Investing In The Stock Market For Total Beginners

[goldbones]

I keep stock investing to the professionals by drip feeding monthly into a mix of bond and stock funds, you need to pick a good manager i'd say stick with Neil Woodford he has a new fund been going for a year or so:

http://www.hl.co.uk/funds/neil-woodford-new-fund

When i want to dabble in individual stocks or ETF's i use Barclay's market master account.

Right now i'm not keen on holding a bunch of capital long on stocks (i actually have a short position as an ETF that goes up when market goes down), i sold out mostly in june last year but when i think the time is right to get back in i'd probably as i say go with Neil as he's usually a lot sharper and outperforms any tracker and most other funds over time.

But in general picking funds is about picking the manager, crap manager= crap performance it's that simple really.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-33113081

 

 

[oliversw5]

I was using x-o.co.uk I think its 5 quid buy, 5 quid sell, there are no other fees. 

I have had an account with them for close to 8 years, never had an issue.

 

They are actually listed on the market swell under the ticker symbol JIM and pay a nice divi..

[shemyaza]

MXF MedicX has been a stalwart corner stock for me along with GCP. Bulletproof since June last year and 7% via quarterly dividends. My Profile has my Dividend strategy.

[HawkHybrid]

http://news.gold-eagle.com/article/what-most-important-fundamental-reason-gold/83

 

a good read if you remember that investing means waiting for

returns to accumulate and trading means quick profits from

market fluctuations.

 

HH

[vand]

I wouldn't touch the stock market with a barge pole at this point.  As with most things, timing is everything, and after a 6 year bull run there may not be much - or any - upside left. The time to consider stocks is after a big decline, such as 2002-2004 or 2009-2011.

Of course, that is very easy to say with the benefit of hindsight, but the risk/reward here is not favourable at all imo. Despite the rallies the long term moving averages are all moving down. Wait for blood on the street, or at least if you are going to buy now then drip-feed your buying and save plenty of ammo for when everyone else screams "get rid of these at any price!" Don't believe that you can pick stocks that will be impervious from wider market declines - in a bear market everything gets sold down with very few exceptions.

It's impossible to pick the bottom, but if you are smart about it you can do very well. It doesn't have to be a complicated strategy, either - a simple rule like "buy heavily over a 24 month period right after the market has declined over 30%" will see generate very strong returns in the long run.

[KDave]

I agree generally with you vand, but I also believe there is always value to be found in all market conditions. The stock market is due a crash that is true, but for me holding stocks is a form of diversification and as I follow a dividend seeking policy corrections in the share price has little effect on me other than providing a buying opportunity. Alternatively I could be waiting a long time for the market to crash or it could happen tomorrow, so I invest accordingly.

[HawkHybrid]

if the market is likely to go up then take long positions, if

it is likely to fall then take short positions. gold miners with

money and production are a decent risk/reward at the

moment(maybe wait for a pullback).

 

the market won't mold to fit your trading. it's your strategy

that needs to adapt to benefit from the upcoming market

moves.

 

HH

[Ares]

Currently up 3% ip this year, shorting gold on the lead up to Brexit. Looking into various natural resource stocks for long term positions.

Time IN the market is more important than timING the market, the latter is a mugs game. There are more people with more knowledge, more research, faster internet, faster computers and intelligent algorithms that try pick out key investment points and even THEY don't get it right most of the time, what chance does a regular person with a regular job have?

Check out this link, it represents what would happen if you ONLY invested before market crashes but critically did not sell.

http://awealthofcommonsense.com/2014/02/worlds-worst-market-timer/

Most investors buy on the highs because market sentiment is good, then they sell low following a crash because they have a lower risk tolerance. If you hold, particularly long (10+ years, I'm aiming for 40) then it's incredibly hard to lose overall.

havent bought PMs for a while, will probably but an order in for some collectable bits and bobs and maybe a bit of gold here and there, but I'm hooked on the stock market. The research (technical, financial and geopolitical aspects) really appeals to me.

 

[vand]

5 hours ago, Ares said:

 

Time IN the market is more important than timING the market, the latter is a mugs game. There are more people with more knowledge, more research, faster internet, faster computers and intelligent algorithms that try pick out key investment points and even THEY don't get it right most of the time, what chance does a regular person with a regular job have?

 

Sorry, this is the sort of nonsense that Wall St and investment funds peddle to the masses who are too lazy to do their own research. The want you to buy at whatever price, because that's how they make their money.

Timing OF the market is far more useful for generating good returns, but requires discipline to restrict buying when the market is expensive and increase it when the market is cheap.

If you bought the FTSE in 1999-2000 then you'll be at best flat after 16 years of "time in the market", and people who bought in the Dow 1929 had to wait something rediculous like 45 years. If you bought the Nikkei 30 years ago then you're still going to be waiting a long time to get your money back. How much "time in the market" do they have to put in?

You could have bought Nasdaq for as much as 5000 or as little as under 1000 if you had been patient. One would have provided you with a flat return, the other with a 500% return up to present.

And you could have bought silver for £30 or £10.  Now, silver may go back to £30, or even £50, or £100 if we are on the cusp of a new bull market, but buying at £10 will generate a far better return.

Limiting your downside is the single greatest lesson of sensible investment, and it is applicable to any and all asset classes. Once your investment is underwater, the remainder of your money has to work multiples harder just to get back to even.

[HawkHybrid]

I remember buying energy saving light bulbs when they were ~£8.

now similar/better bulbs can be had for maybe £1.

if I was trading in them I would have made an 87% loss.

I invested in them and by installing them made electricity savings

of ~£8 over the first 3 years. the bulb lasted something like 6+ years.

making me a total return of 100% in 6 years.

timing is critical for trading. for investments it's more important to

have a well thought out plan.

 

HH

[HawkHybrid]

'Sell in May and go away, stay away till St Leger Day'

 

(historic hit rate 80+% apparently)

 

HH

[KDave]

How about take the buying opportunity after May and collect your dividends all the way? 

[HawkHybrid]

2 hours ago, KDave said:

How about take the buying opportunity after May and collect your dividends all the way? 

 

holders need to decide whether or not to sell in may.

it's buy ~october, this year may be an exception year though.

(it's not every year that gold goes up 18% in the first two

months)

 

HH

[watchesandwhisky]

Just dipped my toes in with the minimum £100 lump sum funding with neil woodfords new fund (Thanks Goldbones!)

Fully appreciate that the stock market is in a six year bull run, but i don mind gambling a half sovereign on it lol..at least it gets my account up and running, 

Then will wait before investing larger sums an wait for a better time.

This is my first investment other than silver/gold.

[KDave]

39 minutes ago, HawkHybrid said:

 

holders need to decide whether or not to sell in may.

it's buy ~october, this year may be an exception year though.

(it's not every year that gold goes up 18% in the first two

months)

 

HH

I find it very odd that 80% of the time stocks do generally fall in May why is this does anyone know? Is it another human based self fulfilling prophecy akin to the Shemitah, where enough people believe it will happen and act accordingly, that they create the fall that otherwise would not have happened? Or is there are genuine economic reason for stocks to fall during this time? I wish to know as I would find it hard to make superstition a part of my investing strategy and would prefer a more concrete reason that as a side effect might restore my hope for humanity.

[watchesandwhisky]

Does anyone know some kind of stock "defence/home/buisness security" orientated?  The type of company that makes razor wire, wire fences, defensive clothing ect..

 

[HawkHybrid]

2 minutes ago, KDave said:

I find it very odd that 80% of the time stocks do generally fall in May why is this does anyone know? Is it another human based self fulfilling prophecy akin to the Shemitah, where enough people believe it will happen and act accordingly, that they create the fall that otherwise would not have happened? Or is there are genuine economic reason for stocks to fall during this time? I wish to know as I would find it hard to make superstition a part of my investing strategy and would prefer a more concrete reason that as a side effect might restore my hope for humanity.

 

it's a combination of things that includes cyclical production

and reporting. it's also not a coincident that financial years

start in april. retail stocks that reports good sales(usually)

over christmas gives the index an artificial boost from jan-apr

and then they correct over the summer from being overbought.

 

HH

 

 

[watchesandwhisky]

Just picked up 47 units of Lonmin

currently my trades are costing loads as a % of buying due to fees, But I dont care. I have £500 to throw into this and I fully see this as a learning curve, I also fully expect to lose the entire sum. I see this as no different to stepping into the bookies and losing £500 in a fixed odds betting terminal. (i have done that in the past)

Just a clueless newbie having a bit of fun really lol.

 

[KDave]

I started my learning curve with the dreaded Alternative Investment Market (AIM) back in 2014 knowing absolutely nothing about stocks and shares and made over 300% on some including REM and LGO, a now knackered oil mining share and also suffered some very big losses on some others including IGAS and DOR. In the end a year later I came out breaking even after fees, a little bit wiser and with a distrust of AIM companies lol. I traded small amounts which meant the total trade fees from moving in an out were 10% of total capital I used to invest. With hindsight if I had been more disciplined I would have left with some profit, but I knew no better.

I was lucky to leave with my money honestly and the timing could not have been better through pure luck on some of the trades. I learned a lot about fear and greed. I realised what I had been doing was basically gambling, some people call it speculating, though the line between gambling and investing is blurred it seems. I take a more long term approach to my gambling now and try to earn income where possible to feed my regular gambling habit. When I come to need the money I hope my punts have made me some money 

[HawkHybrid]

traders are gamblers, who are very different from investors.

investors can also be traders. for example, I buy into a

mining company who has a life of mine of 12 years on a

producing mine. I plan to give it a maturity of maybe 10

years before I move on. I buy into it once and leave it for

10 years and then sell, I'm being an investor. if I were to

sell the mining shares in may and buy them back at a

cheaper price in october every year for the duration of

the 10 years before selling it at maturity. I'm then both

a trader and an investor.(sometimes I might lose on the

trade but will always buy back in cos as an investment

the buying of the shares should still make me an investment

return) traders will trade on a dead cat bounce, only

misinformed investors will try to invest on a dead cat

bounce. the system tries to confuse people so that they

believe that traders are investors and end up trading

which brings in more money for the system but is much

more risky.

 

HH

[watchesandwhisky]

I actually see this as long term gambling, I plan to just buy and hold and just see what happens..if any go up I might just take back my initial investment and fees, leave the profit on still and buy something else.

Am just looking to add stocks that are much cheaper than they once was and hope they regain some value. if they crash and burn oh well..

Only putting in what I can genuinely afford to lose and not feel annoyed I did it lol.

Im also dabbling in P2P lending..Just looking to expand my investments a bit from just physical gold and silver. 

[KDave]

Can't go wrong with a bit of diversification.

[watchesandwhisky]

Yep, as much as I like gold and silver I know I have way to much of my net worth tied up in them! Even though this is probably not a good time to be getting into stocks it actually feels pretty good to be trying new things.

[watchesandwhisky]

Currently have £680 invested now..Have a stocks and shares ISA and a Fund an share account. Am I correct in thinking I should max out My ISA before even thinking of using the fund and share account an its exactly the same just Tax FREE? If so then made my first mistakes already lol..

Stocks and shares ISA

Stock	Units held	Price (pence)	Value (£)	Cost (£)	Gain/loss £ %	Actions
Total			183.95	198.71	-14.76 -7.43
BlackRock World Mining Trust  Ordinary 5p	38	222.00	84.36	98.71	-14.35 -14.54
CF Woodford Equity Income   Class Z - Accumulation (GBP)	83.921	118.67	99.59	100.00	-0.41 -0.41

Fund and Share account..

Stock	Units held	Price (pence)	Value (£)	Cost (£)	Gain/loss £ %	Actions
Total			386.56	479.99	-93.43 -19.46
Falanx Group Ltd  Ordinary NPV	1,366	5.50	75.13	90.84	-15.71 -17.29
Frontera Resources Corp  Ord USD0.00004	16,717	0.51	85.26	100.00	-14.74 -14.74
Hummingbird Resources plc  Ord 1p	434	19.00	82.46	99.84	-17.38 -17.41
Lonmin plc  Ordinary USD	47	143.75	67.56	99.31	-31.75 -31.97
Ortac Resources Ltd  Ord NPV	190,365	0.04	76.15	90.00	-13.85 -15.39

 

Naturally massive paper losses on all investments with the deal cost of £12 per deal, I realize this isn't sustainable, but I see this as learning and will invest larger sums at one time when I do. All of these are outright gambles I know it lol. Will long term Hold on all. I guess they will either go bankrupt or hit pay dirt an make massive gains.

I like a gamble. Used to play at the bookies but stopped that..This is my guilt free gambling

[KDave]

Looks a lot like my stock portfolio mate - everything in the red 

Just be careful though those small sums feel easy to do but eventually add up to some serious money. I started with £500 parcels on AIM and pretty soon had several thousand sat in various seriously risky penny shares. Not a good place to be in hindsight but I did not know it at the time.

May I suggest reading some books before going further, educate yourself first, then invest. Its cheaper that way round. Tim Hale Smarter Investing is a good one to start with if you are leaning towards the long term hold. Read as much as you can, get as many opinions on the matter as you can then come up with your own strategy. Don't buy or sell on anyone's recommendations but your own. This is not advice of course just some suggestions