked/exercised enough today, your wallet has had £5 deducted in order to encourage you to exercise more.

You've walked 20,000 steps today, used more than your fair share of air, your wallet has had £5 deducted.

[SidS]

9 hours ago, Bratnia said:

You have not walked/exercised enough today, your wallet has had £5 deducted in order to encourage you to exercise more.

You've walked 20,000 steps today, used more than your fair share of air, your wallet has had £5 deducted.

So true.

[Bigmarc]

Not it's not, it's the complete opposite to the truth.

[HonestMoneyGoldSilver]

Clown Planet has this covered. Listen to the words of these people, look at the video from BYB the other day. I once had a discussion with BYB about CBDCs and he called me "a nut job". An authoritarian nightmare with programmable currency, expiry dates, preferred and banned merchants, customers unable to get cash from the bank and CCP-style social credit scores in the west doesn't look so crazy now. The WEF are openly saying it. People all over the world can't get money from their banks or have transactions denied (especially for PMs):

 

 

[HonestMoneyGoldSilver]

On 28/05/2023 at 11:29, monkey said:

Just makes me think of problem - reaction - solution. In order to roll out the plan you would need the solution before the problem is presented, only this time the solution has made its self known before the problem. Maybe the head management decided to shake things up a bit?

House of Lords committee says UK digital pound is “solution in search of a problem” - FinTech Futures

On 07/07/2023 at 01:15, Skyfiller said:

So it does everything my bank account and card does at the moment except no interest on the account. Am I being dumb here, what am I missing? Why would anyone use it over their current card which is on my phone anyway. ???

You won't be allowed to use your card. To pay the council tax, income tax, mortgage, utility bills, you must use CBDCs. Game over. To receive any tax credits for being a parent or as part of a tax shield or for whatever reason, CBDCs only. The supermarket only accepts CBDCs then you can either use them, have your face scanned when you walk in the door and every aspect of your life commoditised, or you can starve. Bitcoin was a psy-op to prepare us for this day. The masses, especially younger people, will welcome this with open arms, idiots that they are. Look at Farage and the Christian ministers who have been de-banked, the charities that have been de-banked because they didn't follow the WEF globalist, LGBTQ master race, satanic narrative. We will be next. Oh you like gold and silver over CBDCs?? Off to the Gulag!!

On 07/07/2023 at 11:53, EdwardTeach said:

No sane person would voluntarily choose to use a CBDC over their current digital currency but the powers that be will try and force you to use it using various incentive and threat methods. This is what they did in China and Nigeria when they introduced their CBDCs. Have some optimism for this situation though. In both China and Nigeria all of the people there are fiercely resisting using CBDCs despite the various incentive and threat methods their governments have used and CBDC adoption in both countries has been is extremely slow and is already stalling badly.

All we have to do to stop CBDCs from happening is for enough people to refuse to use them when buying things and refuse to accept them as payment if people try buy things from you. Just use any form of currency other than a CBDC when making or receiving payments.

 

In parts of Africa, can't remember if it was Nigeria specifically, they have attached facial scanners and digital currency to water pumps, like the old-school ones you have to pump yourself. If the system doesn't like your face or you don't have enough social credits, you can't get water from the pump. That terrifies me, especially when the WEF claim, "water is not a fundamental human right". Nah we'll only die without it but sure, it's not fundamental, not a right for every human being. Satanism in action

[Bigmarc]

It's like the silver forum has advertised for new members in the daily mail. 

Running around frightened of the future must be exhausting. Nut job YouTube channels is not research. Countries have to keep up with the tech on the market. Most people in China use alipay, 1.3 billion users. There is we chat too. Ai is around the corner, so using bit of paper as a medium of exchange dying out regardless of cbdc's.