Coin cabinet wood type for gold?

[Simonz]

Apologies if this has been covered before, I did various searches and couldn't find anything.

I know Mahogany is generally recommended for coin cabinets to avoid tarnishing, but does it actually matter if only storing gold coins?

Appreciate any advice.

[AgD]

@richatthecroft has some wood storage cabinets/boxes, he maybe able to answer your questions and give some advice 

[dicker]

9 hours ago, Simonz said:

Apologies if this has been covered before, I did various searches and couldn't find anything.

I know Mahogany is generally recommended for coin cabinets to avoid tarnishing, but does it actually matter if only storing gold coins?

Appreciate any advice.

Super question!  I’m afraid I cannot help but I suspect any aged wood would be stable?

.999 Gold should be fine with any wood, lower (Sovs) may be more vulnerable - but I don’t know.

Michael Marsh was a cabinet maker, and I have seen a couple chairs at auction made by Marsh and one coin cabinet.  I’m sorry I didn’t see the wood it was made from. 

[Simonz]

2 hours ago, dicker said:

Super question!  I’m afraid I cannot help but I suspect any aged wood would be stable?

.999 Gold should be fine with any wood, lower (Sovs) may be more vulnerable - but I don’t know.

Michael Marsh was a cabinet maker, and I have seen a couple chairs at auction made by Marsh and one coin cabinet.  I’m sorry I didn’t see the wood it was made from. 

Thanks Dicker, you'd have to assume that because gold is so un-reactive it wouldn't matter. You raise a good point about sovs though, copper spots seem to be the only issue with them, and they occur regardless of storage situation?

[Simonz]

@richatthecroft, @Alun Any thoughts on this question?

[Alun]

12 minutes ago, Simonz said:

@richatthecroft, @Alun Any thoughts on this question?

All wood releases gas which can cause silver to tarnish over time but not really an issue for gold so much. Woods such as walnut, Mahogany and cherry are considered to be much better and much more inert than some others. Oak should be avoided at all costs as it will tone silver coins quicker than anything else. 

I tend to use Ash for my general boxs and Walnut for my more premium stuff.

Personally I think capsules further reduce the process anyway to the point its barely an issue

 

Alun

[Simonz]

1 hour ago, Alun said:

All wood releases gas which can cause silver to tarnish over time but not really an issue for gold so much. Woods such as walnut, Mahogany and cherry are considered to be much better and much more inert than some others. Oak should be avoided at all costs as it will tone silver coins quicker than anything else. 

I tend to use Ash for my general boxs and Walnut for my more premium stuff.

Personally I think capsules further reduce the process anyway to the point its barely an issue

 

Alun

Good to know, thanks so much Alun.

[Minted]

14 hours ago, Alun said:

Oak should be avoided at all costs as it will tone silver coins quicker than anything else. 

Good to know.  BBP sell oak gift boxes in 1oz silver size. 😬

[jamesGoddard]

With .999 gold, you can do what you like with it just don't make the mistake of putting gold in an Oak case that is kept in your (unvented) safe with vulnerable items for the long term, this includes silver paper and card.  916 is a little more vulnerable but there would need to be a significant issue to release enough gas to effect such a tiny amount of copper

Having worked in product design and manufacturing for 25 years, I can assure you that outgassing is real. I can also assure you that it is vastly overstated in many cases. Green timbers i.e undried will out gas and ruin silver extremely quickly but I'm yet to meet a furniture maker/cabinet maker working with unseasoned timber. Out of the kiln, timber is circa 10% moisture it is much more likely to draw in air and moisture to equalise with the atmosphere than expel anything. In addition, your coin is in an unvented capsule which will not encourage air to flow into it so compounds must try and pass through it which some can however, that would only occur if the gas had nowhere else to go, like water, it will always take the easiest route.

Personally, I'm much more worried about cheap plastic and an unstable environment. If the humidity in your room varies wildly so will the moisture content in the wood and that gives any chemical compounds an easy ride out of there as it breathes. Poor ventilation will compound that even further. High temperatures and direct sunlight are also no-nos because they tend to excite and expand things.

Buy your box of choice place it in the storage location, opened, for a minimum of 48 hours before placing coins and keep your environment stable. A good rule of thumb (but by no means foolproof) is to use your nose. if you can smell the wood without working it, forget it, no matter what the wood is. Beech at the extreme can appear perfectly dry with almost no taint, it's pretty, quite tough, and cheap, PERFECT for boxes but then you pair the board down and hit a vein of pure sap which is full of sugars, terpenes, tannins, and a bunch of other stuff. 

I don't see the problem with an oak holder that is cared for properly and placed adequately. A closed box is a bit more dangerous for obvious reasons but you could line it with other woods in particular the stuff used in humidors. I forget the name, but it's renowned for controlling internal atmospheres.

Edited June 27, 2023 by jamesGoddard

[Simonz]

3 hours ago, jamesGoddard said:

With .999 gold, you can do what you like with it just don't make the mistake of putting gold in an Oak case that is kept in your (unvented) safe with vulnerable items for the long term, this includes silver paper and card.  916 is a little more vulnerable but there would need to be a significant issue to release enough gas to effect such a tiny amount of copper

Having worked in product design and manufacturing for 25 years, I can assure you that outgassing is real. I can also assure you that it is vastly overstated in many cases. Green timbers i.e undried will out gas and ruin silver extremely quickly but I'm yet to meet a furniture maker/cabinet maker working with unseasoned timber. Out of the kiln, timber is circa 10% moisture it is much more likely to draw in air and moisture to equalise with the atmosphere than expel anything. In addition, your coin is in an unvented capsule which will not encourage air to flow into it so compounds must try and pass through it which some can however, that would only occur if the gas had nowhere else to go, like water, it will always take the easiest route.

Personally, I'm much more worried about cheap plastic and an unstable environment. If the humidity in your room varies wildly so will the moisture content in the wood and that gives any chemical compounds an easy ride out of there as it breathes. Poor ventilation will compound that even further. High temperatures and direct sunlight are also no-nos because they tend to excite and expand things.

Buy your box of choice place it in the storage location, opened, for a minimum of 48 hours before placing coins and keep your environment stable. A good rule of thumb (but by no means foolproof) is to use your nose. if you can smell the wood without working it, forget it, no matter what the wood is. Beech at the extreme can appear perfectly dry with almost no taint, it's pretty, quite tough, and cheap, PERFECT for boxes but then you pair the board down and hit a vein of pure sap which is full of sugars, terpenes, tannins, and a bunch of other stuff. 

I don't see the problem with an oak holder that is cared for properly and placed adequately. A closed box is a bit more dangerous for obvious reasons but you could line it with other woods in particular the stuff used in humidors. I forget the name, but it's renowned for controlling internal atmospheres.

Fabulous and useful info, thanks so much!