2022 Elizabeth II "Piedfort" Gold Proof Sovereign Platinum Jubilee

[SidS]

Does the ditty come with free postage?

[JeffM]

20 minutes ago, SidS said:

Does the ditty come with free postage?

A ditty can always be used for free postage.  Unless, of course, it's a bitty ditty.

[HerefordBullyun]

20 minutes ago, JeffM said:

A ditty can always be used for free postage.  

Please dont swear in front of @LawrenceChard

[LawrenceChard]

1 hour ago, HerefordBullyun said:

Please dont swear in front of @LawrenceChard

Who used the "F" word?

😎

[westminstrel]

So I’m seeing people buying the 2022 Proof Sovereign for £1,000 when the Piedfort can still be got for about £1,400.

Makes me want to bang my head on a wall. 🤦🏻‍♂️ 

[Mtaybar]

3 hours ago, westminstrel said:

So I’m seeing people buying the 2022 Proof Sovereign for £1,000 when the Piedfort can still be got for about £1,400.

Makes me want to bang my head on a wall. 🤦🏻‍♂️ 

Doesn't make sense to me either but I guess the extra £400 is over their budget so go for the one within their price range. Still..... Getting 100% more gold for only 40% more cost is a no brainer to me lol. 

[GoldDiggerDave]

On 12/09/2022 at 23:18, LawrenceChard said:

Who used the "F" word?

😎

What FedEx? 

[paulmerton]

3 minutes ago, Mtaybar said:

Doesn't make sense to me either but I guess the extra £400 is over their budget so go for the one within their price range. Still..... Getting 100% more gold for only 40% more cost is a no brainer to me lol. 

Piedfort coins always seem hideously overpriced to me when you consider you're only getting twice as much precious metal, but the extra 100% still has a hefty premium whacked onto it even though the amount of effort that had to go into making and polishing the dies is exactly the same as for the standard thickness coin.

[Mtaybar]

2 minutes ago, paulmerton said:

Piedfort coins always seem hideously overpriced to me when you consider you're only getting twice as much precious metal, but the extra 100% still has a hefty premium whacked onto it even though the amount of effort that had to go into making and polishing the dies is exactly the same as for the standard thickness coin.

True.... If you look at it from that angle then yeah I get it. But let's face it.... There's only around a third of these minted compared to the standard proof sovereign and it's the last proof that will be minted in the queen's lifetime. When you buy these sorts of coins you're not only looking at the minting process to come up with a price point. They're collectable numismatic coins after all. 

[paulmerton]

1 minute ago, Mtaybar said:

it's the last proof that will be minted in the queen's lifetime

My replacement SYO sovereign hasn't been struck yet

[Mtaybar]

Just now, paulmerton said:

My replacement SYO sovereign hasn't been struck yet

If it's a replacement are you stamping it yourself? 

[GoldDiggerDave]

1 minute ago, paulmerton said:

My replacement SYO sovereign hasn't been struck yet

I’d be crossing my fingers they will still replace it, I hope they do but the cynical side of me suspects they RM will use this to back out of their replacement obligations.

[Mtaybar]

Just now, GoldDiggerDave said:

I’d be crossing my fingers they will still replace it, I hope they do but the cynical side of me suspects they RM will use this to back out of their replacement obligations.

Or just fob off with a sub par return lol

[paulmerton]

2 minutes ago, GoldDiggerDave said:

I’d be crossing my fingers they will still replace it, I hope they do but the cynical side of me suspects they RM will use this to back out of their replacement obligations.

They have told me they will replace it. I haven't committed to it yet as they are being ballbags over the price and the fact that I won't be striking it myself.

 

[GoldDiggerDave]

1 minute ago, paulmerton said:

They have told me they will replace it. I haven't committed to it yet as they are being ballbags over the price and the fact that I won't be striking it myself.

 

Mate, I’d camp outside the RM for it! 

[westminstrel]

44 minutes ago, paulmerton said:

Piedfort coins always seem hideously overpriced to me when you consider you're only getting twice as much precious metal, but the extra 100% still has a hefty premium whacked onto it even though the amount of effort that had to go into making and polishing the dies is exactly the same as for the standard thickness coin.

Usually the premium for the piedfort has always been slightly less than that for the regular proof.

In this particular scenario, the premium for the regular proof is so much higher than the piedfort, and I think it’s so silly how people are bidding against each other over £1000 for it when for £400 more you could get twice the gold and less than half the mintage with the piedfort.

[Stuntman]

I think the proof sovereign is by far the more collectable coin, and nicer too.  Even though it's much more common, given the choice between that and the piedfort I would always choose the proof, speaking as a collector.

[westminstrel]

4 hours ago, Stuntman said:

I think the proof sovereign is by far the more collectable coin, and nicer too.  Even though it's much more common, given the choice between that and the piedfort I would always choose the proof, speaking as a collector.

Could you explain why you find the proof more collectible?

[Mtaybar]

5 hours ago, Stuntman said:

I think the proof sovereign is by far the more collectable coin, and nicer too.  Even though it's much more common, given the choice between that and the piedfort I would always choose the proof, speaking as a collector.

The piedfort is proof so I don't understand....? It looks exactly the same as the standard proof sovereign only twice as thick. 

[SidS]

I've kept out of this so far, but I prefer the proper proof sovereigns, I wouldn't want the piedforts - too far removed from proper coins. Too much like a medal.

I get the whole more metal for your money argument, but if it's not the metal you're after and more just plain sovereigns for a date/type set then I completely get it. It's the same reason the 1937 and 1989 sovereigns command much higher premiums than the doubles of those dates. It's your numismatists driving up the price, not your bullion stackers.

[Stuntman]

Completely agree with @SidS rationale above.  Exactly that.  

The standard proof sovereign will be the coin that the sovereign collectors want to own.  The piedfort is a bit of a johnny-come lately, and if we're talking about the recently issued matte finished 2022 piedforts, they are Brilliant Uncirculated and not proof (assuming they were struck to the same standard as my five sovereign piece).

EDIT: after scrolling back to the early pages of this thread, I see that the piedfort is indeed a proof coin - but my overall point still stands.

Basically the proof sovereign appeals to the dedicated sovereign collector in a way that the piedfort does not.

I don't collect proof sovereigns and I have no desire to own a piedfort, so my own interest is moot 😄

Edited September 22, 2022 by Stuntman

[GoldDiggerDave]

I love seeing differences of opinions,  not a proper proof?  I’d have to disagree, it’s a beautiful coin and in much higher relief than the standard proof coin.  
 

as for its future value against a full sovereign, I simply don’t care as I’ve got lots of each I’m going to win with the piedfort and win even more on then full sovereigns, and make a killing and the proof £5.  So it’s just a case of how much you are going to win with these 2022 proof sovereigns …….And who would not want to own the last proof sovereign of QEII reign because this is what the piedfort 2022 proof sovereign is…….all those naysayers stomping all over this coin………they second QEII passed  people could not buy them quick enough. 

 

 

Edited September 22, 2022 by GoldDiggerDave

[SidS]

21 minutes ago, GoldDiggerDave said:

I love seeing differences of opinions,  not a proper proof?  I’d have to disagree, it’s a beautiful coin and in much higher relief than the standard proof coin.  
 

as for its future value against a full sovereign, I simply don’t care as I’ve got lots of each I’m going to win with the piedfort and win even more on then full sovereigns, and make a killing and the proof £5.  So it’s just a case of how much you are going to win with these 2022 proof sovereigns …….And who would not want to own the last proof sovereign of QEII reign because this is what the piedfort 2022 proof sovereign is…….all those naysayers stomping all over this coin………they second QEII passed  people could not buy them quick enough. 

 

 

I'm sure you're right and they'll make a good profit over the years.

I haven't bought one as I don't like the design. I don't particularly like the look of proofs either.

The only Elizabeth sovereign I'd buy other than the Gillicks, which I like, is the 1989 - because it's a gorgeous design. I just wish it was available in bullion strike.

Edited September 22, 2022 by SidS

[GoldDiggerDave]

5 minutes ago, SidS said:

I'm sure you're right and they'll make a good profit over the years.

I haven't bought one as I don't like the design. I don't particularly like the look of proofs either.

The only Elizabeth sovereign I'd buy other than the Gillicks, which I like, is the 1989 - because it's a gorgeous design. I just wish it was available in bullion strike.

Mate I’ve been saying this for years……the Gillicks are way under valued.  I just love the finish on these coins they have a stunning almost satin finish and you can pick good ones up for not much premium over the bullion price.  
 

Don’t get me wrong I was not balled over at first with the 2022 design, not the coat of arms just the c rappy RM digital laxer cut dies, as they are very flat in comparison, look at any sovereign pre 2019, you can see which ones have been hand crafted and the ones that are laser cut. 

[westminstrel]

8 hours ago, SidS said:

I've kept out of this so far, but I prefer the proper proof sovereigns, I wouldn't want the piedforts - too far removed from proper coins. Too much like a medal.

I get the whole more metal for your money argument, but if it's not the metal you're after and more just plain sovereigns for a date/type set then I completely get it. It's the same reason the 1937 and 1989 sovereigns command much higher premiums than the doubles of those dates. It's your numismatists driving up the price, not your bullion stackers.

 

3 hours ago, Stuntman said:

Completely agree with @SidS rationale above.  Exactly that.  

The standard proof sovereign will be the coin that the sovereign collectors want to own.  The piedfort is a bit of a johnny-come lately, and if we're talking about the recently issued matte finished 2022 piedforts, they are Brilliant Uncirculated and not proof (assuming they were struck to the same standard as my five sovereign piece).

EDIT: after scrolling back to the early pages of this thread, I see that the piedfort is indeed a proof coin - but my overall point still stands.

Basically the proof sovereign appeals to the dedicated sovereign collector in a way that the piedfort does not.

I don't collect proof sovereigns and I have no desire to own a piedfort, so my own interest is moot 😄

I‘ve always assumed Sovereign collectors are willing to pay higher premiums for the single vs double because, to a certain extent, the difference in diameters can make the double seem out of place.

However the piedfort is the same diameter as the regular, and both have the same proof strike and edge milling, so given a choice between £1,000 vs £1,400 for the 2022 regular vs piedfort, the choice for me would’ve been obvious.

To each their own though… 🙂