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2023 proof sovereigns


refero

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12 minutes ago, REILsilver said:

I feel like a gold fish that's been dropped into the ocean. 

At the moment I'm stacking very little. I was hoping to change that over the coming months. 

Forgive my nieveity, how does caplets gains effect a private stack?

Say the market goes crazy and you a have significant stack.  In Two years time when CGT threshold is reduced to £3000 anything you sell over the TOTAL amount of £3000  per annum you will have to pay Capital gains tax at between 10-37% depending on your earnings.

So Reilsilver has a stack of coins he bought that arent capital gains tax:

He paid £25 an oz for some silver say 500oz = £12500 - silver mooned and went to £40 an Oz and he sold it at profit of £8000 - so of that £15 profit  per oz you will have to pay between 10-37% depending on your income. The first £3000 is the threshold is free, but the further £5000  you will be taxed.

But if you buy Capital gains tax free silver or gold you dont have pay it! And still have your annual threshold to use on something else!

So you would have to pay £500 CGT at lower rate  so youve only made £4500

*** I am not a financial / tax advisor

but the highest rate You will have to pay £3150 so youve only made  £1850

 

 

Edited by HerefordBullyun
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30 minutes ago, HerefordBullyun said:

Say the market goes crazy and you a have significant stack.  In Two years time when CGT threshold is reduced to £3000 anything you sell over the TOTAL amount of £3000  per annum you will have to pay Capital gains tax at between 10-37% depending on your earnings.

So Reilsilver has a stack of coins he bought that arent capital gains tax:

He paid £25 an oz for some silver say 500oz = £12500 - silver mooned and went to £40 an Oz and he sold it at profit of £8000 - so of that £15 profit  per oz you will have to pay between 10-37% depending on your income. The first £3000 is the threshold is free, but the further £5000  you will be taxed.

But if you buy Capital gains tax free silver or gold you dont have pay it! And still have your annual threshold to use on something else!

So you would have to pay £500 CGT at lower rate  so youve only made £4500

*** I am not a financial / tax advisor

but the highest rate You will have to pay £3150 so youve only made  £1850

 

 

Thank you @HerefordBullyun for being patient with me. I take it this will apply with all appreciating assets then? For example cars, bikes and even lego for instance?

 

 

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25 minutes ago, REILsilver said:

Thank you @HerefordBullyun for being patient with me. I take it this will apply with all appreciating assets then? For example cars, bikes and even lego for instance?

 

 

You are subject to anything over the value of £3000 thats not capital gains tax free thats in 2 years time

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6 minutes ago, HerefordBullyun said:

You are subject to anything over the value of £3000 thats not capital gains tax free thats in 2 years time

Ouch! That is going to catch some people unawares. 

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Just now, HerefordBullyun said:

Why do you think the government are launching CBDCs because they will tax you at source!

The TAX man will be AI at source via CBDCs.... 

What if you sell pier to pier, as in on this site? Can you avoid the CGT?

Or do you get spotted by the bank when your balance inflates?

Can you avoid CGT if you are only selling currency (brits n sovs)?

 

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Just now, AaaGee said:

What if you sell pier to pier, as in on this site? Can you avoid the CGT?

Or do you get spotted by the bank when your balance inflates?

Can you avoid CGT if you are only selling currency (brits n sovs)?

 

The taxman will question who and what you sold with the transparent amount. Youd be naive if you dont think HMRC dont monitor sites like this.

Like there are people who flip regular here as private sellers but really they are acting like a business. Obviously Im not going to mention names, but trading feedback is massive giveaway.

They wont have that luxury when CBDCs are around....

Currently your transactions between you and someone elses bank are private. Its why HMRC can find it difficult to prove tax avoidance. 

The government want to stop this so all transactions will go via the central bank which are no longer private. therefore can be challenged and if they reason believe your on the make, then they will just deduct the balance either from your CBDC wallet balance or your wages at source....

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4 hours ago, REILsilver said:

I did think the same, the government is renowned for not doing what they say, lol.

 So are all uk sovereign classed as legal uk tender therefore not subject to capital gains?

These information pages might help answer your questions:

CGT

https://www.allgoldcoins.co.uk/pages/capital-gain-tax-cgt

VAT

https://www.allgoldcoins.co.uk/pages/vat-exemption-eu-sales-information

Allgold Coins Est 2002 - Premium Gold Coin Dealer and Specialists :  

www.allgoldcoins.co.uk

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7 hours ago, REILsilver said:

I did think the same, the government is renowned for not doing what they say, lol.

 So are all uk sovereign classed as legal uk tender therefore not subject to capital gains?

It really is worth emphasising that the word/name 'Sovereign' is not trademarked. Anyone can create a coin and call it a Sovereign - whether that is in the UK or elsewhere. The only Sovereigns worth paying any attention to are the ones released by the Royal Mint.

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2 hours ago, BOOLIAN said:

It really is worth emphasising that the word/name 'Sovereign' is not trademarked. Anyone can create a coin and call it a Sovereign - whether that is in the UK or elsewhere. The only Sovereigns worth paying any attention to are the ones released by the Royal Mint.

Thank you, i will take on board this and maybe go with one of the coins above instead as was not sure what would be best to go with and whether there was an advantage with the IOM one being a very limited mint, safe to say i have been swayed to stay with royal mint sovereigns for now.

Jus to be sure, So a sovereign released from the royal mint is classed as legal tender and therfore cgt exempt?

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38 minutes ago, REILsilver said:

Jus to be sure, So a sovereign released from the royal mint is classed as legal tender and therfore cgt exempt?

Yep, Sovereigns minted in & after 1837 are CGT exempt. TSF is the cheapest place to buy 99% of the time. If you would rather go through an online dealer then Hatton Garden Metals' 'Best Value' Sovereigns tend to be the best in price (when also costing in delivery fees).

Edited by BOOLIAN
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15 minutes ago, REILsilver said:

Thank you all for your information and opinions, all has been very helpful.

Sorry, one more question. Would trading an item eligible for cgt I have for an item that is cgt exempt, then selling that item be one possible way around it? Albeit a long winded way.

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Update- In the end, as some suggested, I went for the one I liked and got the IOM sovereign. 

There are a few reasons I chose this over the royal mint.

• I liked the of the very limited mintage 

• personally, the design appealed to me more.

• I can pay this off in instalments, leaving me a better budget to play with over the coming summer months.

• At the present time, CGT isn't a major concern for me, yet.

This being said, I appreciate all of your advice and will definitely be taking on board moving forward in the world of stacking and collecting. 😆 thanks again. 

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  • 2 weeks later...

I have a couple of proof full sovereigns coming.  Mine are on an automatic ship subscription from the RM so I can sleep in Monday - no 1AM wake up and queue for me!

Now I have two sets of the Jubilee sov, the Memorial sov, and Coronation sov, possibly not so exciting right now, but some day I think it will be a winner.

Has anyone heard actual mintage numbers or is that a closely guarded secret like all other RM info?

Edited by Sc391
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Is anyone just giving Monday's launch a complete miss ?

As I'm still paying off coronation purchases, to save additional debt I think I'll just pick up a five sovereign in PF70 plastic coffin later in the year 

Also if I'm reading the collective pulse of current collectors market I feel there's not a huge amount of love for Charles 

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4 minutes ago, Paul said:

Is anyone just giving Monday's launch a complete miss ?

As I'm still paying off coronation purchases, to save additional debt I think I'll just pick up a five sovereign in PF70 plastic coffin later in the year 

Also if I'm reading the collective pulse of current collectors market I feel there's not a huge amount of love for Charles 

I will be watching - but I don't think there will be as much fun as usual.  The relatively high mintages (certainly for the sovereign) will probably mean that quite a few people will not be rushing to buy.  I'm more than happy with my SOTD and the quarter ounce and 1/40 oz Coronation coins I bought.  I will probably buy a bullion sovereign and half sovereign later in the year. 

I would not say it is lack of love for these coins that is the problem, I think the real problem is the RM are releasing so many coins, so frequently, that they are flooding the market.  

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4 minutes ago, Zhorro said:

I will be watching - but I don't think there will be as much fun as usual.  The relatively high mintages (certainly for the sovereign) will probably mean that quite a few people will not be rushing to buy.  I'm more than happy with my SOTD and the quarter ounce and 1/40 oz Coronation coins I bought.  I will probably buy a bullion sovereign and half sovereign later in the year. 

I would not say it is lack of love for these coins that is the problem, I think the real problem is the RM are releasing so many coins, so frequently, that they are flooding the market.  

Yeah, I was happy getting my coronation strike on day, I think that is something a bit special, and also to get the 2oz gold Matt proof. If I miss this on Monday it is no great loss. I think the number of releases in short succession, issue RRPs against near ATH gold price and also cost of living crisis. It's a near perfect storm for releases to be lukewarm at best 

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