Capital Gains tax, VAT and British coins

[simon13]

In the event that silver and gold prices went crazy high, would you have been better off buying sovs and brits or cheaper coins like maples and paying the CGT at 18 or 28 percent?

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[Fluttershy]

if I`m not mistaken, you only pay CGT if you sell over a certain amount anyway.

now I May be thinking the American system where you sell over 10k worth of silver and they have to report the sale to the tax man, I`m not sure if that applies here, but I wouldn`t be surprised what with all the new money laudering protections in place now.

so if you sold 1k one week then another 1k the next week, I`m fairly sure you`ll be ok, and it`s up to your own honesty to inform the tax man if it`s above the allowable limit.

 

I`m sure others here will know much more and correct me if I`m wrong.

 

edited to add, that it`s not some perculiar to PMs either, if you sell Anything even on ebay for instance and make a profit, you should Technically let the tax man know!

 

but since they steal our fiat anyway by infaltion tactics, you can weigh up yourself if they`ve already taken a fair share from you in the first place

[mr-dead]

Ive made the decision to now only buy only UK legal tender gold moving forward.

 

to quote Atlkinsons (Britannia also applies to any other UK legal tender coins like sovs, £2 coins etc )-

 

"

Probably one of the most frequent questions I am asked is:

 

Why should I buy the Gold or Silver Britannia coin over the other, sometimes slightly cheaper 1 ounce gold coins we sell?

 

The answer is that the British legal tender Britannia coin is currently free of Capital Gains Tax when sold at a profit.

 

The implications of this are many. If you are buying a few coins to simply put a little insurance away for a rainy day which you want in physical gold then you could realistically buy any of our coins, and the cheaper the better. However if you have a little more to spend or if you already have other forms of investment which bring you into a CGT problem then you may wish to stick to the British coins such as the Britannia as the CGT free status is more relevant to your tax situation.

 

I am no tax or investment guru, but it is important that you give this some consideration. What a saving you could make if you buy the correct product even if the Britannia is a little more expensive than some of the other coins.

 

If you are not aware of your tax situation then a good accountant or tax specialist might be worth the time and effort. There is the ability to earn around £11,000 per annum from your investments BEFORE you pay any CGT so again each of our clients must examine their own personal tax liability before making the decision on which items to purchase."

[mr-dead]

I think one point to consider though is

 

"British legal tender Britannia coin is currently free of Capital Gains Tax when sold at a profit."

 

I'm sure if silver/gold went to the moon that's an aspect the tax man would quickly address

[HawkHybrid]

the cgt allowance is for every new tax year so if you have gains of 22k then you

can sell it equally over 2 years and pay no cgt.

 

work out the figures of what your potential stack/collection would gain in value

given historic/likely spot prices and then work out how much you would like

to sell each year to decide if you would rather some of it in legal tender coins.

 

cgt is on profit, ie if you bought maples at £15 and sold at £90 and you had to pay

cgt then it would be 18% of £75 gains paid in taxes minimum, so £13, so profit would

be £62. britannia bought at £20 and sold at £95 would give you £75 profit cgt free.

the higher the selling price gets the better off you are if it's cgt free.

 

I tend to buy a good portion of my coins in british legal tender to save on the hassle

of having to work it out. also selling in the next tax year can be inconvenient as prices

may have changed or you have uses for the money now.

 

HH

[Kman]

I'm just getting gold

 

I will stick to CGT free for the majority

 

Probably will get some different 1/4 oz coins along the way if the design takes my fancy though

 

Trying to steer towards just buying gold for gold and not get too caught up in collecting, but the Perth Mint make bloody beautiful stuff damn them.

[simon13]

Thanks for the thoughts. I'm thinking about getting some gold at the end of the month. Looks like Sovs at HGM get the most gold per pound within my budget and are CGT free so thats a win win. In silver I like the cheapness and security features on maples but as my stack increases i'll switch to brits.

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[HawkHybrid]

Typical taxable possessions

Personal possessions that may be liable to Capital Gains Tax when you sell or dispose of them include:

• jewellery
• paintings
• antiques
• coins and stamps

These are examples of assets that you can physically touch and move, i.e. they're tangible and moveable, and special rules apply.

The special rules mean that you don't pay Capital Gains Tax on:

• Your private car.
• Personal possessions that are individually worth £6,000 or less at the time you sell or otherwise dispose of them. This covers many household articles such as fridges and sofas. But there are slightly different rules for assets that form part of a set - see the section on 'sets of possessions' below.
• Most personal possessions that are 'wasting assets' - these are assets with a limited lifespan that often lose their value over time. See the section on 'wasting assets' below.

this part might imply that coins not part of sets individually sold for less than £6,000 each

may be exempt from cgt? I think it gets more complicated though.

 

HH

[Pete]

We are presently in the 2014/15 tax year.

You don't pay any CGT until your "profit" exceeds £11,000 and even then you can transfer to spouse or partners free of tax.

Each year you get a new full allowance.

 

Assuming you bought gold Britannias for £800 each and gold increased in value by 10% to £880 each you show a profit of £80.

To worry about CGT you would need to sell ( in this simple example ) 138 x one ounce Britannias in a single tax year.

To have 138 Brits in the first instance your investment in gold would be over £100k.

 

Don't overlook the government changing the rules on capital gains in any future budgets.

[simon13]

Thanks. But say if some of the wilder predictions about gold and silver prices come to pass, you would be better off with RM coins, if the law doesn't change :s

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[mr-dead]

We are presently in the 2014/15 tax year.

You don't pay any CGT until your "profit" exceeds £11,000 and even then you can transfer to spouse or partners free of tax.

Each year you get a new full allowance.

 

Assuming you bought gold Britannias for £800 each and gold increased in value by 10% to £880 each you show a profit of £80.

To worry about CGT you would need to sell ( in this simple example ) 138 x one ounce Britannias in a single tax year.

To have 138 Brits in the first instance your investment in gold would be over £100k.

 

Don't overlook the government changing the rules on capital gains in any future budgets.

 

Thats me knackered with my monster box of Britannias

 

 

I wish

[Ares]

Trying to steer towards just buying gold for gold and not get too caught up in collecting, but the Perth Mint make bloody beautiful stuff damn them.

Famous last words!

I'd certainly look to see the bulk of my gold as British gold if I was doing significant investment, but that's not to say I'd stick to it entirely.

[Fluttershy]

it REALLY REALLY upsets me that we even Have To have this sort of conversation, it`s like we`re all in fear of "The Man" when in fact it`s Them that should fear and serve US!

 

the word "Minister" be it Prime or otherwise means to Serve, and don`t see much of that anywhere, unless it`s serving themselves!

 

we really shouldn`t have to be thinking like this at all, I think they`re all evil!

 

(/rant)

[mr-dead]

Where do you think the everyday normal working man sits in the below diagram -

 

[Ares]

it REALLY REALLY upsets me that we even Have To have this sort of conversation, it`s like we`re all in fear of "The Man" when in fact it`s Them that should fear and serve US!

 

(/rant)

But that's the thing, they've got the authority.

As to the threat of CGT-free getting removed for British coins, when was the idea introduced and has it ever been altered since despite whatever financial problems? That's what I'd like to know.

[simon13]

I'd love a state cryptocurrency with an inbuilt flat rate transaction tax to replace all taxation. No deficit spending by the government and the system is super simple for new and small businesses.

Or silver and gold

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[Danny-boy]

Guys, just remember if we didn't pay our taxes, we wouldn't have these gorgeous pot-hole free roads, litter less streets and awesome public transport system.

Lol

[Ares]

Meh, taxes are good, just depends how crap or not your council is at spending it

[HelpingHands]

Like I've said before it depends how you will sell.

 

If you plan on dumping 1000oz on a dealer so you can buy a house then it's worth thinking about.

 

I believe pre-decimal coins are not CGT free as they are not legal tender so if you think we have a chance of a new monetary system then coins which are currently legal tender may not be in the future.

 

I think the resale premium on collectable foreign silver coins is too good to ignore.  As for gold, I'm not convinced in the advantage of stacking foreign gold apart from small coins. 

[HawkHybrid]

I was under the impression that coins that were legal tender at the point

of issue are also cgt free?

 

HH

[HelpingHands]

I don't think so.  I'm pretty sure pre-decimal (apart from sovs) do not qualify but if anyone would like to research it feel free.