If silver goes to £28 per ounce like 2011

[Troy77]

On 14/05/2020 at 14:06, pyperb said:

Yes Abyss, I am on silver stacking (got some brits from your good self) my stack is 250oz but turning my thoughts to gold now, although every time someone posts silverbrits in the selling forum I am always tempted but must stay focused as I need some gold now, I am also looking at cryptos, if over the next few months I end up with

250 oz silver

5 oz gold

few grand of Bitcoin / altcoins

I think I will be in a good position over these testing times and try build from that foundation as HawkHybrid has suggested

 

[freefall]

It could be that in the near future some of the guys ruing their decision to buy silver will be wishing they'd bought more. Buying anything with a high premium over its market value is going to result in diminished gains or even a significant loss. So buy cheap and if the initial reasons why you invested are still valid then hold on in there.

[Pete]

5 minutes ago, freefall said:

It could be that in the near future some of the guys ruing their decision to buy silver will be wishing they'd bought more. Buying anything with a high premium over its market value is going to result in diminished gains or even a significant loss. So buy cheap and if the initial reasons why you invested are still valid then hold on in there.

" Buying anything with a high premium over its market value is going to result in diminished gains or even a significant loss"

Just wonder where this statement originated !! Haha

The "market value" is I am afraid the "premium".
If you meant "premium over spot" ( i.e. scrap melt value ) then that's a totally different story.

 

[Rocky2000]

On 13/05/2020 at 23:06, silverdocket said:

Everyone who can afford it because that's when the panic kicks in. 

Most won't be able to afford gold.

When the property crash comes people will run to precious metals.

History always repeats itself.

 

Yes where else do people run to?

 

when the house price crash is picking up speed and currency starts to fall, stocks bonds everything falling, banks collapse all the cash under the mattresses is looking for somewhere safe, where else apart from PMs?
 

there is fine art, or rare musical instruments but seriously who wants to risk those things? Not me I have no idea about such things.

[GoldElliott]

Reading everyone's comments on here it is clear why Gold has outperformed Silver imo.

People are hoping for a speculative rise in Silver, viewing it as a poor investment with limited intrinsic value.

People believe that Gold is a good investment and a sure hedge against uncertainty.

If the only thing driving the Silver price is FOMO and pure speculative pressure then it is by definition not a good investment. Doesn't mean to say there isn't money to be made trading silver. Since silver was removed from coinage there has been little use for it as a store of value. Gold on the other hand has and always will be in demand by central banks/ investors/ stackers.

I see Silver as the Bitcoin style investment- sure you might flip it all one day and buy yourself a Lambo, but more than likely you'll end up lumbered with a useless investment that you'll struggle to get your money back on.

Gold is like buying property- you're unlikely to get super super rich off it (unless you bought years and years ago), but you'll always have an asset that is in demand and should look after you into your old age.

[Rocky2000]

1 minute ago, GoldElliott said:

Reading everyone's comments on here it is clear why Gold has outperformed Silver imo.

People are hoping for a speculative rise in Silver, viewing it as a poor investment with limited intrinsic value.

People believe that Gold is a good investment and a sure hedge against uncertainty.

If the only thing driving the Silver price is FOMO and pure speculative pressure then it is by definition not a good investment. Doesn't mean to say there isn't money to be made trading silver. Since silver was removed from coinage there has been little use for it as a store of value. Gold on the other hand has and always will be in demand by central banks/ investors/ stackers.

I see Silver as the Bitcoin style investment- sure you might flip it all one day and buy yourself a Lambo, but more than likely you'll end up lumbered with a useless investment that you'll struggle to get your money back on.

Gold is like buying property- you're unlikely to get super super rich off it (unless you bought years and years ago), but you'll always have an asset that is in demand and should look after you into your old age.

Strongly disagree

 

you could easily swap gold and silver round in what you said there 

[Pete]

6 minutes ago, Rocky2000 said:

when the house price crash is picking up speed and currency starts to fall, stocks bonds everything falling, banks collapse all the cash under the mattresses is looking for somewhere safe, where else apart from PMs?
 

there is fine art, or rare musical instruments but seriously who wants to risk those things? Not me I have no idea about such things.

Guns and ammo if we reach this stage because you will need to protect & defend what little you have left from those that want your food and toilet rolls.

[GoldElliott]

1 minute ago, Rocky2000 said:

Strongly disagree

 

you could easily swap gold and silver round in what you said there 

Gold is up <5% this week, Silver up >10%

 

[Rocky2000]

Just now, GoldElliott said:

Gold is up <5% this week, Silver up >10%

 

Yep, gold is over double it’s 1979 high, silver not even half yet

[freefall]

11 minutes ago, Pete said:

" Buying anything with a high premium over its market value is going to result in diminished gains or even a significant loss"

Just wonder where this statement originated !! Haha

The "market value" is I am afraid the "premium".
If you meant "premium over spot" ( i.e. scrap melt value ) then that's a totally different story.

 

Obviously its difficult to get silver at the spot price. But you should aim to get it as near as. I bought all my all my silver (1oz britania's, maples and kangaroos) at roughly 20-25% over spot from Europe. Buying the same now would incur a much higher premium. I bought in bulk before the rush which is an easy thing to say in hindsight I know. I wouldn't buy any right now due to the uphill battle in recovering the current premium.

[GoldElliott]

6 minutes ago, Rocky2000 said:

Yep, gold is over double it’s 1979 high, silver not even half yet

Thats exactly my point- in the long term you are much better off buying gold, but if you're trading on short time frames e.g. from 2008-2011 you can make money trading silver. Fundamentally gold is the better investment, but successful speculators (or lucky people) who buy the dip and sell at the peak can make lots of money from silver.

Edited May 16, 2020 by GoldElliott

[Rocky2000]

1 minute ago, GoldElliott said:

Thats exactly my point- in the long term you are much better off buying gold, but if you're trading on short term frames e.g. from 2008-2011 you can make money trading silver. Fundamentally gold is the better investment, but successful speculators (or lucky people) who buy the dip and sell at the peak can make lots of money from silver.

You are saying the GSR will go up even more from here?

 

i find it easier to believe it will come down as silver outperforms gold but they both go up as currency comes down 

[GoldElliott]

1 minute ago, Rocky2000 said:

You are saying the GSR will go up even more from here?

 

i find it easier to believe it will come down as silver outperforms gold but they both go up as currency comes down 

I dont think there is any real use for the GSR. They are 2 different assets and not very closely correlated.

Over a long time horizon gold has been (and I think will continue to be) a better investment. Demand from central banks is only increasing for gold. Silver has not really increased over the last 100 years- but it's had periods of rapid growth followed by retractions. If you are a 'day trader' type then speculate on silver. If you are planning for your retirement then stack gold.

Personally, I couldn't put my life (or a lot of my money) on silver being worth more when I retire in 30-40 years than it is now, but I'd be confident in making that bet for gold.

[Pete]

1 minute ago, freefall said:

Obviously its difficult to get silver at the spot price. But you should aim to get it as near as. I bought all my all my silver (1oz britania's, maples and kangaroos) at roughly 20-25% over spot from Europe. Buying the same now would incur a much higher premium. I bought in bulk before the rush which is an easy thing to say in hindsight I know. I wouldn't buy any right now due to the uphill battle in recovering the current premium.

Obviously its difficult impossible to get silver at the spot price unless you are a dealer buying silver.

Most of the seasoned stackers here also bought at the differential VAT rate from Europe.
Market value remains what people are prepared to pay and driven by demand.
Agreed prices have risen whilst spot has not, so yes premiums have shot up BUT that's the same thing as current market value.

In hindsight I should not have piled in when spot was hovering around £30 per ounce in the fall of 2011 ( but it was forecast to rise way beyond this price ) and I should have double piled in when silver ounce coins were around £12 in early 2016.

This is a volatile investment and will work when you are lucky enough to buy cheap and prices rise but unfortunately there are no guarantees or safety nets to protect you agains dramatic falls. There is also no point in looking at charts and trying to extrapolate the curve. Many of us have done this but maybe not admitting so. It's like avoiding picking lottery numbers avoiding those than won last week reckoning they cannot appear so soon.

You are fortunate that you bought in bulk when you did.
Just be careful now and don't loose your shirt buying gold because my genie outside the bottle is getting nervous about the long term price reckoning a lot of profit taking will kick in once we have overcome Covid -19

[Rocky2000]

7 minutes ago, GoldElliott said:

I dont think there is any real use for the GSR. They are 2 different assets and not very closely correlated.

Over a long time horizon gold has been (and I think will continue to be) a better investment. Demand from central banks is only increasing for gold. Silver has not really increased over the last 100 years- but it's had periods of rapid growth followed by retractions. If you are a 'day trader' type then speculate on silver. If you are planning for your retirement then stack gold.

Personally, I couldn't put my life (or a lot of my money) on silver being worth more when I retire in 30-40 years than it is now, but I'd be confident in making that bet for gold.

You really think there is more chance of the GSR going up even more from here than coming down?

 

im amazed anybody could think this

[GoldElliott]

2 minutes ago, Pete said:

Obviously its difficult impossible to get silver at the spot price unless you are a dealer buying silver.

90% of my silver is in pre-decimals (mostly .500) purchased at/ below spot. A lot of world silvers can be picked up around spot and certainly a lot less than any .999 coin.

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2 minutes ago, Rocky2000 said:

You really think there is more chance of the GSR going up even more from here than coming down?

 

im amazed anybody could think this

In 50 years time yes.

[Rocky2000]

2 minutes ago, GoldElliott said:

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In 50 years time yes.

You think for the next 50yrs the GSR will stay at 5000yr highs?

[Pete]

1 minute ago, GoldElliott said:

90% of my silver is in pre-decimals (mostly .500) purchased at/ below spot. A lot of world silvers can be picked up around spot and certainly a lot less than any .999 coin.

Watching the Discovery channel on TV I also reckon you can get silver and gold below spot but you only get a couple of grams per metric tonne of dirt & rocks.
You are absolutely correct in that you can buy silver at spot mixed with other metals but per weight of silver you will not sell it any higher either.
Having sold gold last year I was able to get a marginally higher price for 24ct Britannias compared to 22ct Brits.
Not sure how to value your 0.500 silver unless some of it is collectable rather than just gross weight.

[GoldElliott]

Just now, Rocky2000 said:

You think for the next 50yrs the GSR will stay at 5000yr highs?

probably. I just dont see anything driving up the value of silver in the long term. Im sure it will go on bull runs, reducing the GSR massively as it does so, but silver is not scarce, used in coinage, not very desirable in jewelry anymore, in demand by countries or central banks, irreplaceable in industry etc. Plenty of thing drive the price of an asset up such as speculation, but I personally can't see anything that will drive up the value of silver.

I hope silver goes to £50/oz and like many on here would do well if it did just my thoughts- I'm not a fortune teller

[Rocky2000]

1 minute ago, GoldElliott said:

probably. I just dont see anything driving up the value of silver in the long term. Im sure it will go on bull runs, reducing the GSR massively as it does so, but silver is not scarce, used in coinage, not very desirable in jewelry anymore, in demand by countries or central banks, irreplaceable in industry etc. Plenty of thing drive the price of an asset up such as speculation, but I personally can't see anything that will drive up the value of silver.

I hope silver goes to £50/oz and like many on here would do well if it did just my thoughts- I'm not a fortune teller

“I personally can't see anything that will drive up the value of silver.”

 

what about a financial collapse of epic proportions?

[GoldElliott]

1 minute ago, Pete said:

Watching the Discovery channel on TV I also reckon you can get silver and gold below spot but you only get a couple of grams per metric tonne of dirt & rocks.
You are absolutely correct in that you can buy silver at spot mixed with other metals but per weight of silver you will not sell it any higher either.
Having sold gold last year I was able to get a marginally higher price for 24ct Britannias compared to 22ct Brits.
Not sure how to value your 0.500 silver unless some of it is collectable rather than just gross weight.

Well if you are dealing on spot (rather than premiums) then .500 makes the most sense IMO.

If you can buy at 90% of spot (I have sold on here and facebook about that and notice that there is currently .500 for sale here under spot) and can sell at around 88% of spot to a dealer such as HGM, plusgold.com etc. (and more on ebay), then you are in effect trading in line with spot price- not in nominal value but in terms of percentage movement.

As such, any movement in spot directly (and proportionately) affects the value of your stack as no premiums are involved in buying or selling.

[GoldElliott]

4 minutes ago, Rocky2000 said:

“I personally can't see anything that will drive up the value of silver.”

 

what about a financial collapse of epic proportions?

you are talking in terms of GSR aka silver relative to gold. If a financial collapse happens, sure silver will increase in price but gold will increase in price more. Were currently experiencing the greatest economic retraction (in GDP) for hundreds of years... silver is up less than 5% since 6 months ago before this happened. By your logic it should be much higher!

Over that same 6 month period, gold is up over 25%

[Rocky2000]

4 minutes ago, GoldElliott said:

you are talking in terms of GSR aka silver relative to gold. If a financial collapse happens, sure silver will increase in price but gold will increase in price more. Were currently experiencing the greatest economic retraction (in GDP) for hundreds of years... silver is up less than 5% since 6 months ago before this happened. By your logic it should be much higher!

Over that same 6 month period, gold is up over 25%

We will have to agree to disagree 

 

the manipulation has to end for silver to correct to true value, I can see a big reset when this thing plays out

[GoldElliott]

10 minutes ago, Rocky2000 said:

We will have to agree to disagree 

 

the manipulation has to end for silver to correct to true value, I can see a big reset when this thing plays out

I hope your right Ill happily part with my silver if it goes to £28 per oz or higher

[pyperb]

I've been hearing of resets and if that happens both gold and silver bugs will do well