Platinum learning…

[lst65]

So…after an email from the RM I took a look at a lovely platinum coin for 2022. Oh yes I thought, looks good and let’s go for the investment….until I looked at the checkout and saw that VAT was added..! Cancel cancel!

Still learning..! 

[Pete]

Many of us learned the hard way so you are not alone.
I get royally pi$$ed-off by some of our UK dealers tempting us with headline prices; only you need to be buying £100k worth of PM and if silver or platinum add 20% VAT on top.
They might as well advertise coins at SPOT then at checkout add their margins, shipping and VAT in several stages.
The budget airlines were renowned for this - ticket price then add all the add-ons essentially doubling the headline price.
The government outlawed this as misleading but that little word "from" is a workaround with coins and bars.
 

[James32]

Just bought my first 1oz platinum coin over a month ago, got it at a fair price on here compared to dealers. 

Very surreal in hand compared to silver and even gold.

If there was no vat I'd buy a lot more ( got shafted enough with silver over the years) but I'm happy to wait on deals popping up on here. 

[SilverPlatinum]

They need to make all precious metals free from any taxes, VAT, duties, etc.

It's the real money.......

Talk (or yell) at your political party when they call you to get your vote......

[Alex944]

13 hours ago, James32 said:

Very surreal in hand compared to silver and even gold.

I have considered getting some form of Platinum (probably 1/10oz) though the high premiums + VAT bothers me a bit. Haven't had it in hand before (in a pure form anyway), what makes the feel surreal compared to silver and gold?

[James32]

3 minutes ago, Alex944 said:

I have considered getting some form of Platinum (probably 1/10oz) though the high premiums + VAT bothers me a bit. Haven't had it in hand before (in a pure form anyway), what makes the feel surreal compared to silver and gold?

It looks like silver but because its denser, it's substantially smaller in diameter and thinner.

Up to that point I was used to holding 1oz silver coins and then when I held gold it was heavier ( made the gold price bareable lol) but then when I looked at and felt 1oz of platinum it kind of was hard to take in at first,it's slightly smaller and thinner than gold too.

Not sure you will experience what I'm describing though with 1/10ths, my advice is save up your platinum allowance and buy a 1oz on here for around the £920 mark.

A 1/10 will cost you £120ish so an ounce in that format will eventually cost you £1200.

Buy once cry once lol.

[Alex944]

Thanks James, that's quite interesting. Think the 1oz is too pricy for me at this stage that's why I was looking at fractionals. Appreciate your input!

[James32]

4 hours ago, Alex944 said:

Thanks James, that's quite interesting. Think the 1oz is too pricy for me at this stage that's why I was looking at fractionals. Appreciate your input!

@Petra currently has a 1/10 up on the sales page 

[LawrenceChard]

19 hours ago, Pete said:

Many of us learned the hard way so you are not alone.
I get royally pi$$ed-off by some of our UK dealers tempting us with headline prices; only you need to be buying £100k worth of PM and if silver or platinum add 20% VAT on top.
They might as well advertise coins at SPOT then at checkout add their margins, shipping and VAT in several stages.
The budget airlines were renowned for this - ticket price then add all the add-ons essentially doubling the headline price.
The government outlawed this as misleading but that little word "from" is a workaround with coins and bars.
 

Because most dealers have quantity price breaks on bullion coins and bars, the use of "from" is often legitimate and useful.

Quoting prices exclusive of VAT is generally misleading, especially if aimed at UK / EU customers.

The budget airline example is a good one, I can visualise it now:

One Ounce Silver Coins / Bars. 

RyanGold Price only £0.99

Book now...

Silver per ounce	£17.24
Manufacturing charge	£2.99
RyanGold handling	£0.99
Booking charge	£4.99
Priority shipping	£4.99
Postage and packing	£4.99
Credit / debit card charge	£2.99
Subtotal	£39.18
VAT	£7.84
Total	£47.02

Only 3 available at this low price!

😎

 

 

 

[Stu]

1 hour ago, LawrenceChard said:

Because most dealers have quantity price breaks on bullion coins and bars, the use of "from" is often legitimate and useful.

Quoting prices exclusive of VAT is generally misleading, especially if aimed at UK / EU customers.

The budget airline example is a good one, I can visualise it now:

One Ounce Silver Coins / Bars. 

RyanGold Price only £0.99

Book now...

Silver per ounce	£17.24
Manufacturing charge	£2.99
RyanGold handling	£0.99
Booking charge	£4.99
Priority shipping	£4.99
Postage and packing	£4.99
Credit / debit card charge	£2.99
Subtotal	£39.18
VAT	£7.84
Total	£47.02

Only 3 available at this low price!

😎

 

 

 

Can I take 4 mate, with capsules! Do u gift wrap also and don’t spare the chocolate “complementary” coins either!

[LawrenceChard]

3 minutes ago, Stu said:

Can I take 4 mate, with capsules! Do u gift wrap also and don’t spare the chocolate “complementary” coins either!

You be expecting to take luggage and skis next!

 

[Pete]

4 minutes ago, LawrenceChard said:

You be expecting to take luggage and skis next!

 

It hurts when it costs as much to take skis with some airlines ( EasyJet jumps out at me ) as the cost of the flight.
Swiss air doesn't charge for ski carriage so that's who I used recently even if it meant travelling from Heathrow but that was super as the airport was deserted due to Covid.

There was a great comedy series on BBC " Come Fly With Me " where they imitated 'Stelios' of EasyJet and there was a scene where in the event of an emergency landing on water, to obtain your lifejacket you had to swipe your credit card in the seat facing you where there was a card reader. Even 'O'Leary' was thinking about charging  a couple of quid to use the toilet on board.

[Alex944]

1 hour ago, James32 said:

@Petra currently has a 1/10 up on the sales page 

Appreciate that James, thanks. Platinum purchases off of the forum are off limits for me for now. Pesky Irish customs and their customer charges + handling fees will add an easy £20-£30 to the cost. Fine for collectables to me but not really for bullion.

[LawrenceChard]

2 minutes ago, Pete said:

It hurts when it costs as much to take skis with some airlines ( EasyJet jumps out at me ) as the cost of the flight.
Swiss air doesn't charge for ski carriage so that's who I used recently even if it meant travelling from Heathrow but that was super as the airport was deserted due to Covid.

There was a great comedy series on BBC " Come Fly With Me " where they imitated 'Stelios' of EasyJet and there was a scene where in the event of an emergency landing on water, to obtain your lifejacket you had to swipe your credit card in the seat facing you where there was a card reader. Even 'O'Leary' was thinking about charging  a couple of quid to use the toilet on board.

Yes, Swiss do free ski carriage, but only or mainly from London which is a PITA for me, and they still work out more than many.

Swiss is now part of Lufthansa, part of Star Alliance. IMO they are often worth the slight extra for Frankfurt, Munich, and a few other German airports, compared with the "budgets".

I read that many of the OLeary stuff were publicity stunts.

[ArgentSmith]

38 minutes ago, Pete said:

There was a great comedy series on BBC " Come Fly With Me " where they imitated 'Stelios' of EasyJet and there was a scene where in the event of an emergency landing on water, to obtain your lifejacket you had to swipe your credit card in the seat facing you where there was a card reader. Even 'O'Leary' was thinking about charging  a couple of quid to use the toilet on board.

 

[LawrenceChard]

On 15/02/2022 at 18:51, lst65 said:

So…after an email from the RM I took a look at a lovely platinum coin for 2022. Oh yes I thought, looks good and let’s go for the investment….until I looked at the checkout and saw that VAT was added..! Cancel cancel!

Still learning..! 

Investment gold is the only precious metal which escapes VAT in the UK and EU.

Silver, platinum and palladium attract VAT. This mainly explains why my company does not hype investment in physical metals except gold, although otherwise I like silver and platinum.

Fractional sizes cost proportionally more to produce than larger (ounce) sizes, and sell in lower volumes, which makes them uneconomic for investors.

Combine fractional sizes with VATable, and it makes things worse.

There are some exceptions. If you are happy to store offshore, VAT can be avoided, but there are storage costs, and you don't get to touch your own stuff, but it works for larger, wealthier, investors.

Of course, if you can buy secondary market, it can help. 

Since 2000, I have been vocal in trying to encourage the Royal Mint to improve the transparency and accuracy of its advertising, and reduce the misleading content. The possibly does not endear me to the Royal Mint.

😎